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Old 05-12-2005, 01:32 AM   #51
Kostamojen
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scoobie Steve
Kostamojen I dont believe the Forester XT uses a STi gear set?? Steel shift forks??
No, but it has the 4.44 and a RA gearswap will work.
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Old 05-12-2005, 01:36 AM   #52
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Quote:
Originally Posted by silentbob343
Well then a US motor it is for me as I have to pass OBD-II emissions. Sucks because it also means no standalone EM.
Exactly. Gotta go with a reflash and stock-like parts to maintain the appearance of stock. You CAN get away with alot for smog checks, at least the ones ive been too, but your initial referee inspection to certify the car will need it to be very stock-ish if not a totally stock swap.

FYI the car I have now, which has a EJ25 swap into an L (bought the car from LIC motorsports) is certified by the state of california as legally swaped. Its running the proper ECU, passed referee inspection, everything. When it was certified, it also had a catback and a lightweight flywheel and ACT clutch. So there are things that you can very much do to get the car certified. After that, its up to you...
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Old 05-12-2005, 02:15 AM   #53
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Kostamojen

You don't have to worry about OBDII with your 95 or does Ca. have some state law?
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Old 05-12-2005, 02:55 AM   #54
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Originally Posted by silentbob343
Kostamojen

You don't have to worry about OBDII with your 95 or does Ca. have some state law?
I believe the law states that the ECU needs to be the ECU from that motor. And an OBD-I wont be able to run a 2000 motor very well, but it can be done, however emissions systems would be modified and it might not pass. This is a full ECU w/ harness swap.
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Old 05-12-2005, 03:54 AM   #55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nate1654
no usdm sti does not have avcs (the 05 might but i dont think so). if you got a AUS. utec you might be able to run a 2.5 but it would be pushing it hard and i really doubt it could work....but maybe. avcs (automatic valve control system) controls the cams (its like vtec by honda only better). whena certain rpm is reached it changes the profile of the cam making more aggressive (lets the valves stay open longer on the intake side). the avcs function is controled by a cam sensor that sends a singal to the ecu and the ecu sends a signal back to a seliniod thaat acivates the avcs. the reason a jdm v7/v8 ecu wont run a usdm 2.5 block with avcs heads is because the ecu also controls fuel injecton, timing and a few other things, all of these things are different on a 2.5 than a 2.0....i.e. a 2.5 gets more fuel etc.

Wow... So much wrong information here!

First off, The USDM STI has AVCS

Second, AVCS only changes cam timing... not duration... IT IS NOT LIKE A HONDA

Third, You can bolt up JDM heads on a USDM STI and it will run. Only problem is that compresion ratio will go up unless you get thicker head gaskets. A utec will have no problems making the changes needed on the stock ecu.
For people with a wrx or RS that want a 2.5 L block and ver 7/8 heads should run the ver 7/8 ecu. Again, you will have higher compresion so changes in will have to be made and a utec can do it.
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Old 05-12-2005, 08:57 AM   #56
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LOL, so much information

Quote:
Third, You can bolt up JDM heads on a USDM STI and it will run. Only problem is that compresion ratio will go up unless you get thicker head gaskets. A utec will have no problems making the changes needed on the stock ecu.
Is the above saying that one could retain the AVCS of the V7/8 heads with adjustments made by a UTEC? That would be great that way you retain OBDII and all the other legal garbage.
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Old 05-12-2005, 09:05 AM   #57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scoobie Steve
Case flex?? I am still laughing. The 5 spd case DOESNT flex. The person who started that BS smokes more crack then you. You could read the stickys in the transmission forum, you might learn something. And I totally agree an auto is a more consistent transmission for drag racing. But if you are making under 600whp like most of us the 5mt will be faster then an auto. Plus building an auto cost way more then a JDM 5mt.

Kostamojen I dont believe the Forester XT uses a STi gear set?? Steel shift forks??
Still no supporting facts I see. Thought maybe you had something to bring to this discussion other than your infactuation with a drug habit. You're not worth the time anymore.

EDIT: and if you had pulled your head out of your arse and posted something like this:

http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/showthread.php?t=665334

I might have been more receptive. Its called a supporting fact. And yes, I was wrong about the case flex.

Last edited by Tgui; 05-12-2005 at 09:11 AM.
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Old 05-12-2005, 10:34 AM   #58
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Quote:
Originally Posted by silentbob343
LOL, so much information

Is the above saying that one could retain the AVCS of the V7/8 heads with adjustments made by a UTEC? That would be great that way you retain OBDII and all the other legal garbage.
If you're running jdm v7/8 heads you need to be running the jdm v7/8 ecu to keep avcs. You can get a utec or ecutek for the jdm ecu to tune it for US gas. There are people on these forums who run the jdm ecu and pass state inspection, the jdm ecu still uses obd2.
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Old 05-12-2005, 12:10 PM   #59
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Quote:
Originally Posted by silentbob343

Is the above saying that one could retain the AVCS of the V7/8 heads with adjustments made by a UTEC? That would be great that way you retain OBDII and all the other legal garbage.
Yes, you can use the USDM STI ECU to control JDM heads.

Quote:
If you're running jdm v7/8 heads you need to be running the jdm v7/8 ecu to keep avcs. You can get a utec or ecutek for the jdm ecu to tune it for US gas. There are people on these forums who run the jdm ecu and pass state inspection, the jdm ecu still uses obd2.
Again, if you have an US sti you don't need the ver 7/8 ecu to run ver 7/8 heads. However you will most likely need EM to better adjust for the changes.

Also, you don't need to do any tuning for US gas with the JDM ecus. There are plenty of people who run ver 7/8 engines with the jdm ecu with no em on US pump with no problems. As long as you get a good 93 oct your fine. Keep in mind that I am talking about a stock Ver 7/8 with original turbo and a minimum of mods.
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Old 05-12-2005, 02:18 PM   #60
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Quote:
Originally Posted by codean
Yes, you can use the USDM STI ECU to control JDM heads.



.

Also, you don't need to do any tuning for US gas with the JDM ecus. There are plenty of people who run ver 7/8 engines with the jdm ecu with no em on US pump with no problems. As long as you get a good 93 oct your fine. Keep in mind that I am talking about a stock Ver 7/8 with original turbo and a minimum of mods.
i would just think a usdm would be easier to mod and better reliability
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Old 05-12-2005, 05:24 PM   #61
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I'd go with USDM too. a lot easier to get your hands on parts
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Old 05-12-2005, 08:11 PM   #62
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you do need tuning ona v8 or after a while you will mess it up bad. to run a v8 un-tuned it must run 100 octane min. fuel. running a v8 on 93 is a ticking time bomb.
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Old 05-13-2005, 02:32 AM   #63
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96-7 L awd coupe
ok here's my idea.. lets see what u guys have to say
v7 longblock, US wrx ecu???
if thats not possible, then what about v7 short-block, us wrx ecu, usdm sti heads, and say an AP streettuner for a reflash
Keep all the necessary cats n stuff in the DP and a map for smog.
run an internally gated green setup and get about 350whp?

Only reason i wouldnt run a wrx block is cuz they pop

I have a spare wrx tranny that i blew 2nd gear out of. I'll upgrade that to RA gears so i have a stronger tranny and it should handle the power.

Will the USDM heads(opinion on both) be ok to spin it to 8k? (i know power will suck).

how will wiring be?

is there really any electronic differences to a V7 block and a usdm block that an ECU would tell?

I should be able to pass inspection in NJ with this right?
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Old 05-13-2005, 03:53 AM   #64
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If you use a wrx ecu you will not be able to use avcs. Also you will still have to use your tumble generator valves too. USDM heads are not too much better then WRX heads. Same port size on both of them.
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Old 05-13-2005, 04:38 AM   #65
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okay first long block is a motor you buy that has heads. sort block is a motor you buy with out heads....same block. yes if you use a usdm ecu you will have to use the TGV....they suck. i have heard you can put a v8 intake manifold on a usdm block (v8 has no TGV) but i dont know what the ecu would say about that. with the set up you talked abou there you just as well go with a stock usdm wrx 2.0 and add the ap street tuner....that would be about 30 horse less than the set up you metioned. wiring would be all plug and play since you are changing nothing. the block is a 2.0 so the ecu will run it fine. the only different between a usdm and jdm block is the internals....v7 has fordged....everything else the same. you could run more boost on that motor but would not be anywhere close to 350 whp. the tranny on the other hand is a vry good idea. the usdm heads will spin 8k if they are sti heads....wrx heads wont do well but it has been done (i wouldnt).
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Old 05-13-2005, 02:49 PM   #66
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If you delete the TGVs it will throw a CEL. I don't belive it really does anything to harm the car but itll throw a CEL.

APS makes a TGV delete housing that will not throw a CEL, but they are pretty expensive.
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Old 05-13-2005, 03:00 PM   #67
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yeah i have seen the aps stuff....looks very nice. the TGV's are power buglars, if you are doing a rebuild try everything you can to get rid of them.
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Old 05-13-2005, 03:03 PM   #68
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Quote:
Originally Posted by burrito007
96-7 L awd coupe
ok here's my idea.. lets see what u guys have to say
v7 longblock, US wrx ecu???
if thats not possible, then what about v7 short-block, us wrx ecu, usdm sti heads, and say an AP streettuner for a reflash
Keep all the necessary cats n stuff in the DP and a map for smog.
run an internally gated green setup and get about 350whp?

Only reason i wouldnt run a wrx block is cuz they pop

I have a spare wrx tranny that i blew 2nd gear out of. I'll upgrade that to RA gears so i have a stronger tranny and it should handle the power.

Will the USDM heads(opinion on both) be ok to spin it to 8k? (i know power will suck).

how will wiring be?

is there really any electronic differences to a V7 block and a usdm block that an ECU would tell?

I should be able to pass inspection in NJ with this right?
You can run a v7 longblock, but will not be able to control avcs. IA performance sells a avcs wiring kit that will allow you to do so

You can also do your 2nd idea of v7 shortblock, wrx ecu, and sti heads with that reflash, but the only benefit you're getting with sti heads is better flow and better valvetrain
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Old 05-13-2005, 03:08 PM   #69
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nate1654
okay first long block is a motor you buy that has heads. sort block is a motor you buy with out heads....same block.


Quote:
Originally Posted by nate1654
the usdm heads will spin 8k if they are sti heads....wrx heads wont do well but it has been done (i wouldnt).
Just because the heads will allow 8k rpm doesn't mean it'll make power there. You can spin the US sti heads and wrx heads to 8k and get almost the same result unless modifications to the head are made
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Old 05-13-2005, 03:24 PM   #70
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thats not right. the usdm sti heads have a larger cam profile and built to spin past 8k. the usdm wrx should never do this (spin at 8k) not built for it. also the usdm sti have slightly larger bore meaning they can spin faster if you put them on a 2.0 becasue they can move more gas (exhaust and air) through them. so if you try to make wrx heads spin at 8k you will loose power. if you let the sti heads spin 8k on a 2.0 you should gain power.
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Old 05-13-2005, 03:29 PM   #71
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nate1654
thats not right. the usdm sti heads have a larger cam profile and built to spin past 8k. the usdm wrx should never do this (spin at 8k) not built for it. also the usdm sti have slightly larger bore meaning they can spin faster if you put them on a 2.0 becasue they can move more gas (exhaust and air) through them. so if you try to make wrx heads spin at 8k you will loose power. if you let the sti heads spin 8k on a 2.0 you should gain power.
If they were built to spin past 8k, then why are they setting the redline 1k lower than 8k? Both the US wrx and US sti have 7k rpm redlines. They do have a larger cam profile because it would fall on its face even faster than the wrx since the US sti is a 2.5. Also, just because you have a larger bore doesn't mean it can spin faster. You have a lot of things mixed up here. Gas is not a mixture of exhaust and air!!! Try spinning a US sti up to 8k and see if you make any more power. It's the same as the wrx trying to make power up there.
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Old 05-13-2005, 09:38 PM   #72
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i am not stupid...i know gas is not exhaust and air....exhaust and air are both gases however. If you have neen around shops much you refer to how much exhaust and air a head flows by saying :it flows more or less gas". i have seen a sti spin 8k all day long. i will talk to my friend who does nothing but subarus (upgrades) in LA....he will know. spining 8k may not give you more power but it will let you have ahigher red line which would cut donw 1/4 miles times.....a 2.0 is a high end motor if built right.
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Old 05-13-2005, 11:09 PM   #73
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Quote:
Originally Posted by petawabit
If they were built to spin past 8k, then why are they setting the redline 1k lower than 8k? Both the US wrx and US sti have 7k rpm redlines. They do have a larger cam profile because it would fall on its face even faster than the wrx since the US sti is a 2.5. Also, just because you have a larger bore doesn't mean it can spin faster. You have a lot of things mixed up here. Gas is not a mixture of exhaust and air!!! Try spinning a US sti up to 8k and see if you make any more power. It's the same as the wrx trying to make power up there.

I have to disagree. The UK sti heads have the smaller ports and they will rev to 8000 from factory Map
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Old 05-14-2005, 03:51 AM   #74
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nate1654
i am not stupid...i know gas is not exhaust and air....exhaust and air are both gases however. If you have neen around shops much you refer to how much exhaust and air a head flows by saying :it flows more or less gas". i have seen a sti spin 8k all day long. i will talk to my friend who does nothing but subarus (upgrades) in LA....he will know. spining 8k may not give you more power but it will let you have ahigher red line which would cut donw 1/4 miles times.....a 2.0 is a high end motor if built right.
See, the thing is, you're not being specific and mentioning WHICH sti you're talking about. Are you talking about the US or JDM one? It's like saying, my old ae86 corolla redlines at 6, but I can spin it to 8k. Whats the diff in spinning it up there if it doesn't make any power?
Built right? I thought we were talking about stock motors? You can "build" anything right
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Old 05-14-2005, 03:53 AM   #75
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I have to disagree. The UK sti heads have the smaller ports and they will rev to 8000 from factory Map
Does the UK sti have a 2.5 or is it similiar to the US sti?
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