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Old 05-30-2004, 08:38 PM   #1
SubaruBen
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Default SC & Turbo STi??

http://forums.s2ki.com/forums/showth...hreadid=211040


can someone explain this to me please?


Benson
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Old 05-30-2004, 08:47 PM   #2
kastle
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Forced Air Tech twin charge system. What do you want to know about it?

Last edited by kastle; 05-30-2004 at 09:43 PM.
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Old 05-30-2004, 09:09 PM   #3
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so how does it work?
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Old 05-30-2004, 09:16 PM   #4
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hholy ish, im interestred in this w\t\f whoa! i didnt htink it was possible yet... LOL
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Old 05-30-2004, 09:20 PM   #5
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It's kind of hard to explain. The SC starts up and produces air as it normally would. IIRC, it runs 8psi. The turbo is oversized as so it spools slowly and has some lag (like full boost at 4600rpms).

Once a certain psi or RPM is reached, there is an electronic bypass valve behind the SC that opens and disengages the SC in favor air coming off of the turbo (GT35R). This action is controlled by 2 solenoids. So the basic idea behind it is to have boost all the time, BUT not waste the energy of the SC into the higher RPM's.

I recall Robert, owner of Forced Air Tech, trying to explain it to me this past Friday. I understood the concept, but it's very hard to describe. It's one of those have to see to understand...
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Old 05-30-2004, 09:36 PM   #6
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Thanks kastle.
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Old 05-30-2004, 09:43 PM   #7
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cool, i figured that, basically simulating a very high discplacing car..... nice! at full power through out the powerband, i remember dreaming of this and talking about it only to be laughed at by them peoples! but wow, i can only imagine the pull from the begining all the way to the end, imagine this setup on a v12~ insane! i tell you!
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Old 05-31-2004, 01:01 PM   #8
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This was done back in the days of Group B rally cars (The Killer B's) on Fords and Lancia's I beleive. I would imagine that modern anti-lag technology would make this unnecessary, but would be a sweet, if expensive, setup for the street.
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Old 05-31-2004, 01:43 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally posted by kastle
It's one of those have to see to understand...

Everything you wrote sounds right and made sense to me :shrugs:
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Old 05-31-2004, 02:06 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally posted by WRX-pilot
Everything you wrote sounds right and made sense to me :shrugs:


I wasn't sure I was describing how it works correctly, which is why I added that little note...
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Old 05-31-2004, 02:19 PM   #11
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great job kastle i got the general idea
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Old 05-31-2004, 04:26 PM   #12
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sorta like a sequential turbo setup?


small turbo and large turbo?
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Old 05-31-2004, 04:48 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally posted by trd20
sorta like a sequential turbo setup?


small turbo and large turbo?
Exactly.
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Old 05-31-2004, 05:49 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally posted by Zornorph
This was done back in the days of Group B rally cars (The Killer B's) on Fords and Lancia's I beleive. I would imagine that modern anti-lag technology would make this unnecessary, but would be a sweet, if expensive, setup for the street.
Or even the twinscrolls!
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Old 05-31-2004, 06:53 PM   #15
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TTIWWOM (movies) I WANT MOVIES!!!!!

IMHO I dont think that thing runs.. what you see isnt always what you get, pics could be misleading...
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Old 05-31-2004, 07:17 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally posted by XS_WRX
TTIWWOM (movies) I WANT MOVIES!!!!!

IMHO I dont think that thing runs.. what you see isnt always what you get, pics could be misleading...

You are entitled to your opinion, even when you are wrong. I've ridden in the car, I've been in the shop as the kit was being custom fabricated. I know first hand that Forced Air Tech can bring some very impressive things to life...

But what do I know
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Old 05-31-2004, 08:41 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally posted by kastle
You are entitled to your opinion, even when you are wrong. I've ridden in the car, I've been in the shop as the kit was being custom fabricated. I know first hand that Forced Air Tech can bring some very impressive things to life...

But what do I know
Yeah, quit acting like you own scoobymods.com and stuff

If only people knew an ounce of what you've done for this community, infinite credit to you kastle.
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Old 05-31-2004, 10:08 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally posted by WRX-pilot
Yeah, quit acting like you own scoobymods.com and stuff

If only people knew an ounce of what you've done for this community, infinite credit to you kastle.

Thank you.
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Old 06-01-2004, 12:30 AM   #19
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As I recall HKS did a setup like this in the 1980's for the SC MR2. It used the standard MR2 4AGZE supercharged motor and simply added a turbo. The supercharger on that car already had a clutch so the addition of a turbo was "simple." The car was supposed to make 300 bhp in that turbo/SC form, don't know if it ever did.

Bryan
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Old 06-01-2004, 01:02 AM   #20
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Quote:
Originally posted by b57m57w57
As I recall HKS did a setup like this in the 1980's for the SC MR2. It used the standard MR2 4AGZE supercharged motor and simply added a turbo. The supercharger on that car already had a clutch so the addition of a turbo was "simple." The car was supposed to make 300 bhp in that turbo/SC form, don't know if it ever did.

Bryan
I rode in one of those HKS twincharged MR2s years ago and I doubt it even made 200 hp, let alone 300. As light as they are, the acceleration wasn't that great. A stock, 200 hp later model MR2 turbo felt much more impressive.
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Old 06-01-2004, 08:30 AM   #21
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The "no-lag" supercharger has always made me envious when I've ridden in cars that have them.

I've often thought it would be interesting to rig up a turbo "accumulator" that would store excess boost when you weren't using it. Say maybe taking the pressure that came off the BOV and keeping it in a storage tank.

Then, when your engine was in a high load/low RPM condition, it would vent the stored pressure to provide boost until the turbo could get spooled up. Kind of like nitrous, but a lot less expensive.
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Old 06-01-2004, 11:04 AM   #22
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Default I've seen this setup work

Quote:
Originally posted by XS_WRX
TTIWWOM (movies) I WANT MOVIES!!!!!

IMHO I dont think that thing runs.. what you see isnt always what you get, pics could be misleading...
Huge, I mean HUGE diesel engines are used for jet-starters at airports and they use this setup. Actually, they supercharged and have twin turbos. Seen them with my own two eyes! The company that I worked for at the time built the compressors that these diesels were used to turn. The compressor blows the air that is used to start the jet engines. I have no idea how that all works as I was only expert in our machines (the compressors and blowers), but I have seen the whole setup in our shop several times, and evertime that they came in for repair, we would test them, so I was able to see the engines running. Neat.

C
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Old 06-17-2004, 09:57 PM   #23
downshiftdan
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cost?
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Old 06-18-2004, 12:30 AM   #24
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This is an intriguing setup.

Kastle,

Can you tell us more about it? What is the ultimate goal for engine performance out of this setup?
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Old 06-18-2004, 11:08 AM   #25
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Default Re: I've seen this setup work

Quote:
Originally posted by Carlito2002WGN
Huge, I mean HUGE diesel engines are used for jet-starters at airports and they use this setup. Actually, they supercharged and have twin turbos. Seen them with my own two eyes!
C
Same here. Worked on them. Detroit Diesels that are in your average consumer yacht have twin turbos and a roots style blower.
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