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Old 05-29-2013, 11:06 AM   #726
Justin V
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After sifting through these 15 pages, this is the single most helpful post I found.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ride5000 View Post
simon: simplify the situation and reconnect stuff 1 thing at a time.

run hose from compressor to actuator and make sure the wg operates properly. this is your "min boost."

then put the MBC in the way and make sure IT operates properly. this is your "max boost."

then put the solenoid in the circuit. make sure that the two ports that flow when the thing is unplugged are the two you use to shunt around the mbc.

test drive the car and make sure that with 0% duty you get wastegate, and 100% duty you get mbc.

finally you can start tuning the rest of your part throttle boost targets.
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Old 05-29-2013, 02:35 PM   #727
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ha! only 5 years old too.
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Old 05-29-2013, 09:19 PM   #728
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ride5000 View Post
while troubleshooting boost control, always start with single unobstructed hose straight from compressor to wga. this will net wastegate spring tension. it should be absolutely rock steady with no creep or overshoot or ringing/oscillation. if you have any of those problems, stop there and find out why and fix it before moving on with additional hoses/connectors/components/etc.
Okay so tonight I tore everything off and started with the bare basics like you suggested. I ran a line from the compressor to the wastegate and it boosted very solid to 16psi. I thought that was alittle high so I adjusted the wastegate arm and then saw about 14.5psi which I was happy with so I left it there. I then ran just the mbc and backed it all the way off and again saw 14.5- 15psi which I thought was pretty acceptable.

However now I go and put my ebcs in line with the mbc and now Im getting over boost again
So basically the wastegate duty should be set to 100% instead of the zero it is now or I dont have the lines run right. Can some one point me in the direction of a diagram that is known to be correct? That would be a huge help.
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Old 05-29-2013, 10:02 PM   #729
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Did u do the blow test on the ebcs?

And if you're using any if the stock vacuum line did u make sure to remove the restrictor pill?

Last edited by Phatron; 05-29-2013 at 10:08 PM.
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Old 05-30-2013, 05:44 AM   #730
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ilovecugars View Post
Okay so tonight I tore everything off and started with the bare basics like you suggested. I ran a line from the compressor to the wastegate and it boosted very solid to 16psi. I thought that was alittle high so I adjusted the wastegate arm and then saw about 14.5psi which I was happy with so I left it there. I then ran just the mbc and backed it all the way off and again saw 14.5- 15psi which I thought was pretty acceptable.

However now I go and put my ebcs in line with the mbc and now Im getting over boost again
So basically the wastegate duty should be set to 100% instead of the zero it is now or I dont have the lines run right. Can some one point me in the direction of a diagram that is known to be correct? That would be a huge help.
You have your NO and NC ports swapped on the solenoid
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Old 05-30-2013, 07:21 AM   #731
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Phatron View Post
Did u do the blow test on the ebcs?

And if you're using any if the stock vacuum line did u make sure to remove the restrictor pill?
I used all new line that came with the boost controllers .

Ride 500:
What do NO and NC stand for? Sorry if this is a retarded question.
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Old 05-30-2013, 09:39 AM   #732
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normally open and normally closed or something like that

do the blow test, when the power's off blow into the ports to see which ports flow without power thats your NO

Connect to 12v and blow again to see which 2 ports flow when EBCS is powered thats NC

Last edited by Justin V; 05-30-2013 at 09:47 AM.
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Old 05-30-2013, 08:57 PM   #733
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Justin V View Post
After sifting through these 15 pages, this is the single most helpful post I found.
Okay i followed that post and the trouble shooting advice Ron gave me. The only thing i haven't done is run just the ebcs because i have to rearrange vaccine hoses and the engine was hot as hell after the first tests cause its million degrees here today. So if I'm still having issues I'll try just the ebcs next.

For now i have it set as hybrid setup again and preformed a blow test. With out power port 2 &3 are common and i plugged off port one. Now my question is does it matter which port of 2 & 3 is connected to the line that will go too boost side and waste gate side on the mbc?
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Old 08-26-2013, 01:53 PM   #734
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I went from factory ebcs to mbc and plugged the hole on the turbo inlet. I'm about to do the hybrid version, should i keep the hole plugged or route it in?
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Old 08-26-2013, 01:56 PM   #735
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There are many ways to hook up a hybrid set up but our instructions call to block that off.

Mike
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Old 08-26-2013, 02:29 PM   #736
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appreciate the quick response
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Old 08-26-2013, 03:14 PM   #737
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So on the 3 port Cobb ebcs, I would just plug the port 1 with a plastic cover and zip tie it.

Last edited by Brianmachinist; 08-27-2013 at 10:26 AM.
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Old 08-26-2013, 05:25 PM   #738
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From what I understand, at least for an internal WG (I'm getting ready to do this myself), if you had a stock setup that bled to the intake and switched to a 3 port, for the hybrid you remove the line going from EBCS to intake, plug the port, and plug the intake nipple.

You want the compressor air pressure against both the MBC and the EBCS...if you didn't plug the 3rd port, it would bleed off as the port is open at full throttle (assuming you changed your map to be 100% WGDC at full throttle) and the MBC would not work properly.

At full throttle, the EBCS blocks the compressor air from reaching the actuator and so does the MBC until full boost is reached and the MBC ball/spring allow in air to the actuator.

At partial throttle, the MBC is blocked off (if under max boost) and the EBCS is controlling the actuator.

Question: Is this bad for the EBCS to run in a mode where it opens and closes but is unable to vent?
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Old 08-27-2013, 10:17 AM   #739
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Quote:
Originally Posted by caramall2 View Post
Question: Is this bad for the EBCS to run in a mode where it opens and closes but is unable to vent?
I talked to one 3 port manufacturer and they said this (blocking off the port) shouldn't be a problem for the solenoid. They've personally done a hybrid system with a 3 port with no problems.
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Old 10-10-2013, 09:09 PM   #740
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Am I to understand that this setup is only workable with 3 port BCS? Or can I buy 2xT connections and an MBC connect in parallel and obtain a nice boost ceiling?
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Old 10-10-2013, 09:34 PM   #741
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Edit: misread question; follow advice below.

Last edited by yamahaSHO; 10-11-2013 at 03:16 PM.
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Old 10-10-2013, 09:37 PM   #742
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OK thanks. I just wasn't sure
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Old 10-11-2013, 07:11 AM   #743
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the oem system OPENS with CURRENT to RAISE boost, as it is a bleed topology.

you need a solenoid that CLOSES with CURRENT to RAISE boost, as it must be in an interrupt topology to be successfully run in parallel with an MBC.

it doesn't need to be 3 port, but most of the available/cheap ones are.
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Old 10-11-2013, 07:46 AM   #744
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So oem setup 2 port wont work with the MBC.

Should I get grimmspeed 3Port and call it a day?
and run that with a cheapo MBC?
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Old 10-11-2013, 07:52 AM   #745
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you could go grimmspeed, you could go gm solenoid, you could go generic grainger, etc.

the advantage to the GS and GM parts is that they're designed for underhood use. generic pneumatic solenoids will have a reduced lifespan in the harsh environment (heat/solvents/etc).
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Old 10-11-2013, 05:06 PM   #746
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Why do 3 port solenoids have 3 ports anyways? Why not just either open or blocked? I assume it's easier for the solenoid to bypass than outright block but not sure. Just curious ;-)
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Old 10-11-2013, 05:42 PM   #747
ride5000
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flexibility. with a 3 port you have one NO and one NC port, for whichever topology you need.

plus if you take away 1 port from a 3 port you have a 2 port.
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Old 10-11-2013, 05:43 PM   #748
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Marketing ploy from the aftermarket.

You can't sell a 2 port to someone with a 2 port. So you sell em a 3 port and tell em to block the extra port
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Old 10-13-2013, 01:02 AM   #749
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Real men run 4-ports.








(And yeah, I blocked the other two. EWG eventually.)
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Old 10-17-2013, 01:39 AM   #750
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I think at this point I've read the whole thread ( a couple times?) and I've purchased all the requisite parts. My issue now is that I can't find a local tuner who is an advocate for what I want, hybrid boost control. One tuner is very pro MBC and basically says, "why add complication when the MBC spools fastest and controls boost better". When I bring up the issue of PTFB, he basically says, "it's not an issue, you still control boost with your right foot."

On the other side I have another tuner that is pro 3-port and when I tell him the benefits of a hybrid setup in that one needn't worry about boost spiking, oscillation and slower reaction he basically says, "well, I spend the time to tune out all these problems so they don't happen". He went on to say that he did a direct comparison on a car with a 3-port and then with a Hallman on a big turbo (GT30R I think) and said the 3-port spooled it 300 RPM faster which makes little sense to me, having run just a MBC for over a year and experiencing exceptional spool and control that I doubt any EBC could match (well, maybe the super expensive, I don't know).

While I understand some tuning theory, I'm not a tuner, I don't own a tactrix cable and frankly at this time in my life I don't have lots of time to learn or devote to doing it myself as much as is really like to. That said, I just spent lots of money to swap in a JDM EJ207 engine so I want it tuned well and would like to enjoy the benefits of the hybrid strategy on my VF37 twin scroll. I'd like to trust this to a professional tuner who will use a wideband and a combo of dyno and road tuning.

So, my issue is this. Since neither tuner is accepting of the hybrid setup, each touting their own preferred boost control is the best, I'm concerned that when their lack of experience with the hybrid setup creates problems, they are going to be quick to pass judgement on the hybrid setup and I won't end up getting what I want. They'll get frustrated and ask to just run one or the other. I hope I can avoid this with a correct setup, capping the 3rd port (port 1 on the MAC valve) and using short hose runs.

How do I explain the tuning strategy to them in a way that they will get it?? I mean I read some of you are so lax with your WGDC tuning for part throttle values, some simply horizontally extrapolating lol. Isn't the tuner going to want to go all crazy tuning boost and WGDC? Do they need to?

Do I ask them to tune for the fastest spool up on the 3-port since the MBC will clamp boost spiking or do they still have to massage ramp up values?

Thanks for reading if you got this far. Help!
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