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Old 07-07-2013, 02:30 PM   #1
Boosted Tuning
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Default Should road dyno charts show more then 1 run?

So, how do you guys feel about this topic?

On the EVO forums, more and more people are showing multiple runs when sharing results. Since these software road dynos can throw out fluke numbers from time to time, it seems that using multiple runs to show that power is consistent and not a fluke is a great way to have more accuracy in these road dynos.

Also, this thread is meant to be a friendly conversation on the topic. No VD/Road dyno hating. No Airboy vs Virtual Dyno. If you hate road dynos or dynos in general, go make a different thread bout it. If you wanna debate Airboy vs Virtual Dyno, go make a different thread about it.
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Last edited by Boosted Tuning; 07-07-2013 at 10:46 PM.
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Old 07-07-2013, 02:43 PM   #2
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+1 . Also use at least smoothing 3.
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Old 07-07-2013, 02:58 PM   #3
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We should just quote numbers on our delta over stock or delta after x or y mods.

I could careless about numbers, 1/4mi times and traps as well as 50-100mph, 60-130mph with a pbox are worth talking about, not dynos and settings.
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Old 07-07-2013, 03:09 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CatfaceType-R View Post
We should just quote numbers on our delta over stock or delta after x or y mods.

I could careless about numbers, 1/4mi times and traps as well as 50-100mph, 60-130mph with a pbox are worth talking about, not dynos and settings.
Sometimes people bring in cars with mods like turbos, injectors, etc already bolted on but no tuning done. On these cars, no baseline pulls can really be done, because it can be dangerous to go WOT on untuned setups. So you cant always get a baseline to show the delta.

1/4 et and traps are king, but not everyone has access to a drag strip and not everyone can drive good enough to make the car reach its 100% potential at the strip.

I could care less bout XX-XXXmph. I know euro/exotic guys use that scaling/testing, but I never have, so to me its totally useless.
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Old 07-07-2013, 03:12 PM   #5
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when i was into Audis what they used a lot were a program called FAT times. in a nutshell it would time you from a certain speed or gear, unit redline or a certain MPH. worked pretty well giving actual data unlike the virtual dynos where numbers can be fudged a littler here and there.
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Old 07-07-2013, 03:17 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Daggernomad55555 View Post
+1 . Also use at least smoothing 3.
I agree show one more than one run.

I have found some issues when using VD with different loggers. I don't know if is because my car is too fast for the logger or maybe there is other issues. If I use romrider I get higher numbers than with the cobb logger, If I use fast polling with romrider vs no polling I get different number. I don't know which software should I use to get realistic numbers.

I found myself going back to the all trusty Airboy , my road dynos seem more consistent.

Also a V-box is a fine way to measure a car performance but any other GPS performance meter with refresh rate of 10hz will work just as well. Racelogic is overpriced crap...
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Old 07-07-2013, 03:39 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by juanmedina View Post
I agree show one more than one run.

I have found some issues when using VD with different loggers. I don't know if is because my car is too fast for the logger or maybe there is other issues. If I use romrider I get higher numbers than with the cobb logger, If I use fast polling with romrider vs no polling I get different number. I don't know which software should I use to get realistic numbers.

I found myself going back to the all trusty Airboy , my road dynos seem more consistent.

Also a V-box is a fine way to measure a car performance but any other GPS performance meter with refresh rate of 10hz will work just as well. Racelogic is overpriced crap...
Well, its just like any form of measurement, just always use the same scale ie same settings.

Even with airboy, I think showing multiple pulls should be shown.
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Old 07-07-2013, 03:45 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Boosted Tuning View Post
Well, its just like any form of measurement, just always use the same scale ie same settings.

Even with airboy, I think showing multiple pulls should be shown.
I have no problem showing multiple pulls. But the variance between using different loggers on the same car, same road, same day, is an issue. Like I said in my case my car shows higher number when I use RR vs Cobb with VD. My point is unrelated but people should be aware of this issue.

Anyway, I agree 100% multiple runs should be shown.
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Old 07-07-2013, 06:12 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by juanmedina View Post
I agree show one more than one run.

I have found some issues when using VD with different loggers. I don't know if is because my car is too fast for the logger or maybe there is other issues. If I use romrider I get higher numbers than with the cobb logger, If I use fast polling with romrider vs no polling I get different number. I don't know which software should I use to get realistic numbers.

I found myself going back to the all trusty Airboy , my road dynos seem more consistent.

Also a V-box is a fine way to measure a car performance but any other GPS performance meter with refresh rate of 10hz will work just as well. Racelogic is overpriced crap...
Accurate, consistent, and repeatable crap but crap nonetheless... You get what you pay for but most enthusiasts don't need what you get nor do the wanna pay for it.
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Old 07-07-2013, 07:47 PM   #10
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There really is no end all way to compare cars and performance cause there is human user error in all aspects. Even 1/4 miles times. Same car with 2 different drivers can run a 13 and an 11. I feel with accurate data airboy is the most reliable and consistent. The few times I've used I've been +/-10whp from my dynojet graph. Some people hate airboy. Lol
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Old 07-07-2013, 07:54 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Slimsti View Post
There really is no end all way to compare cars and performance cause there is human user error in all aspects. Even 1/4 miles times. Same car with 2 different drivers can run a 13 and an 11. I feel with accurate data airboy is the most reliable and consistent. The few times I've used I've been +/-10whp from my dynojet graph. Some people hate airboy. Lol
This thread isnt about VD vs airboy (there are plenty of those threads). Its about when using those road dyno programs and posting results, should people post multiple runs to show its not a road dyno software fluke.

Last edited by Boosted Tuning; 07-07-2013 at 10:44 PM. Reason: spelling/removed VD vs AB bs
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Old 07-07-2013, 07:56 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by juanmedina View Post
I have no problem showing multiple pulls. But the variance between using different loggers on the same car, same road, same day, is an issue. Like I said in my case my car shows higher number when I use RR vs Cobb with VD. My point is unrelated but people should be aware of this issue.

Anyway, I agree 100% multiple runs should be shown.
But why use different loggers on the same car? Just always use one or the other, with the same settings.

This issue your bringing up is moot, because even on a real dyno, you can change settings and get different numbers. Long as you always use the same measuring tool, with the same settings, it will be fine, regardless of VD, Airboy or real dyno.

Last edited by Boosted Tuning; 07-07-2013 at 08:18 PM. Reason: grammar
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Old 07-07-2013, 10:30 PM   #13
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What is going on near 5250rpm? The Blue curve shows more torque but the power curve is the same as the Red curve.

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Old 07-07-2013, 10:41 PM   #14
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^ This isnt a VD vs Airboy thread. Start another thread if you wanna talk about that.

To answer your question though, I think that is just due to the way the program smooths the plot and how it averages the data points.

Last edited by Boosted Tuning; 07-07-2013 at 10:47 PM.
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Old 07-07-2013, 11:25 PM   #15
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Than.
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Old 07-07-2013, 11:30 PM   #16
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Ah my bad I didn't realise. I def think so. Theres so many variables when taking a log. Sometimes the logger can act up and sometimes the road isn't perfectly flat. 3 pulls in the "same" area should suffice I'd say. Just to see a consistency and that its not a fluke or glitch
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Old 07-08-2013, 07:21 PM   #17
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Accurate, consistent, and repeatable crap but crap nonetheless... You get what you pay for but most enthusiasts don't need what you get nor do the wanna pay for it.
Kelly, is expensive crap compared to other crap that will perform just as accurate, consistent and repeatable for less money.

Look at Qstarz box, it looks awesome, smaller package, way better design and color display. With many many more features that a V-box...

Have you look at the new Racelogic Sport? higher price than the Qstarz, no display and it can only be used with an Iphone . Higher refresh rate but 10hz is all is need it.
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Old 07-08-2013, 07:53 PM   #18
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same can be said for dyno charts too....they rarely have more than 1 pull.

and there are poblems with the loggers scrambling rpms (especially 16bit cars), fast polling, and the lack of data points with an AP.

In the end, either you trust the person or you dont. If someone is going to fake a dyno pull....its just as easy to fake 2.
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Old 07-08-2013, 08:09 PM   #19
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Originally Posted by PhatBotti Tuning TKR View Post
same can be said for dyno charts too....they rarely have more than 1 pull.

and there are poblems with the loggers scrambling rpms (especially 16bit cars), fast polling, and the lack of data points with an AP.

In the end, either you trust the person or you dont. If someone is going to fake a dyno pull....its just as easy to fake 2.
True. I think the practice of showing mutli runs should be done on real dynos also, because its easy to have one hail mary run.
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Old 07-08-2013, 08:15 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Daggernomad55555 View Post
+1 . Also use at least smoothing 3.
blanket smoothings dont work. An AP log will get you 12-25 data points depending on which gear/redline you use. A RR fast polling log can get you 160 data points.

But having a convention like we did in the old road dyno thread for airboy would work. IE, for aa-bb data points use 3, for cc-dd use 4, etc etc.
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Old 07-08-2013, 08:21 PM   #21
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The Qstarz LT-Q6000 does look nice and its not bad for $439.00.

What features does it have that the V-box doesn't? I may look into it whenever I get my car track worthy again.
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Old 07-08-2013, 09:01 PM   #22
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The Qstarz LT-Q6000 does look nice and its not bad for $439.00.

What features does it have that the V-box doesn't? I may look into it whenever I get my car track worthy again.
You should read the online manual is very extensive . One cool feature that I like is that you can create a custom test range right there on the fly. For instance a 20-40mph test or whatever test you want. Then you can do multiple test and it will compare them right there in color . Is also waterproof

Oh an look online you can get them for 400 including the mounting bracket.
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