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Old 07-03-2013, 01:31 PM   #7426
Maxwell Power
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Dom, good information, thank you. That helps explain a lot.
Anytime.
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Old 07-05-2013, 08:57 AM   #7427
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Big up Dom.
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Old 07-05-2013, 10:21 AM   #7428
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Anytime.
I can't help but think your last name is Toretto
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Old 07-05-2013, 10:35 AM   #7429
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well, its kinda a moot point on many roms/tunes.....the small ipw table isnt in OS or any of the 16bit ecus. so you cant utilize it anyway.

and even when it is there, ID is the only company that actually has this data available.

and it also depends on which rom you're starting with as to how much the tune will suffer without tuning it since the stock tables can be very different on sidefeed vs tf cars or 420 vs 505 vs 550cc
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Old 07-06-2013, 11:42 AM   #7430
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Well i am still not happy with my id1000 idc even after adding the walbro 465 e85 pump and hardwirinig it they are in the safe zone now but still to high for me like high 80's low 90's at stock base pressure and 27-28psi on my 20g. The fact that my local station is pushing e90 and my injectors are flowing 900cc i thought it time to get a fpr. I got a cheap 1:1 rising fpr from summit with all new barb fittings and i plan on bumping it to around 55psi base pressure and things will be much better i hope. Does anyone know any good install how to's for installing the fpr on a 08+ platform or atleast show what lines go to what?
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Old 07-06-2013, 06:49 PM   #7431
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90% is fine with the ID1000, they are actually good at 95% IDC at 8000 rpm's. If you want a bit of head room then get a Aeromotive, Fuel Lab or PnL FPR and crank your base pressure up to 55psi. You'll have plenty of headroom then. You'll probably want to have your tune tweaked for the added base pressure or you may run a bit rich and low pulse widths. Those ID1ks are plenty for your build and that turbo now especially that you have that pump.

My ID1ks are good into the mid 90's at 55psi base and 25psi boost on my Dom3.5/ 58 lb./ min. turbo and I have plenty of pump left. Same pump as you have and hardwired. I do have a very different motor than you. Yours is the stock EJ255 which I think is a great motor especially for E85 with the D25 heads and 8.55:1 CR. I have the same heads but well ported with big valves and a 9.6:1 CR with my MPS+2mm LR 2.5 block. I also have cams PnP'd intake mani and Killer B headers.

My ID 1300 testers are going in and I'll run some logs for Junior this week and put it back on the dyno at PnL on the 22nd. Junior gave me some maps with 50 psi base scaled for these 1300's. They should flow 1440cc's at that base and give me plenty of headroom and allow us to bump the boost back up to 28-29 psi on E85 and pick up some more ponies if all is well! I have the car on 93 pump right now with the ID1ks and it's making 23.5 psi boost in 3rd and 4th gear and feels very strong, my last VD graphs at this boost show it at around 440 WHP on the Dynojet setting.

Last edited by manitou; 07-06-2013 at 07:14 PM.
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Old 07-06-2013, 07:09 PM   #7432
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You definitely don't want to get rid of those ID1ks, the drive-ability/ low pulse width matching of the ID's are so good and you want some headroom but still keeping the injectors on the smaller side vs. a bigger injector that you may only use 50-70% of it's capacity! Keeping the injectors on the smaller side will give you the better drive-ability and not hold you back on the top end.

Last edited by manitou; 07-07-2013 at 09:09 AM.
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Old 07-06-2013, 07:27 PM   #7433
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Yes i dont want to get rid of the id1000 i love the way the feel and idle and drive like stock. That is why i got the fuel pressure regulator from summit so i can bump the pressure to get them to flow better since i now have plenty of pump. It may be a no name cheaper one but i made sure it was a rising rate by 1:1 ratio so every psi of boost it raises the pressure 1psi just like stock and the more expensive regulators. Only difference i hope is this one comes with all the fittings and also comes with a gauge to go with it and if it does not work well i will get a name brand and use the fittings from this on theres.

Im not being a jerk at all but have to ask are you sponcered by killer b because i always here you mention them as much as you can? I personally have kinugawa elh and 3 bolt uppipe which is the same as gtspec,tomei and a few others since they are all made in the smae place but branded different and love the way they perform.
I have a new block coming in on monday to start building for the future since i am pushing stock internals to the ragid edge. I plan on using cp pistons but wonder if i should to the 9.0:1 compression or the 8.2:1? I am going to primarily use e85 and am going to use the stock ej255 heads and dont plan on any cams or headwork. Reason being is my 4eat will only allow my car to redline at 6300rpm and wont go any further since the tcu shifts at that point no matter what.
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Old 07-06-2013, 07:35 PM   #7434
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Headers are like all other pipes on a turbo car. There is not one answer for everyone.

The basic concept of bigger pipe = slower spool and more topend pretty much applies to all pipes on a turbo car. Ie, u don't want to run 3" intercooler pipes, the biggest intercooler and an amr big header on a vf car. And u don't want to run small intercooler pipes and a small header on a big turbo car.
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Old 07-06-2013, 07:41 PM   #7435
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Yes you are dead on my spool suffered a bit but felt alot stronger in the topend. I personally like the way the make the car feel and actually prefer the sound of a elh imo makes it sound much smoother.
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Old 07-06-2013, 08:06 PM   #7436
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Originally Posted by xluben View Post
My setup was a 6266 at 30-32psi, Walbro 465, FiveO 1600's, 55psi base pressure and IDC's got up into the mid/high 90's. It's a 73lb/min turbo and it also seems like I was using a lot more fuel than you are. That's all I'm saying. I'm not attacking you. As for the injectors, there have been a lot of posts in the past about the ID 1000 injectors scaling like 900's. Or even like DW 850's. Maybe they had issues, who knows. It just seems to be a very common comment on those injectors. I know you have a little manufacturer's sheet that says they flow more, but it's a business after all. You need to take all advertisements with a grain of salt.

You were likely just out of pump. I am not sure what Five0 1600s consist of but a normal low z 1600 will flow enough for 800whp+ on e85 with the right fuel system.




Nate,

The KillerB HH works better then any other one I have ever tested or used. It spooled amazing on a vf and made great top end on a highcompression 600whp car... I would say that it does everything good.

On an auto car with the stock stall I would def run whatever can make the power band move to the left.

Jr
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Old 07-06-2013, 08:49 PM   #7437
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Originally Posted by nate_fisher View Post
Yes i dont want to get rid of the id1000 i love the way the feel and idle and drive like stock. That is why i got the fuel pressure regulator from summit so i can bump the pressure to get them to flow better since i now have plenty of pump. It may be a no name cheaper one but i made sure it was a rising rate by 1:1 ratio so every psi of boost it raises the pressure 1psi just like stock and the more expensive regulators. Only difference i hope is this one comes with all the fittings and also comes with a gauge to go with it and if it does not work well i will get a name brand and use the fittings from this on theres.

Im not being a jerk at all but have to ask are you sponcered by killer b because i always here you mention them as much as you can? I personally have kinugawa elh and 3 bolt uppipe which is the same as gtspec,tomei and a few others since they are all made in the smae place but branded different and love the way they perform.
I have a new block coming in on monday to start building for the future since i am pushing stock internals to the ragid edge. I plan on using cp pistons but wonder if i should to the 9.0:1 compression or the 8.2:1? I am going to primarily use e85 and am going to use the stock ej255 heads and dont plan on any cams or headwork. Reason being is my 4eat will only allow my car to redline at 6300rpm and wont go any further since the tcu shifts at that point no matter what.
Nate, Chris at Killer B has taken care of me but I wouldn't call it a sponsorship. I am running his oil pan, pick up, windage tray, alternator cover, shift knob and of course the Holy Header! My buddy Angel Ortiz at HP Techs has sponsored me with great deals on the KB stuff I bought from him. Chris at KB is very accomodating when we needed some 321SS for the EWG on the up pipe he made it available. The workmanship and materials of the products is top shelf, the best! Mostly though like Junior said the headers just work, they are a great design, simple, the primaries are about as short as you can get for a Subaru, the 4:1 collector and the size of the tubing is also right for VF's and big turbos. That and they are bomb proof and guaranteed for life.

If you have good pump gas and you'll mostly be using E85 then I would consider the 9:1 CR. Our D25 heads (from the EJ255) do seem to work well with the high CR. I love my off boost response with the higher compression. I was driving around a bit today on pump and mostly out of boost, the gauge said 11 psi max but the car is peppy even at lower boost and it's amazing how usable 3rd gear is at lower speeds!

Allan

Last edited by manitou; 07-06-2013 at 09:01 PM.
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Old 07-06-2013, 09:43 PM   #7438
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Thanks for the info I am sure they are awesome headers and I plan on picking up there oil pick up when I swap in my built motor. can anyone give me any tips for installing a fpr or any links on how to. It seems very strait forward on hose in from the rails and one return an then a boost source. Just want to know we're people are tying I'm from and which hose is which? I have done my own pumps and injectors but have never ventured into fpr territory on a Subaru yet.
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Old 07-06-2013, 10:03 PM   #7439
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Quote:
Originally Posted by manitou View Post
If you have good pump gas and you'll mostly be using E85 then I would consider the 9:1 CR. Our D25 heads (from the EJ255) do seem to work well with the high CR. I love my off boost response with the higher compression. I was driving around a bit today on pump and mostly out of boost, the gauge said 11 psi max but the car is peppy even at lower boost and it's amazing how usable 3rd gear is at lower speeds!

Allan

I also was very happy with my higher compression results. I was running just shy of 9.8:1CR on my bugeye with D25 heads, and it was extremely responsive in daily driving situations. It felt almost NA in off boost situations, and the best part about all of it was the mpg I was seeing on my high compression motor vs. my standard compression motor. I was seeing 2 mpg better across the board with the higher CR engine. I don't necessarily believe the higher compression actually achieved better fuel efficiency, but more that it made more wtq off boost vs the lower CR setup of the previous engine, which allowed me to not need as much go pedal to get the same "butt dyno" feeling around town.
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Old 07-06-2013, 10:29 PM   #7440
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Ok thanks my tuner said to get the higher compression pistons I was just seeing what everyone's setup and thought were. I am also wondering if it is ok to run high boost on stock map sensor? I am hitting roughly 27psi on my boost gauge and afr and knock is perfect but my logs all show 23.9 since that is the max. Is there any ill affect of running stock map sensor?
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Old 07-07-2013, 03:09 AM   #7441
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The ill effect is that your overboost fuel cut is disabled.
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Old 07-08-2013, 12:53 AM   #7442
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The ill effect is that your overboost fuel cut is disabled.
Mine hasn't blown up yet
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Old 07-15-2013, 11:07 AM   #7443
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Has anyone on here ever tried this stuff?

http://www.techafx.com/catalog/49

TechAFX

BlackWrap Braided SS PTFE Hose


BlackWrap Braided SS PTFE Hose (conductive core)Introducing NEW TechAFX BlackWrap. BlackWrap takes our durable, proven, PTFE conductive core Fuel Hose & dresses it up with a tough nylon outer layer. This outer layer increases the durability of the product, reduces noise, & looks KILLER! .................................................. ................ . ................................... Blackwrap features a tough, black nylon outer layer that increases the durability of the product, reduces noise, & looks KILLER! The nylon wrap covers a stainless steel braid and our class-leading smooth-bore, conductive core PTFE for excellent performance in demanding situations. .... ........................ ................ Conductive Core - There is a simple way to tell if you have 'conductive core' PTFE hose that has been specifically developed for use with fuel, is it 'black' on the inside? When fuel passes through PTFE hose, it generates a mild static charge. For this reason, a coating of carbon is added to the inside diameter of PTFE hose so when the fittings are attached to each end of the hose and the hose assembly installed on the vehicle, this static charge can harmlessly transfer to the common ground of the vehicle. This static charge will buildup in non-conductive PTFE hose--which is a dangerous situation. All TechAFX PTFE hose is conductive core. ............. Sizing - TechAFX BlackWrap is available in -6, -8 and -10 sizes and works with TechAFX AN fittings. . ................ . Chemical Resistance - The Chemical Resistant PTFE core is impervious to practically all commercial chemicals, acids, alcohols, coolants, elastomers, hydrocarbons, solvents, synthetic compounds and hydraulic fluids. ... Temperature - BlackWrap's PTFE core is highly temperature resistant. It can handle fluids used in cryogenics up to steam. The recommended temperature range for usages is from -65 F to 450 F. .................................... ................ High Flow Rates & Low Friction - Due to the anti-stick properties of the PTFE, you will not experience pressure drops from accumulate deposits on the inner core. .................................................. ........................... Flexible & Lightweight - TechAFX BlackWrap is easier to move, handle and install than rubber hose with a comparable burst pressure rating. BlackWrap can withstand continuous flexing and vibration without failure from flex fatigue........................................... .............. .................................................. ...... Moisture Resistant - TechAFX BlackWrap will no absorb moisture. So it is ideal as a pigtail in bulk gas handling and pneumatic systems where a low dew point is critical. ................................................ ....................... Chemically Inert - BlackWrap will not break down or deteriorate in service. .............................. ............... Non-Aging - BlackWrap is impervious to weather and can be stored for extended periods of time without aging. It will not age during service. ............................... ............................ ............................... ........ Shock Resistant - BlackWrap is not affected by continuous flexing,vibration or impulse pressures - it can withstand alternating hot and cold cycling. .... .................................. ....................... .............................. Background on PTFE - Polytetrafluoroethylene (PTFE) is an engineered fluoropolymer commonly known by DuPont's trade name "Teflon". Outstanding resistance to chemicals is one of it's primary attributes. A broad temperature range of -100F to 500F (-73C to 260C) make this hose core material suitable for the majority of fluid and ambient temperature conditions found in industry. An extremely low coefficient of friction, (0.05 to 0.20), provides a non-stick surface.Water absorption of PTFE is negligible, less than 0.01% by ASTM test. And, it is FDA-approved for food and pharmaceutical use. Smooth Bore PTFE hose is vertically extruded to maintain highest quality concentricity. BlackWrap is manufactured from DuPont's type 62 fine grade resin, encasing braided 304 stainless steel wire. An exact amount of carbon black added to the PTFE inner core provides continuous conductive path to the metal end fittings, to bleed off static electricity in steam or high flow rate applications. ....................... Specs: For continuous service: -65F to 450F (-54C to 232C) For intermittent service: -100F to 500F (-73C to 260C) Meets or exceeds requirements of SAE100R14. PTFE meets FDA 21 CCFR 177.1550 Sizes -4 thru -10 are rated for full vacuum.
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Old 07-15-2013, 11:09 AM   #7444
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Expensive
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Old 07-15-2013, 11:11 AM   #7445
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Expensive
Yeah, 13 bucks a foot. what i like is the outer cover "over" the stainless braiding. I think its still less than the goodrich 811 and 910 ptfe stuff.

Last edited by slowgenius; 07-15-2013 at 11:18 AM.
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Old 07-15-2013, 09:15 PM   #7446
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Anyone have an opinion on ID1000s vs FiveO 1000s vs FIC 900/1100s?

Are they all based off the Bosch EV14? If so, what would the advantages to each be (aside from the marketing talk on their individual websites)?

I'm looking to run a smaller injector like these now to idle properly on a VF37, with an upgrade to a rotated 30R on E85 in the future (which seems like it may necessitate an aftermarket FPR).
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Old 07-15-2013, 09:30 PM   #7447
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Anyone have an opinion on ID1000s vs FiveO 1000s vs FIC 900/1100s?

Are they all based off the Bosch EV14? If so, what would the advantages to each be (aside from the marketing talk on their individual websites)?

I'm looking to run a smaller injector like these now to idle properly on a VF37, with an upgrade to a rotated 30R on E85 in the future (which seems like it may necessitate an aftermarket FPR).
They're not the same, that's for sure! None are matched as well throughout the full spectrum of pulse widths like the ID's! They'll idle and cruise perfectly, respond well to pressure and make loads of power! I made 560 WHP on E85 and 55 psi base pressure with the ID1000's!
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Old 07-15-2013, 09:51 PM   #7448
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They're not the same, that's for sure! None are matched as well throughout the full spectrum of pulse widths like the ID's! They'll idle and cruise perfectly, respond well to pressure and make loads of power! I made 560 WHP on E85 and 55 psi base pressure with the ID1000's!
Wow, that's pretty impressive. I don't think I'll be going much higher than mid 400's, so that's good to hear. What was the rest of your fuel system like and what sort of IDCs did you have?

I found it interesting that FIC claims their 900's are the same as ID and FiveO 1000's. But, can anyone say what the base for all these injectors are? I know ID is using a Bosch EV14, and it would seem that FiveO is using the same. So what is modified to create a difference between IDs and FiveOs?

Thanks for reassuring me on the 1000s as having enough flow!
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Old 07-15-2013, 10:08 PM   #7449
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Wow, that's pretty impressive. I don't think I'll be going much higher than mid 400's, so that's good to hear. What was the rest of your fuel system like and what sort of IDCs did you have?

I found it interesting that FIC claims their 900's are the same as ID and FiveO 1000's. But, can anyone say what the base for all these injectors are? I know ID is using a Bosch EV14, and it would seem that FiveO is using the same. So what is modified to create a difference between IDs and FiveOs?

Thanks for reassuring me on the 1000s as having enough flow!
I'm not sure what the others do. I make 460 WHP on 93 pump at 70ish IDC's. You'll be fine for sure! I have a Walbro 465 E85 pump, 12 gauge hardwired through the stock FPC, an Aeromotive FPR and Perrin fuel rails, base is 55 psi. My IDC's were maxed, 100+ to get 560 whp on E85 at 27 psi. Junior backed off the boost to 25ish to lower the IDC's for the street. I've just switched to the new ID1300's and Jr is going to touch up my tune at PnL next Monday. So we'll see what they do for my build!

I hope Junior, Dom or Lance chimes on this topic. The thing with the ID's is how well matched they are, they do more testing and the best matching and balancing of anyone, maybe that's why they cost a little more. They just work!
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Old 07-16-2013, 05:44 PM   #7450
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You can't tell someone that they are better matched than anyone else just because you think they are or because their advertising says they are the best... That is not an accurate way of informing people. I personally can't vouch for five-O, but I can vouch for the other two. FIC and ID are both outstanding injector companies. I personally prefer FIC, but that is because I have personal experience with their customer service, their employees, and their injectors themselves. I have some limited experience with ID's, but not enough to say that one company is better than the other. Dom and I had this discussion not but a few pages back, and we came to an agreement or at least a truce on the fact that FIC does some pretty adequate testing and matching of their injectors.
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