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01-04-2013, 12:56 AM | #1 |
Scooby Specialist
Member#: 180033
Join Date: May 2008
Chapter/Region:
Tri-State
Location: Queens, NY, 11385
Vehicle:2005 WRX PSM |
2005 WRX 4eat. Hybrid. 280whp/390wtq.
Ok so it's not much to brag about, but thought it would gather some interest.
Please share your thoughts and opinions. Facility: Performance Auto Solutions. Deer Park, NY. Tuner: Dave Brown Tuned with : Cobb Accessport. Type of Dyno: Mustang Dyno Year: 2005 Model: WRX Transmission : 4EAT Baseline # for a stocker at the dyno:- Boost: 20psi Fuel:BP 93oct. Target AFR: ~11.0:1 SAE Corrections:- Peak HP at RPM: 281 @ ~5350 Peak Torque at RPM: 389 @ ~3500 Mods: Engine 2011 STi Shortblock. Factory STi Forged Rods. Factory Nitrided Crank. 11mm STi Oil pump. Stock 2.0l heads. Wiseco 99.5mm Pistons. VF-48 Grimmspeed EBCS Grimmspeed EWG 38MM Up-pipe. TiAl MVS 38MM EWG. 08+ STi TMIC Perrin silicone turbo inlet KStech 83mm Short Ram with Spectre filter DeatschWerks 750cc Injectors. Walboro 255lph Invidia 3" bellmouth catless down-pipe. S-RS SP2 replica catback GroupN Engine mounts Torque Solutions v3 pitch stop. Suspension/Wheels BC BR coilovers Carbing rear strut bar. Rear diff bushings outrigger bushings cusco 21mm rear sway bar on medium Kartboy endlinks Front and back. Ebay H-brace. Advan RG-2's 17x8 +45 225/45/17 kumho all season's temporary. Crappy pic of dyno sheet. Final Dyno run. Current pic of how it sits And engine bay shot. wiring is a mess but im going to take everything out and clean everything up once it warms up a bit.
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Last edited by silvercookie; 05-01-2015 at 02:05 PM. |
01-04-2013, 03:06 AM | #2 |
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Member#: 118389
Join Date: Jun 2006
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any tranny work (i.e. modded tc or vb)? If not, are those coming next?
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01-04-2013, 09:26 AM | #3 |
Scooby Specialist
Member#: 180033
Join Date: May 2008
Chapter/Region:
Tri-State
Location: Queens, NY, 11385
Vehicle:2005 WRX PSM |
Stock trans. Don't plan on doing anything to it at the moment.
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01-05-2013, 12:17 AM | #4 |
Scooby Specialist
Member#: 282614
Join Date: May 2011
Chapter/Region:
NWIC
Location: Spokane Washington
Vehicle:2006 Wrx sti Black pearl |
Man that tq spike is gnarly for a vf48. That has got to be a blast. To bad the hp isnt a little closer to the tq but in my opinion the tq is where all the fun is. Nice build tho Im at 300hp 325 tq on my stage 2 sti and would give my left but to have 380 tq.
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01-05-2013, 01:09 AM | #5 |
Scooby Specialist
Member#: 323379
Join Date: Jun 2012
Vehicle:1992 Trans Am |
Sounds off to me. That's a significant loss of power in the topend to the point where it has to be deliberate. Edit: auto. Yeah... I don't buy it.
Last edited by ProfessWRX; 01-05-2013 at 02:01 AM. |
01-05-2013, 01:18 AM | #6 |
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Chapter/Region:
BAIC
Location: Turlock, CA
Vehicle:2006 RA 1-4 5mt wrx obp needs a e85 tune |
Damn auto trans is causing some serious wtq with that torque converter. Nice!
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01-05-2013, 04:08 AM | #7 |
Scooby Specialist
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Join Date: May 2011
Chapter/Region:
NWIC
Location: Spokane Washington
Vehicle:2006 Wrx sti Black pearl |
I didn't even know there was such thing as auto trans in wrx. Is that pretty rare or just very undesirable cuz this is the first ive seen.
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01-05-2013, 04:50 AM | #8 |
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Join Date: Oct 2010
Chapter/Region:
Tri-State
Vehicle:2001 Forester STI MKtuned |
Dave does wonderous work on these things.
FYI, as a forester guy, i have been in other modified FXT's with 4EAT trans, pushing similiar torque. Yes the auto trans does something strange and puts the power down at the low end, there is no BS there folks. Dont be so quick to judge. You always see splits like this among the builds of forester XT's, Baja XT's, Outback XT's , Legacy GTs (5eat) and the occasional rare 4EAT wrx, only made up until 05. Plus its 2.5 bottom end. |
01-05-2013, 08:58 AM | #9 |
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Member#: 270482
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: albany ny
Vehicle:2011 turbotek fxt 11.85@117 4eat xt record? |
They actually made them up intill 2010 for the newer models they are called impreza GT which has a 4eat and a td04 turbo instead of a 5 speed and a vf52.
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01-05-2013, 09:13 AM | #10 |
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Chapter/Region:
Tri-State
Location: GTX3576R 05GD, GTX3076R'd FXT
Vehicle:GTX 3071R'd 11WRX PPG,4.44,LSD,E85,6spdx3 |
Nice Vinny, glad to see your happy. These numbers are as real as it gets. Autotrans for you... most all the autos Ive seen really shift the power too the left. 4.11 gears...
Ian @ Performance Auto Solutions |
01-05-2013, 10:08 AM | #11 |
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Member#: 193222
Join Date: Nov 2008
Chapter/Region:
MAIC
Location: Baltimore, MD
Vehicle:05 Wrx 1.5xtr 6spd 2.5 hybrid 367whp/363wtq |
Very nice! We have identical long blocks lol bet its a blast to drive
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01-05-2013, 10:28 AM | #12 | |
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Member#: 115260
Join Date: May 2006
Chapter/Region:
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Location: Dover, DE
Vehicle:04 WRX 205/22E Hybrid w/ VF39 |
Quote:
If the torque converter isn't locked, then it will multiply torque up to its stall speed. That can cause big low end torque spikes in automatic cars on the dyno. |
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01-05-2013, 12:47 PM | #13 |
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Member#: 323379
Join Date: Jun 2012
Vehicle:1992 Trans Am |
Yeah. I don't buy it at all. Torque converters are KNOWN to artificially inflate dyno torque numbers.
Look how fast it dips. That's the converter. The torque doesn't magically go away like that. Once the turbine, impeller and stator reach the same speed, multiplication stops and torque drops. The only accurate dyno for an auto is with a locked converter. And I'm willing to bet a considerable amount the OP didn't have his locked. |
01-05-2013, 02:15 PM | #14 | |
Scooby Specialist
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Join Date: Dec 2010
Chapter/Region:
NESIC
Location: Massachusetts
Vehicle:02 WRX 05 LGT Slow Automatics |
Quote:
I'm curious, was this pull done in 2nd or 3rd? Numbers seem high-ish for a 93 pump auto car on a mustang dyno. Anyways, very nice car to the OP. Enjoy it! I love the auto myself, its much better than any 5 speed |
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01-05-2013, 02:23 PM | #15 | |
Scooby Specialist
Member#: 323379
Join Date: Jun 2012
Vehicle:1992 Trans Am |
Quote:
Last edited by ProfessWRX; 01-05-2013 at 02:45 PM. |
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01-05-2013, 04:12 PM | #16 |
Scooby Specialist
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Join Date: Dec 2010
Chapter/Region:
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Location: Massachusetts
Vehicle:02 WRX 05 LGT Slow Automatics |
How's it artifically inflated? You're measuring what's at the wheels. It's not the engine making all that torque, but there is torque multiplication through the TC which is brought at the wheels. Hence 390wtq, not 390 ctq.
Noone said that this engine paired to a manual gearbox would make these numbers, it would probably make more peak hp, less peak tq. Now your way of thinking, does this mean these horsepower / top end torque numbers artifically low due to the higher parsitic loss of a hydraulic automatic? Edit: I kind of see where you can come from. Using like a road dyno software this becomes evident. If you are measuring how quick it can accelerate RPMs, then yes, this 'slip' is shows up as torque rise/then dip. However, I am very sure it measures torque simply by how quick it can accelerate the rollers and then assigns RPM datapoints to it afterwards, hence this is real torque. You could always measure it torque vs. time and see what happens. Last edited by BlazeRex; 01-05-2013 at 04:21 PM. |
01-05-2013, 04:21 PM | #17 |
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Chapter/Region:
NWIC
Location: Menzel Lake, WA
Vehicle:06 Red Ltd.Wagon Dom 1.5xtr JJ tuned |
This is exactly what torque converters do. I have a friend who had a 1969 340 Dodge Dart with an auto and the factory TC. Just couldn't quite break below 15 seconds in the quarter.
Got himself a high-stall track-designed converter and he was into the 13's. |
01-05-2013, 05:38 PM | #18 | |
Scooby Specialist
Member#: 323379
Join Date: Jun 2012
Vehicle:1992 Trans Am |
Quote:
What happens when you lock the converter? What happens when you change your final drive ratio? Does gearing effect power output? Why don't manual guys slip the clutch like they do a "launch" to raise measured torque on the dyno? Because it skews numbers? Nah, no way. It's cause they don't know how to get artificial numbers like a stall gives you. |
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01-05-2013, 06:53 PM | #19 |
Scooby Specialist
Member#: 268354
Join Date: Dec 2010
Chapter/Region:
NESIC
Location: Massachusetts
Vehicle:02 WRX 05 LGT Slow Automatics |
So tell me what happens when you brake stall on the dyno. Never done it, not sure what it would do.
What happens when you lock the converter? Torque Muliplication goes away What happens when you change your final drive ratio? Does gearing effect power output? Yes. |
01-05-2013, 06:59 PM | #20 | |
Scooby Specialist
Member#: 323379
Join Date: Jun 2012
Vehicle:1992 Trans Am |
Quote:
Why don't manual guys slip the clutch on dynos? How does a dyno calculate torque? Does it use rpm? What happens if the Rpms are not directly connected to the drivetrain rotation? |
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01-05-2013, 08:02 PM | #21 |
Scooby Guru
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Chapter/Region:
Tri-State
Location: GTX3576R 05GD, GTX3076R'd FXT
Vehicle:GTX 3071R'd 11WRX PPG,4.44,LSD,E85,6spdx3 |
Not to start a pissing match but this car was locked into 2nd gear during the pull.
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01-05-2013, 08:09 PM | #22 |
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Location: Guilford, CT
Vehicle:2005 WRX |
i'll vouch for this car. it's def quick and the torque is insane
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01-05-2013, 08:18 PM | #23 |
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Chapter/Region:
W. Canada
Location: Calgary, Canada
Vehicle:2006 WRX 2015 WRX |
The Torque curve, as plotted against engine RPM, is not accurate in the sense that the engine is not actually at the RPM indicated on the chart but I wouldn't go as far as "artificially inflating..." That RPM scale is calculated from the roller speed. As soon as you step on the gas, the engine will speed up to the stall speed and the wheels has to "catch up". The calculated RPM will be less than the actual engine speed.
That being said, the torque curve, as shown, does give an indication of the acceleration that you would feel. Imagine if you were blindfolded and didn't know the car had an automatic, would it feel like a lot of "low end" torque? I made some plots and stuff that covers this: http://tinyurl.com/b28nyx6 |
01-05-2013, 08:46 PM | #24 |
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Vehicle:2005 Stage 2 WRX Obsidian Black Pearl |
this is sick, nice video in the rain
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01-05-2013, 09:37 PM | #25 |
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Vehicle:04 WRX 205/22E Hybrid w/ VF39 |
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