Power steering pulling in air?

[dc_adio28]

Events in chronological order,
-Replaced steering rack and pinion due to a dried out pass side boot.
-3 weeks later spun rod bearing so I did the EJ257 SB swap. (never disconnected any hoses from any of the
Ive never had any problems with the steering system (aside from listed above) up until right after I finished the hybrid build. The wheel gets rough everytime I turn a corner but from time to time its really bad and Ill loose all power assist all together (especially when its cold outside which is a lot lately). Ive tried bleeding the system by jacking up the front of the car and turning the wheels from lock to lock with the cap on the reservoir off. Tried both with the motor off and on. When I turned the wheels to the right I hear somewhere in the system somewhat of a slurping sound and the same when turning to the left but not as intense. When the motor is on I see in the reservoir air bubbles constantly coming up the the surface even when Im not turning the wheels. Fluid level in the reservoir is exactly where it should be.

Has anyone delt with something like this before? Any ideas?

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[dc_adio28]

bump....

[Statichead2k]

My p/s pump was sucking air badly after I pulled the intake last time. I pulled the suction inlet on the pump off to re-route the sensor wire and the o-ring did not reseal. I had a lot of pump noise and almost no assist from the pump. (sound familiar?)
I pulled the o-ring and took it to my local parts house and they matched it for me. I think it cost 68 cents to fix the issue.

It was bad enough that a lot of fluid was pushed out of the resevoir.

It does sound like you have the same issue. I also replaced the two sided crush washer thing(less that 3 bucks from subaru) on the pressure side of the pump for good measure although it was most likely not needed. .

[hwy61]

Originally Posted by dc_adio28

Events in chronological order,
-Replaced steering rack and pinion due to a dried out pass side boot.
-3 weeks later spun rod bearing so I did the EJ257 SB swap. (never disconnected any hoses from any of the
Ive never had any problems with the steering system (aside from listed above) up until right after I finished the hybrid build. The wheel gets rough everytime I turn a corner but from time to time its really bad and Ill loose all power assist all together (especially when its cold outside which is a lot lately). Ive tried bleeding the system by jacking up the front of the car and turning the wheels from lock to lock with the cap on the reservoir off. Tried both with the motor off and on. When I turned the wheels to the right I hear somewhere in the system somewhat of a slurping sound and the same when turning to the left but not as intense. When the motor is on I see in the reservoir air bubbles constantly coming up the the surface even when Im not turning the wheels. Fluid level in the reservoir is exactly where it should be.

Has anyone delt with something like this before? Any ideas?

I broke the power steering belt at 68,000 miles. It had been replace at about 50K something. There had been some growling which I was thinking was tires or wheel bearings. It was the power steering pump. Muscled the car on to the shop with no PS and no growling. Installed a new belt. The PS was still not working right. Some assist if turning slow, none if trying to turn the wheel quickly but a jerky wheel. Found that the reservoir was full of bubbles and the two rubber hoses attached to the reservoir were leaking quite a bit. This has only started as the temp dropped into the 30s. So, I cleaned everything and reinstalled the hoses with new clamps that are on tight. None of the metal lines were disconnected or anything on the rack.

New ATF after pouring out all the old. Everything was clean. Have done 6 complete attempts to remove air from the system. I don't see any when manually moving the tires. Start the engine and bubbles immediately begin to fill the reservoir. So far I don't have an answer. No leaks anywhere else. Hwy61

[Statichead2k]

Originally Posted by hwy61

I broke the power steering belt at 68,000 miles. It had been replace at about 50K something. There had been some growling which I was thinking was tires or wheel bearings. It was the power steering pump. Muscled the car on to the shop with no PS and no growling. Installed a new belt. The PS was still not working right. Some assist if turning slow, none if trying to turn the wheel quickly but a jerky wheel. Found that the reservoir was full of bubbles and the two rubber hoses attached to the reservoir were leaking quite a bit. This has only started as the temp dropped into the 30s. So, I cleaned everything and reinstalled the hoses with new clamps that are on tight. None of the metal lines were disconnected or anything on the rack.

New ATF after pouring out all the old. Everything was clean. Have done 6 complete attempts to remove air from the system. I don't see any when manually moving the tires. Start the engine and bubbles immediately begin to fill the reservoir. So far I don't have an answer. No leaks anywhere else. Hwy61

The o-ring on the suction fitting is cheap quick and easy. I'd try that first. I know they get hard and brittle so the cold may have affected it too.

Good Luck!

[hwy61]

Originally Posted by Statichead2k

The o-ring on the suction fitting is cheap quick and easy. I'd try that first. I know they get hard and brittle so the cold may have affected it too.

Good Luck!

Where is it located? I haven't taken the pump off yet. Only the banjo....btw....I don't see any crush washers there. Just a part to keep the end of the brass fitting from turning. Similar stops are on the alternator at a couple of spots. Thanks. Hwy61

Thanks Statichead2k. I have the pump out and I don't see any crush washers or "O" rings. Only the fitting at the banjo bolt and the nozzle for the rubber hose to the reservoir. Pictures in a minute. My thread on this.....with pictures. http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/show....php?t=1897783

[Statichead2k]

The o-ring is on the suction fitting of the pump. It is held on with a single 10mm bolt that also holds the bracket for the sensor wire. Once you have the bolt loose the 90 degree aluminum elbow(nozzle) pops right off. I took the o-ring down to my local parts guy and he matched it up for a total of 68 cents.

The banjo gasket on the pressure side has an odd set up of two crush washers in one piece...sort of a U shaped bit. Yes it does look like the stops you find other places. It was less than 3 buck from my local subby parts guy.

PS: I never pulled the pump to fix my issues. For "burping" the system I lifted the front wheels off the ground and with the engine off manually moved the wheels back and forth several times.

[hwy61]

Originally Posted by Statichead2k

The o-ring is on the suction fitting of the pump. It is held on with a single 10mm bolt that also holds the bracket for the sensor wire. Once you have the bolt loose the 90 degree aluminum elbow(nozzle) pops right off. I took the o-ring down to my local parts guy and he matched it up for a total of 68 cents.

The banjo gasket on the pressure side has an odd set up of two crush washers in one piece...sort of a U shaped bit. Yes it does look like the stops you find other places. It was less than 3 buck from my local subby parts guy.

PS: I never pulled the pump to fix my issues. For "burping" the system I lifted the front wheels off the ground and with the engine off manually moved the wheels back and forth several times.

OK, I know where you are talking about and I haven't taken that part off. The bolt right below the white electrical clip. A really easy one as it sits right on top of the pump. Here is a picture of the components making up the high pressure connection on top of the pump. I can't find anything loose, my pully has absolutely no play in it. Every bolt on it is very tight. They wouldn't even move as I tried to check their tightness. No leaks anywhere, pump....hoses and the entire rack and pinion is completely dry...although there is another rubber hose just above the crossmember in the center of the rack. I haven't replaced the stock clamps there but nothing is even remotely damp and it looks very tight.

The only loose parts I've found so far were the two rubber hose connections at the bottom of the reservoir. The hoses were removed, inspected, wiped off and reinstalled with new clamps that are tight. So, why am I still getting bubbles. I will check out the "O" ring that is simple enough. Thanks Statichead2K. Hwy61





Assembled and ready to be threaded into the pump and tightened.


BTW.... after reassembly I did all the manual turning of the wheel. Sounds like milking a cow. The tire goes so far, hits pressure, there is the sound of hydraulic fluid being forced out of the rack, then the tire goes more easily in the direction I am turning it. Same thing in the opposite direction. No bubbles in the can......but start the engine and there they are....lots of em. I will check that "O" ring. I hate it when a plan doesn't come together.

[STIckySTIfee]

ok, when you have that high pressure line off and the return line off, pour some power steering fluid in it and spin the pulley by hand, you should see the fluid being sucked in. Keep adding fluid and spinning the pulley untill no more gets sucked in. Then add some lucas oil power steering additive, its like a stop whining solution or somethin. Worked for me after about 10 weeks of getting more and more pissed at my power steering system.

[hwy61]

It must be harder to get the air out of the system than what I am thinking. My pump doesn't make any noise, long screwdriver to the pump and ear....sounds are normal.....mild mechanical roar....very similar to the alternator. I can see no leakes. There is no play in any direction that I can find regarding the pulley.... But massive amounts of air begin to hit the reservoir immediately on engine start up. I've done the manual tire flop many times. I can feel the fluid pressure build and hear it moving out of ??? the rack. The steering wheel is pretty smooth, engine running, no load on the tires but I can't seem to stop the bubbling when I start the engine. Air is still in the system or being drawn in somehow. This pump has never been run dry. Hwy61

[STIckySTIfee]

i was going through the exact same thing as you my friend. Im not sure if my solution is yours but...

1. Lift front of the car off the ground, with key in ignition, turn the wheels to full lock both sides a few dozen times.
2. Remove the return and high pressure lines and spin the pulley by hand, adding fluid in the return port until it stops sucking fluid down. Go both directions when spining the pulley, it takes a good 15 mins to fill it up by hand.
3. Put in some lucas oil power steering stop leak / stop whine fluid. Its like 8 bucks.

Before this i bled the system, replaced the clamps, but the last two is what finally solved my problem. If that doesnt work, start contacting car quest for a re-manned pump...

[hwy61]

OK, my hat is off to STIckySTIfee. Went into the shop today. Looked in the reservoir.....no air bubbles. Turned the tires back and forth thirty times or so....no bubbles. Stated the engine. Ran for 5 min....no bubbles. Man it's about time. Think I'll give that little 10mm bolt STIicky pointed out a quick check to make sure it is tight. The minute my socket touched the head of the bolt there was this buzzing sound like something rubbing on the accessory belt or the spokes of a cycle running 150 mph.....what tha.....?

Looked into the reservoir....nothing but bubbles. Apparently the cold air has shrunk the "O" ring just enough, that and it getting hard from the heat over the years. So....off to get a new "O" ring. BTW, the oil immediately under the nozzle fitting was full of bubbles. That power steering pump is amazingly quiet without that buzzing. Sure hope this is it. If so all the credit to STIckySTIfee for the clue. Hwy61