Welcome to the North American Subaru Impreza Owners Club Wednesday December 7, 2016
Home Forums WikiNASIOC Products Store Modifications Upgrade Garage
NASIOC
Go Back   NASIOC > NASIOC Technical > Normally Aspirated with bolt-on Forced Induction Powertrain

Welcome to NASIOC - The world's largest online community for Subaru enthusiasts!
Welcome to the NASIOC.com Subaru forum.

You are currently viewing our forum as a guest, which gives you limited access to view most discussions and access our other features. By joining our community, free of charge, you will have access to post topics, communicate privately with other members (PM), respond to polls, upload content and access many other special features. Registration is free, fast and simple, so please join our community today!

If you have any problems with the registration process or your account login, please contact us.
* Registered users of the site do not see these ads. 
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 02-14-2009, 08:57 AM   #201
master c
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 168226
Join Date: Jan 2008
Chapter/Region: RMIC
Location: West Jordan, Utah
Default

yeh my egt reads 1400 cruising on the interstate at 14.7 on my aem uego as well- i might put the other oil sender back in because i used to get readings like yours then i swapped oil senders and it seems to be about 20 psi off hahaha! not acceptable
* Registered users of the site do not see these ads.
master c is offline   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
* Registered users of the site do not see these ads.
Old 04-05-2009, 03:13 PM   #202
GodSquadMandrake
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 175435
Join Date: Mar 2008
Chapter/Region: MWSOC
Location: Minneapolis, MN
Vehicle:
1986 RX7
Sunrise Red

Default

morocco - Amazing thread! This really helped me understand the finer technical points of using EManage Ultimate before buying it. I'm going to be using it on my OBD1 1991 Legacy with EJ20G heads and the EJ22 block. So my setup is a little different but the principles are very close! Compared to PP6, EManage Ulti seems to do much better.

I'm very tempted to just run MAP with an IAT sensor and adjust the fuel based off of that but like you said it doesn't have as much resolution for low load and idling. That's just the way I am used to tuning Megasquirt on my VW and that's how Honda's come from the factory so it is proven to work great if done right.
The only reason I don't like the MAF is because it has it's own problem of vacuum leaks and slower response than a MAP. We all know how much MAF based cars hate atmospheric BOVs! Not that my BOV decides what engine management I use either....

Very interesting thread though. All the little tidbits you struggled with are extremely useful to me and save me a ton of work. I almost owe you money! haha. Definetley watching this thread for updates. Very nice car BTW. I like the OEM+ approach to everything.
GodSquadMandrake is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-05-2009, 07:18 PM   #203
morrocco88
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 104098
Join Date: Jan 2006
Chapter/Region: NWIC
Location: Eastern WA
Vehicle:
97' LGT 2.3 Dstroke
Rotated BW S256 6speed

Default

Thanks!

My neighbor has a 91' ss and he is going to use an EMU also. He is building a 2.3 stroker right now for it. He's found a way to machine the block for the #5 thrust bearing of the newer cranks so he could use a Phase II STI crank instead of the popular 2.5 N/A crank people use. This allows him to use better rods.

He was going to use a PP6, but after seeing the limitations I ran into and seeing how nice the EMU is, the choice was clear.

I'm about to take my setup out and swap in my 04' wrx ECU and wiring with a new built motor and DOM 2.5R turbo, so I will have a bunch of stuff for sale including the EMU, send me a PM if your interested.
morrocco88 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-06-2009, 12:20 AM   #204
GodSquadMandrake
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 175435
Join Date: Mar 2008
Chapter/Region: MWSOC
Location: Minneapolis, MN
Vehicle:
1986 RX7
Sunrise Red

Default

Interesting! You should get him on here when he decides to do all this so we can see his project.
I didn't know how to stroke the motor when I built mine but now I am thinking why not? I might end up doing it as I am using the stock EJ22T rods and forged slugs. I don't know how much those rods can withstand but being how inexpensive rods are compared to the total cost of the motor it would've been a wise upgrade to ensure the extra reliability! I just hate to split the case halves. It was such a pain last time but meh I know how to do it now.

EManage FTW!

Now if they just had open source support like Megasquirt... Megasquirt is great but it's like using Linux. You gotta build your own drivers, use emulators, and sometimes seemingly old software like vi that seems ancient but is still better than anything. That's my computer nerd translation. Megasquirt does all the same stuff, has the 16x16 fuel tables, high resolution high injector control, traction control, nos, boost control etc. But you just have to teach it how to play nice with your sensors and the electronics on your car. Either that or teach the car to play nice with the electronics MS recommends. Tapping the intake mani for an IAT sensor is no big deal but getting adapter plates for throttle bodies and using welded or machined trigger wheels with aftermarket sensors is a PAIN and not as reliable as OEM. E-Manage is great because it takes advantage of soemthing that is already proven to know how to play nice with the cars electronics, and then does everything a stand alone does on top of it. Well almost everything... I guess the "almost" part is what people pay an extra $2,000 for to get Link and all those high end standalones.

Now it all sounds good in theory but PP6 proves that it doesn't always work in reality.
GodSquadMandrake is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-25-2009, 02:19 PM   #205
morrocco88
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 104098
Join Date: Jan 2006
Chapter/Region: NWIC
Location: Eastern WA
Vehicle:
97' LGT 2.3 Dstroke
Rotated BW S256 6speed

Default

A little update on my car:

Although I should start another thread in the conversion section, I thought I would just show what my car looks like right now


New wires for 04' wrx ECU hanging from the work light


Old motor hanging on display


Wiring nightmare/project - It's not that bad and looks scarier than it is.


I definately would not be doing this if I had not gained all the wiring experience with my PP6 and the EMU. Once you get used to reading the factory diagrams it's really quite easy to figure stuff out. There are only about 25 wires that splice to the new wrx harness, and the rest of the old ECU stuff is removed.

I also cheated and sent my complete wrx harness to Zephyr here on the boards. He charged me $250 to strip down the wrx harness and free the ecu stuff I would need from the rest of the harness. He sent it back to me with everything labeled and a 2 page set of instructions. He also sent labels for the wires on my harness. So all I have to do is take my car apart, take the heater box out to get to the main part of the harness, unravel the tape and loom material, identify and label all the wires I will be splicing, remove the wires from the harness that will no longer be used, and then match the labels from the wrx harness to the labels on my harness and solder it up.

I probably could have figured it out on my own, but the $250 was well worth not having to spend the countless hours figuring it out myself.

I should have the wrx harness soldered in today! After the motor is in and make sure it starts and drives and there are no bugs, The motor will be coming out and then I will swap in the built long block I have sitting on the bench.

I built it on the side because the donor car for the swap had like 80K miles on it and was stock. and a stock wrx motor would be slower than I was before the swap.

The built long block is far from stock and has the following:

2.1 stroker short block:
stock sti crank and rods in 2.0 wrx block
CP forged pistons with coated skirts and ceramic coated crowns
Fully balanced and blueprinted
9.0:1 CR

Heads (2.0 wrx):
Full port job
Manley stainless Valves
Crower 264 cams
Crower valve springs and retainers
Shimless Buckets

Other stuff:
Turbo is a Blouch Dom 2.5R which is a GT3071 made to fit stock location, DW 750cc injectors, Front Mount IC, Synapse 40mm EWG

What do you think?

Block and Heads built by Maxwell Power in Arlington WA. They say it will easily handle 8500 rpms or more, If I can make power up there. I plan to run a max of 8k. I believe in over build and then run it less than designed for to get longevity out of it.

Last edited by morrocco88; 06-25-2009 at 02:28 PM.
morrocco88 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-25-2009, 05:10 PM   #206
IllNastyImpreza
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 36333
Join Date: May 2003
Chapter/Region: NESIC
Location: East Kingston NH
Vehicle:
98 2.5RS
tuning student...

Default

gotta love wiring
IllNastyImpreza is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-07-2014, 01:47 PM   #207
no694terry
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 220816
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Pittsburgh PA
Vehicle:
98 Forester S/t
[email protected]

Default

I think i've read this thread 5 or 6 times, it's been my bible for my project. I picked up a Wrx maf today, mine was out of a 05 forester 2.5 i think. It didnt come with the plug but i sweet talked the guy and walked out wit the maf with plug for $20

I dont expect much from memory here but i'll contribute a little and ask a little.

I wired mine mostly like page one here. except i left the jumper 13 open and tapped the coolant signal wire. This way the emanage sees a temp, its off in the emanage a few degrees but it doesn't not effect the cars ecu like it would when the jumper is set to 1-2.

I wired in my cam and crank signals. no real benefit other than the emanage can now see and log actual timing. I still use ignition signal to see rpm.

My questions are for whoever's left and remembers this thread is how exactly do you pull 1 degree of timing per psi of boost, Is it a manual thing in the maps or can the emanage do it on its on with the map sensor wired to an option port?

And I dont see how the wrx maf is any better than the stock jecs maf if they both max out a 5volts=300g/sec?

My build
no694terry is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-07-2014, 02:09 PM   #208
GodSquadMandrake
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 175435
Join Date: Mar 2008
Chapter/Region: MWSOC
Location: Minneapolis, MN
Vehicle:
1986 RX7
Sunrise Red

Default

The WRX maf maxes out of 5v, but it's flowing more air IIRC.

About the ignition maps, I thought you could change those with EMU.
GodSquadMandrake is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-07-2014, 04:06 PM   #209
no694terry
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 220816
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Pittsburgh PA
Vehicle:
98 Forester S/t
[email protected]

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by GodSquadMandrake View Post
The WRX maf maxes out of 5v, but it's flowing more air IIRC.

About the ignition maps, I thought you could change those with EMU.
Correct, I can adjust timing +/- 20 degrees with the ultimate. But if i go into the ignition map and just start pulling timing it will pull it all the time. Actually i just thought of something. I might be able to select the map sensor to adjust off of.

Found it, once you tell the emanage "front panel" that the Greddy map is installed, the ignition map will allow you to adjust off that MAP sensor. So i assume i can give it values to adjust while in boost only...hopefully.

Last edited by no694terry; 08-07-2014 at 04:17 PM.
no694terry is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-08-2014, 08:01 PM   #210
no694terry
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 220816
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Pittsburgh PA
Vehicle:
98 Forester S/t
[email protected]

Default

i wired in the wrx maf but need some serious airflow adjustments to get it scaled right.

on another note, my blinky red light on the emanage finally went away. no more flash read errors either. now its steady green.

I just did an experiment. I hooked my shop vac up to both MAF's. My stock jecs pulled 3.36 volts on the vac. the WRX maf was at 3.14 volts on same vac.

Something else i need help on. My scan tool reads 14 degees of timing at idle but the emanage logs 10 degrees. There a timing adjust on the blue car menu but not sure what it does.

Edit: Adjusting the timing correction to +4.0 in the paramater settings fixed my timing log. It now matches my scantool.

Last edited by no694terry; 08-12-2014 at 10:48 AM.
no694terry is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-10-2014, 10:26 PM   #211
IllNastyImpreza
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 36333
Join Date: May 2003
Chapter/Region: NESIC
Location: East Kingston NH
Vehicle:
98 2.5RS
tuning student...

Default

It's good to see this bumped. I still need to install mine
IllNastyImpreza is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-12-2014, 10:44 AM   #212
no694terry
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 220816
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Pittsburgh PA
Vehicle:
98 Forester S/t
[email protected]

Default

I've learned a lot about it and how to install it. I've come to the conclusion its better to follow the install manual than the forums. No offense to this thread but i had to change a lot of things from morrocco's.
no694terry is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-12-2014, 10:48 AM   #213
Odyknuck
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 192866
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Rome, Ohio
Vehicle:
2006 Impreza
Blue

Default

What did you change? Same motor?
Odyknuck is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-17-2014, 06:12 PM   #214
no694terry
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 220816
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Pittsburgh PA
Vehicle:
98 Forester S/t
[email protected]

Default

main changes are:

-I wired in cam and cranks sensors
-wired in coolant temp sensor but left that jumper open
-I selected car as a ej20 ver3/4 (for its default phase one sensors)
-probably wont be runnin wrx maf, i have one but will likely just clamp stock jecs maf a 4.5 volts and tune off greddy map from there. I'll just start the feul map scale at whatever psi my stock maf will read and stop it at my peak boost plus a little for creep.
no694terry is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-02-2014, 02:55 PM   #215
no694terry
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 220816
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Pittsburgh PA
Vehicle:
98 Forester S/t
[email protected]

Default

I have a new issue with the emanage. My input injector duty cycle is hitting over 95% and freaking out the emanage. On 3si, where i find most of the emanage help, they say to cut the input air voltage at the 95% mark to keep the emanage thinking straight but for me that is at only 4 volts. Would it be better to use the airflow adjustment map, mine is all 0, or go to a larger maf tube or do the boost limit cut setting at 4 volts??
no694terry is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-14-2014, 08:51 PM   #216
MEEPERS
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 69566
Join Date: Sep 2004
Chapter/Region: SWIC
Location: Glendale, AZ
Vehicle:
98 Legacy Outback
Murder wagon

Default

Big fat thanks to Morrocco88. Not only do you have very helpful and informative posts, but he was kind enough to send me his map to get my car up and running. You sir are one kick butt member. Finally got my car up and running and your tune saved me days of headaches trying to get a drivable map. Thank you thank you thank you
MEEPERS is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-15-2014, 01:16 AM   #217
morrocco88
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 104098
Join Date: Jan 2006
Chapter/Region: NWIC
Location: Eastern WA
Vehicle:
97' LGT 2.3 Dstroke
Rotated BW S256 6speed

Default

hahaha! That's awesome! Your welcome! I've always tried to finish my threads and try to document to help others later on. I know exactly how you feel when your trying to make something work and actually get some success! It's been so long since I played with an Emanage, I'd have to re-read my own thread to learn it all over again haha!
morrocco88 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-16-2014, 02:36 PM   #218
MEEPERS
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 69566
Join Date: Sep 2004
Chapter/Region: SWIC
Location: Glendale, AZ
Vehicle:
98 Legacy Outback
Murder wagon

Default

It does have its quirks. lol I did not realize you scaled back the map globally for the 550's when I installed mine i used the injector scale function and the car would just not idle. It took me a few to realize exactly what was wrong. It took me forever to get my motor put together because I realllllyyyy wanted the under intake turbo inlet vs a 90 coming off the turbo. Figuring out how to recirc the BOV, make room for the IAC and the crank breather took me longer then actually building and installing the motor.

I should have my coolant sensor and Wideband hooked into the EMU this week so I can start the fun process of tuning. But I really did want to let you know how much I appreciated all your information and help. I bought this car over 4 years ago with the intention of boost, but it ran so good I figured I should wait until the motor died... at 250k miles, the damn thing was still going.. so I said screw it.

I have my build thread on SLI and was pretty surprised you are not on that forum. But again. Super dooper thanks to you!
MEEPERS is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-16-2014, 09:46 PM   #219
tnext
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 408711
Join Date: Dec 2014
Default Me

do you have it
tnext is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-04-2015, 10:51 PM   #220
morrocco88
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 104098
Join Date: Jan 2006
Chapter/Region: NWIC
Location: Eastern WA
Vehicle:
97' LGT 2.3 Dstroke
Rotated BW S256 6speed

Default

I have an Emanage Ultimate I would sell for cheap. It has the greddy map sensor and AFR harness to tie in your wideband, and the main harness. Basically everything you would need.

PM me for a price
morrocco88 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-05-2015, 09:03 AM   #221
no694terry
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 220816
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Pittsburgh PA
Vehicle:
98 Forester S/t
[email protected]

Default

I can vouche the emanage is a great tool.
no694terry is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-22-2015, 02:02 PM   #222
morrocco88
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 104098
Join Date: Jan 2006
Chapter/Region: NWIC
Location: Eastern WA
Vehicle:
97' LGT 2.3 Dstroke
Rotated BW S256 6speed

Default

I just put my Emanage Ultimate up for sale if anyone is looking for one. I sold my original, and then bought this one, because I picked up a 2.5RS and wanted to turbo it. I since sold the RS before installing this, but it has everything a person would need!

Here is the for sale thread:
http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/show...2#post43342692
morrocco88 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-22-2015, 02:16 PM   #223
no694terry
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 220816
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Pittsburgh PA
Vehicle:
98 Forester S/t
[email protected]

Default

still got the legacy?
no694terry is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-23-2015, 06:21 PM   #224
morrocco88
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 104098
Join Date: Jan 2006
Chapter/Region: NWIC
Location: Eastern WA
Vehicle:
97' LGT 2.3 Dstroke
Rotated BW S256 6speed

Default

Oh yeah! I've had a new motor built for it waiting to go in for over a year now. I've been too busy with career changes, working on other people's cars, and building custom rotated kits to actually get it installed.

The last motor combo it had in it made 409whp and 368wtq. New motor is a 2.3 de-stroker, adding AVCS, custom rotated Borg Warner S256, custome front mount etc etc.

build thread is here if you want to check it out:
http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/show...792564&page=20
morrocco88 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-23-2015, 08:02 PM   #225
no694terry
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 220816
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Pittsburgh PA
Vehicle:
98 Forester S/t
[email protected]

Default

nice, i just finished puttin in my 850cc injectors, fired right up, now just working out the fuel trims in the emanage
no694terry is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
anyone running the emanage ultimate? IllNastyImpreza Normally Aspirated with bolt-on Forced Induction Powertrain 21 10-27-2005 02:30 PM
Greddy Emanage Ultimate $600 shipped jeffg Private 'For Sale' Classifieds 1 09-27-2005 02:23 PM
Greddy Emanage Ultimate?!?!? wannabejdm Engine Management & Tuning 1 09-07-2005 12:08 AM
Emanage Ultimate July 12!!! Hitokiri Normally Aspirated with bolt-on Forced Induction Powertrain 9 07-10-2005 11:19 PM
Emanage Ultimate 1SIKWRX4U2NV News & Rumors 17 06-29-2005 01:58 PM

All times are GMT -4. The time now is 08:10 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2016, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Powered by Searchlight © 2016 Axivo Inc.
Copyright ©1999 - 2016, North American Subaru Impreza Owners Club, Inc.