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10-05-2011, 10:32 PM | #1 |
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2011 WRX misfires, Subaru says my 5w-40 is the issue
Anyone ever have the dealer and Subaru tell them that Shell Rotella 5w-40 wasn't an acceptable oil?
Here's the story: CEL comes on at the end of August while I'm half way through a 250 mile trip. It came on right after I bought gas, obviously engine was hot, but I wasn't going to be home to my code reader for another 4 days because I was camping. Made a few short drives from the campsite, the CEL turns off by itself. I think okay no big deal, maybe it was a loose gas cap. Fast forward two weeks: my wife is driving the car, CEL comes back on, she takes it to the dealer we bought it from. It was a Friday afternoon and he says, "Well, I pulled the codes and cleared them, but we're not going to fix it today, so call me if it happens again." He told my wife that he pulled misfire codes, but I don't know exactly which ones. Fast forward another two weeks or so: the CEL comes back on. This time, I pull the codes, sure enough: misfires on all for cylinders P0301, P0302, P0303, and P0304. I call the service guy back at the first dealer and leave him a message, he doesn't call me back. I start calling other dealers. Finally make an appointment for Monday 10/3. So I bring the car in on Monday, they verify the codes but there's no obvious problem. They clear the code and drive it around a bit. Fortunately, they're able to get it act up again and record some data that they send off to Subaru. The dealer tech tells me that the next step is to go deeper and to pull the valve covers and start poking around but that Subaru won't authorize the repair. He says that I need to authorize the repair and basically take responsibility for the fact that I might have been abusing the car. Not exactly an awesome way to treat customers. But he assures me that once they get in there and see that there's nothing unreasonably out of the ordinary, Subaru will authorize and cover the repair. Not feeling like I had any choice, and knowing that I haven't abused the car in anyway, I authorize the dealer to proceed and leave the car there. Today, the dealer calls me and says, "Subaru called us back after analyzing the data stream and said don't do anything until you put proper oil in it. We flushed the engine, put 5w-30 in, and put a few miles on the car and haven't seen any issues." Fine. Great. But here's where I start to get annoyed. The dealer wants to charge me $110 for the oil change to a "proper" oil. But last time I checked the car manual, 5w-40 is an approved weight and of course the Shell Rotella is generally well-respected here on the forums. I don't think I should be paying out of pocket to hunt down a problem in a car filled with an approved fluid, and frankly, I shouldn't have had to assume any responsibility at any point when the car has such low mileage and zero after market parts. The car has roughly 11k miles on it. It's bone stock. I do the maintenance myself and have copies of receipts for oil and oil filters. I will grant that I may be a bit paranoid on the oil changes, having done the first at 3500 and the second at 8500 (I'm sure the peanut gallery will tell me that changing the oil too soon has caused irreparable damage). Thoughts? I hate to start another "Oil Thread" having read through so many of them before choosing the Rotella and knowing just how vicious they can get.
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10-05-2011, 10:57 PM | #2 |
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Well, your owner's manual says that it requires oil marked "SM" and "Energy Conserving", and I don't think the T6 fulfills both requirements. The manual also says that 5w30 synthetic should be used for optimum engine performance and protection.
YMMV on that one, but if it comes down to it, the T6 isn't an approved oil grade/type and therefore you're not going to win this. How did they know you were using 5w-40? |
10-05-2011, 10:59 PM | #3 |
Floresbian
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Shell Rotella does not meet Subaru's standards for engine oil. It also does not meet the API or JASO standards as recommended by Subaru.
In order to meet the tougher fuel economy standards all of the Subaru engine's that now require synthetic oil are built with tighter tolerances than previous engine designs and I would not doubt that using an unapproved oil could cause issues. Pay to put the recommended oil in the car and see if the problem is resolved. If it is then they are/were right. |
10-05-2011, 11:51 PM | #4 |
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Ruh Roh Rotella...
Sorry, you might be out of luck, as new 2011 WRX/STI manuals say this now: And the 2011 WRX/STI Quick Reference Guide says: You might have an older 2011 manual that says 40 weight oil is OK for high ambient temperature use, but Subaru should have sent you an owner manual addendum correcting that to the current 5W-30 SM or SN Energy or Resource Conserving, ILSAC GF-4 or GF-5 requirement. This is why I'm avoiding Rotella T6 for the time being and trying out the new Castrol Edge Titanium/Syntec oils. Many other members of this thread love Rotella T6 (supported by great used oil analyses) but I always suspected something like this might happen. Also if the oil change does fix your misfires, then you do owe the dealer $110. ..but if it doesn't fix the problem then I would withhold payment until they actually fix it. |
10-06-2011, 02:42 AM | #5 | |
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Thank you all for your feedback. Indeed, I have one of the original 2011 manuals that says:
Quote:
And while Rotella is, in fact, marked "SM," it does not include the "Energy Conserving" provision. |
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10-06-2011, 06:02 AM | #6 |
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You're right. RT6 is most definitely an API SM oil. I might buy their argument if the WRX had a new engine, but it doesn't. IMO, they cannot PROVE that it was the oil especially since the original manual lists thicker viscosities. It also cannot be proven that you received the addendum.
$110 just for the oil change or does that include a diagnostics charge? Find another dealer and also bring your own oil from Wal-Mart. -Dennis Last edited by bluesubie; 10-06-2011 at 06:11 AM. |
10-06-2011, 06:16 AM | #7 | |
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Quote:
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10-06-2011, 06:39 AM | #8 |
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10-06-2011, 10:30 AM | #9 |
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10-06-2011, 10:35 AM | #10 |
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Correct, but this also means that it is an acceptable type oil (yes temporary, but still) which is not what the dealer is stating. They are saying it can't be in the engine at all.
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10-06-2011, 01:53 PM | #11 |
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The dealer is correct, Rotella 5w-40 is absolutely not an acceptable oil based on the owners manual. Yes, the weight is allowed, but it needs to have the energy conserving seal.
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10-06-2011, 02:56 PM | #12 | |
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a chef cooking your product is working for free. |
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10-06-2011, 08:49 PM | #13 |
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The 5W-40 mentioned in the owner's manual referring to replenishment states "5W-40 conventional" may be used. There's no such thing!
-Dennis |
10-06-2011, 08:51 PM | #14 |
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Dupe post
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10-06-2011, 10:45 PM | #15 | |
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Quote:
That and "replenishment" typically doesn't mean 4.5 quarts... it would be a quart or so between LOFs if the oil level is low. |
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10-07-2011, 02:59 PM | #16 |
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The new Prius will throw misfire codes if 0w20 synthetic is not used.. Engineers at Toyota said it has to do with the calibration of the crank and cam sensors. Thicker oil causes the rotating assembly to spin at a slightly slower speed which is interpreted by the ecu as a misfire.. Sounded ridiculous to me...
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10-07-2011, 03:02 PM | #17 |
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why not just make life easy and stick with a 5w30 synthetic?
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10-07-2011, 07:32 PM | #18 | |
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Quote:
Very very few 5w-30s are inexpensive and protect as well as Rotella. |
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10-07-2011, 10:45 PM | #19 |
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Well, based on the mixed reactions here, I opted not to argue with dealer. I paid for the oil change to 5w-30 and drove away hoping all was well. I'll be honest: the car did seem to run smoother, but maybe it was just my imagination.
But, surprise, surprise, the problem is not fixed . The CEL came on again this evening while idling at a stoplight. I haven't pulled the codes yet, but I'd be shocked if it wasn't more misfires. Needless to say, I'll be calling the dealer tomorrow... |
10-07-2011, 11:32 PM | #20 | |
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Good luck. -Dennis |
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10-07-2011, 11:42 PM | #21 | |
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Quote:
I'm actually being bold right now and trying a Motul oil with girly man levels of ZDDP. X-clean C3 5W-30. It's SM rated, but it doesn't get the official girly man Energy/Resource Conserving seal because it meets Euro ACEA A3 specs with a higher High Temp High Shear and it's also thick at 100C like GC (which gives me some comfort). Low TBN though so I won't be pushing it too far. Although someone here did a 7,500 mile run in an STI (and without a TBN reading). -Dennis |
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10-09-2011, 12:53 AM | #22 | ||
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10-09-2011, 02:41 AM | #23 |
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this whole 'oil issue' is just ****ign ridiculous....bloody, bleeding ****ing out of their ****ing minds
ridiculous if subaru is telling anybody that using a 5w40 oil will cause CEL's or ANY issue...they need to pull their heads outa their collective ass and FIND THE REAL PROBLEM and not blame the ****ing oil bing used THAT is just bull****. |
10-09-2011, 03:30 PM | #24 |
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Might be nothing or it might be a cause to the problem, but what gas are you filling up with?
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10-09-2011, 05:02 PM | #25 | ||
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