1st gear grind...

THE ONE · 10-27-2009, 03:56 PM

I know this is a common problem, though I never experienced it before until this scooby. Is there anything I can do to fix this problem other than replacing the gearset? I won't drop the cash for that and it's just 1st gear that grinds if I put it in that gear going more than 4mph.

SpankySuby · 10-27-2009, 05:48 PM

I always thought the STI's have a dual syncro for first to combat that problem unlike mine that has one.

First thing i would try is put in Unclescottys cocktail that should clear it up quite well deff did for me.

I put in a ra gearset and tried to use straight up one type of oil worked for about 2 months and started to just get the little grr so once i heard it put in the cocktail or my own version of it and BINGO got nuthin and its been almost 2 years not a problem.

THE ONE · 10-27-2009, 06:08 PM

Sorry, this is on my 2002 WRX

kpluiten · 10-27-2009, 06:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SpankySuby

I always thought the STI's have a dual syncro for first to combat that problem unlike mine that has one.

First thing i would try is put in Unclescottys cocktail that should clear it up quite well deff did for me.

I put in a ra gearset and tried to use straight up one type of oil worked for about 2 months and started to just get the little grr so once i heard it put in the cocktail or my own version of it and BINGO got nuthin and its been almost 2 years not a problem.

First off OP, the gearset is not the problem and does not need to be replaced. The synchros are the problem and those may need replacement. While the box is open, you might as well do all of them. That's a few hundred in parts (maybe $300?), but the labor will run >$1000.

Second, DO NOT use the uncle scotty's cocktail in that 6spd without some research. Many people report having problems with it and some claim it gums up the internal oil pump, something the 5spds do not have to worry about.

There is a good oil thread for the 6spd in the trans technical forum. However, 1st gear grind is not a good thing. I really don't hear or see that particular gear grind often in the 6spd without abuse. 4th and 5th on the earlier boxes (04 and 05) is very common. I don't hear about 06+ boxes grinding hardly ever. Like I said, that doesn't look good...

Do you try to force it into 1st without rev matching? This will kill them fast.

kpluiten · 10-27-2009, 06:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by THE ONE

Sorry, this is on my 2002 WRX

Well, **** then, ignore my post.

WgnWheel · 10-27-2009, 06:37 PM

get the tranny fluid replaced with something good, and see if that helps. avoid shifting into first until the car is at a stop. i had 4th gear syncro go bad and replaced the fluid and mixed it with a thicker redline additive, and the grind went away.

THE ONE · 10-27-2009, 06:46 PM

Wow, well it just seems ridiculous for me to have to always be at a damn stop to change to first gear. That is a danger in everyday driving. What kind of oil do you recommend?

kpluiten · 10-27-2009, 07:34 PM

1 quart motul 300 and 3 quarts Redline shockproof... or maybe it's the other way around, but that's what I've always heard. Dunno, I always used Valvoline in my 5MT whan I had it and it sucked as a fluid. However, it was cheap.

furryfootstool · 10-27-2009, 07:47 PM

i've never been able to get my car into first gear rolling. well, i almost need to be completely stopped to do it. not sure if there is anything wrong. i remember my car was like that from the factory

Mcahol3 · 10-27-2009, 08:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by furryfootstool

i've never been able to get my car into first gear rolling. well, i almost need to be completely stopped to do it. not sure if there is anything wrong. i remember my car was like that from the factory

+1

when i had my 5spd

kpluiten · 10-27-2009, 08:37 PM

Yeah, I can't say I miss the 5MT at all except for the tall gears in my 06 box. It had a lot of bad habits.

ShaggyTR · 10-27-2009, 09:04 PM

yeah i have to be going 1mph or less to get into 1st gear

and reverse is sometimes hard to get into unless you roll forward a little then put it in

subynewb · 10-28-2009, 12:22 AM

I've found double clutching seems to work when going a few mph and trying to put it into 1st. sometimes rev matching works. Double clutching seems to work best out of the two, just a pain to do

WgnWheel · 10-28-2009, 12:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by THE ONE

Wow, well it just seems ridiculous for me to have to always be at a damn stop to change to first gear. That is a danger in everyday driving. What kind of oil do you recommend?

im not really sure when you need first gear driving around, other than from a start

you shouldn't be downshifting into 1st unless the car is almost stopped, that's normal for any car. doing so is more dangerous.

wiresix17 · 10-28-2009, 01:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WgnWheel

get the tranny fluid replaced with something good, and see if that helps. avoid shifting into first until the car is at a stop. i had 4th gear syncro go bad and replaced the fluid and mixed it with a thicker redline additive, and the grind went away.

do you remember exactly what you used? I have the same 4th gear syncro grind, and I'd love to at least try to get rid of it the easy way.

also, to the OP:

I double clutch. it works very well, but if you over rev it grinds even worse. just practice a little. it's good for those times when you're doing under 3-7 mph, and 2nd would be a little too soon...

Soccerkid52688 · 10-28-2009, 01:51 AM

does anyone read the manual to the car? its there for a reason lol.... Subaru made this on purpose. you are not suppose to go into first unless you are in a complete stop... and thats the only time you should be in first...to get the car going

kpluiten · 10-28-2009, 02:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Soccerkid52688

does anyone read the manual to the car? its there for a reason lol.... Subaru made this on purpose. you are not suppose to go into first unless you are in a complete stop... and thats the only time you should be in first...to get the car going

You! Out of SWIC!

brocksdad · 10-28-2009, 04:08 AM

I had a grind going into 4th and had to be completely stopped to shift into first. I switched over to Redline Lightweight Shockproof and no more problems.

Soccerkid52688 · 10-28-2009, 04:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kpluiten

You! Out of SWIC!

just trying to help out lol dont hate

THE ONE · 10-28-2009, 10:33 AM

To the guy questioning my point, it become VERY important to put the car into first gear to get the hell out of the way when making a turn!!! The kind of turn like a California stop at a yield sign or when leaving a parking lot to get onto a road. I don't want to bog way down and get slammed in the ass or make somebody hit the brakes just so I can turn like a normal damn car should be able to do!

To the other guys, TYVM for the info. I will try the double clutching thing first and then use that oil formula to see if that helps at all.

WgnWheel · 10-28-2009, 08:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wiresix17

do you remember exactly what you used? I have the same 4th gear syncro grind, and I'd love to at least try to get rid of it the easy way.

also, to the OP:

I double clutch. it works very well, but if you over rev it grinds even worse. just practice a little. it's good for those times when you're doing under 3-7 mph, and 2nd would be a little too soon...

i don't remember exactly what i used at the time, other than it was redline fluid with a quart of lightweight shockproof. shockproof really works well.

WgnWheel · 10-28-2009, 08:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by THE ONE

To the guy questioning my point, it become VERY important to put the car into first gear to get the hell out of the way when making a turn!!! The kind of turn like a California stop at a yield sign or when leaving a parking lot to get onto a road. I don't want to bog way down and get slammed in the ass or make somebody hit the brakes just so I can turn like a normal damn car should be able to do!

To the other guys, TYVM for the info. I will try the double clutching thing first and then use that oil formula to see if that helps at all.

I still really don't understand, i've been driving stick for 20 years and have never needed to slam down into first gear to avoid an accident or yield. Maybe you should work on leaving more space and checking your surroundings more? Not being a azz, just a serious suggestion.

It specifically states in the wrx manual, to not shift into first unless at a stop.

My advice would be to change the fluid, add some redline lightweight shockproof and change your 1st gear habits...or don't complain when you need to rebuild the tranny.

bobturismo · 10-29-2009, 01:38 AM

Either you have to change your driving habits or you have to get better at rev-matching.

I'm always aware that I have to almost stop to get first. Once in a HUGE while (not that I drive my car much) I need to get into first on a roll and I know I'm abusing my car when I do it.

I never have anyone rev on me, but I get these kids in their scion coupes, that must have blowers or something stupid that just won't leave me alone. Sometimes I need to make my point to these kids so I can give them the "thumbs up, slowly rotated to thumbs down, gladiator style", that REALLY pisses people off.

DroppedClutch · 10-29-2009, 01:45 AM

My fav trans fluid by far is Silkolene's Silktran Syn 5. I started running it early 2007. It's getting harder to find in the states than it used to be, and it is kind of expensive (~$29/liter), but it's real nice stuff. Here's what Dave@Rallispec told MrMcCrackin when he was researching early last year...

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dave@Rallispec

My best recommendation for fluids would be Silkolene SYN5 gear oil. This is a GL5 oil, fully synthetic (full ester type synthetic with really good “stay-in-grade” high temp performance) which is blended for both good LSD operation and also good synchro performance (these two things tend to have opposite requirements so it requires a very careful blend of oil additives to get the best compromise). Most synthetics that work well with a clutch type LSD don’t have the friction characteristics necessary for optimum synchro performance. So you have to be careful here.

poserskaterboy · 10-29-2009, 10:35 AM

my wife had an 02 wrx and I have an sti (owned it during the wrx ownership)...instead of shifting fast into 1st [from second], I would just fully clutch and hold the shifter against the gate until it slipped in, I would say it grinded about 1/4th of what it used to after that. Shifting was a bit slower but we never raced it, so it wasn't a big deal. If you autocross though...might be a different story. Rev-matching only works if you match it perfectly unfortunately, you'll probably go crazy before you find the sweet spot.
Sucks that so many of these came from the factory like this.

10-27-2009, 03:56 PM	#1
THE ONE Scooby Newbie Member#: 43918 Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Phoenix Arizona Vehicle: 2007 Subaru STI Blue	1st gear grind... I know this is a common problem, though I never experienced it before until this scooby. Is there anything I can do to fix this problem other than replacing the gearset? I won't drop the cash for that and it's just 1st gear that grinds if I put it in that gear going more than 4mph.

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10-27-2009, 05:48 PM	#2
SpankySuby Scooby Newbie Member#: 122305 Join Date: Aug 2006 Chapter/Region: SWIC Location: Tempe, Az Vehicle: 2002 wrx half breed Aspen White	I always thought the STI's have a dual syncro for first to combat that problem unlike mine that has one. First thing i would try is put in Unclescottys cocktail that should clear it up quite well deff did for me. I put in a ra gearset and tried to use straight up one type of oil worked for about 2 months and started to just get the little grr so once i heard it put in the cocktail or my own version of it and BINGO got nuthin and its been almost 2 years not a problem.

10-27-2009, 06:08 PM	#3
THE ONE Scooby Newbie Member#: 43918 Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Phoenix Arizona Vehicle: 2007 Subaru STI Blue	Sorry, this is on my 2002 WRX

10-27-2009, 06:37 PM	#6
WgnWheel Scooby Specialist Member#: 63605 Join Date: Jun 2004 Chapter/Region: SWIC Location: Moms...yours Vehicle: 04 Wrx Wagon -TTS 08 Titan, 08 MX-5	get the tranny fluid replaced with something good, and see if that helps. avoid shifting into first until the car is at a stop. i had 4th gear syncro go bad and replaced the fluid and mixed it with a thicker redline additive, and the grind went away.

10-27-2009, 06:46 PM	#7
THE ONE Scooby Newbie Member#: 43918 Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Phoenix Arizona Vehicle: 2007 Subaru STI Blue	Wow, well it just seems ridiculous for me to have to always be at a damn stop to change to first gear. That is a danger in everyday driving. What kind of oil do you recommend?

10-27-2009, 07:34 PM	#8
kpluiten Scooby Guru Member#: 120273 Join Date: Jul 2006 Chapter/Region: SWIC Location: AZ Vehicle: 06 WRBWRXWGN I install stuff cheap.	1 quart motul 300 and 3 quarts Redline shockproof... or maybe it's the other way around, but that's what I've always heard. Dunno, I always used Valvoline in my 5MT whan I had it and it sucked as a fluid. However, it was cheap.

10-27-2009, 07:47 PM	#9
furryfootstool Scooby Specialist Member#: 200526 Join Date: Jan 2009 Chapter/Region: SWIC Location: Queen Creek Vehicle: 02 WRX-EVOIII/16g PSM	i've never been able to get my car into first gear rolling. well, i almost need to be completely stopped to do it. not sure if there is anything wrong. i remember my car was like that from the factory

10-27-2009, 08:37 PM	#11
kpluiten Scooby Guru Member#: 120273 Join Date: Jul 2006 Chapter/Region: SWIC Location: AZ Vehicle: 06 WRBWRXWGN I install stuff cheap.	Yeah, I can't say I miss the 5MT at all except for the tall gears in my 06 box. It had a lot of bad habits.

10-27-2009, 09:04 PM	#12
ShaggyTR Scooby Specialist Member#: 197159 Join Date: Dec 2008 Chapter/Region: SWIC Location: 520 :( Vehicle: 06 WRX SGM Japanese Muscle	yeah i have to be going 1mph or less to get into 1st gear and reverse is sometimes hard to get into unless you roll forward a little then put it in

10-28-2009, 12:22 AM	#13
subynewb Scooby Newbie Member#: 224049 Join Date: Sep 2009 Chapter/Region: SWIC Location: Tempe,AZ Vehicle: 2002 wrx wagon midnight blue	I've found double clutching seems to work when going a few mph and trying to put it into 1st. sometimes rev matching works. Double clutching seems to work best out of the two, just a pain to do

10-28-2009, 01:51 AM	#16
Soccerkid52688 Scooby Newbie Member#: 223892 Join Date: Sep 2009 Chapter/Region: Tri-State Location: NY Vehicle: 2002 wrx sedan Silver	does anyone read the manual to the car? its there for a reason lol.... Subaru made this on purpose. you are not suppose to go into first unless you are in a complete stop... and thats the only time you should be in first...to get the car going

10-28-2009, 04:08 AM	#18
brocksdad Scooby Newbie Member#: 107352 Join Date: Feb 2006 Chapter/Region: SWIC Location: OS SD FTW Vehicle: 02 WRX Wagon	I had a grind going into 4th and had to be completely stopped to shift into first. I switched over to Redline Lightweight Shockproof and no more problems.

10-28-2009, 10:33 AM	#20
THE ONE Scooby Newbie Member#: 43918 Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Phoenix Arizona Vehicle: 2007 Subaru STI Blue	To the guy questioning my point, it become VERY important to put the car into first gear to get the hell out of the way when making a turn!!! The kind of turn like a California stop at a yield sign or when leaving a parking lot to get onto a road. I don't want to bog way down and get slammed in the ass or make somebody hit the brakes just so I can turn like a normal damn car should be able to do! To the other guys, TYVM for the info. I will try the double clutching thing first and then use that oil formula to see if that helps at all.

10-29-2009, 01:38 AM	#23
bobturismo Scooby Specialist Member#: 42145 Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: cruizin' down the street in my Vehicle: 6-4 jockin da bish- es and slappin the ho's.	Either you have to change your driving habits or you have to get better at rev-matching. I'm always aware that I have to almost stop to get first. Once in a HUGE while (not that I drive my car much) I need to get into first on a roll and I know I'm abusing my car when I do it. I never have anyone rev on me, but I get these kids in their scion coupes, that must have blowers or something stupid that just won't leave me alone. Sometimes I need to make my point to these kids so I can give them the "thumbs up, slowly rotated to thumbs down, gladiator style", that REALLY pisses people off.

10-29-2009, 10:35 AM	#25
poserskaterboy Scooby Newbie Member#: 189351 Join Date: Sep 2008 Chapter/Region: South East Location: jville, nc Vehicle: 2008 WRX STi Aspen White	my wife had an 02 wrx and I have an sti (owned it during the wrx ownership)...instead of shifting fast into 1st [from second], I would just fully clutch and hold the shifter against the gate until it slipped in, I would say it grinded about 1/4th of what it used to after that. Shifting was a bit slower but we never raced it, so it wasn't a big deal. If you autocross though...might be a different story. Rev-matching only works if you match it perfectly unfortunately, you'll probably go crazy before you find the sweet spot. Sucks that so many of these came from the factory like this.