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Old 05-03-2009, 01:13 AM   #101
watchunglava
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Well like I said I had them really stiff at one point and the wouldn't budge and I felt like I was riding on slinkys.

You really think I'm riding way too stiff where I'm gonna be liftting the wheel from contact?

Because I definatly like the feel of them better around 4 turns.
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Old 05-05-2009, 04:58 AM   #102
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The Prodrive Blues Spring rates are 215 Front and 195 Rear. Stock spring rates on a WAGON are 163 Front and 132 Rear, respectively. The Prodrives are definitely stiffer than stock, and from what I've read, are progressive.

I did follow the advice from williaty and softened them up a bit (for break in) more--5.5 Rear 4.5 Front--and I'm liking it. I tried full soft and the setup was just too soft for me, the car felt, well, buoyant. Not bouncy per se, but unpredictable at best. I like where I'm at now, since the D-specs have definitely stiffened up since installation. Knowing me, like many of us here on NASIOC, I'll probably have different springs by the end of the summer but for now, I'm liking my ride quality and improved handling. Now on to the brakes....
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Old 05-05-2009, 07:59 AM   #103
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kpatler View Post
The Prodrive Blues Spring rates are 215 Front and 195 Rear. Stock spring rates on a WAGON are 163 Front and 132 Rear, respectively. The Prodrives are definitely stiffer than stock, and from what I've read, are progressive.
I thought the Prodrive's were tested and the rates were more like 175/175?

R-
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Old 05-05-2009, 09:24 PM   #104
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RCE wagon springs 278/259. Front 3.25 turns, rear 5 turns from full stiff. So far, these settings feel very close to perfect in all situations I've driven them in with these springs (DD, "spirited" twisty runs up hills, and autox).

I previously ran with Swift wagon springs and had the fronts at 5.25 turns ffs and the rears at 6.25 turns ffs. The rates on those springs are 185/162. I was still working with them when I switched to the RCE's but I was close.

Springs: RCE Wagon Springs 279/258
Sways: Hotchkis hollow 25.4 mm fixed front/Hotchkis hollow 25.4 mm 3 way adjustable rear (on soft)
End Links: Hotchkis front/rear
Strut Mounts: Group N front/rear
Strut bar: Whiteline quick release rear bar
Bushings and mounts: Cusco Engine & Tranny, TiC Race Klunk Killer, TiC Tranny Crossmember bushings, KB Pitch Stop Mount, KB front/rear shifter stay bushings
Tires/Wheels: Dunlop Direzza Star Specs 235/40/17/OZ Allegerita HTS 17x8

I still need more than 1.5* of front camber (probably 3.0*) and a bigger front bar to maximize this setup.

-Tom

Last edited by mulva; 11-20-2009 at 01:25 PM. Reason: bumped f/r settings up
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Old 05-09-2009, 03:03 PM   #105
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.......

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Old 05-20-2009, 10:35 PM   #106
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I have no idea on what to set mine at, its a DD and the car has
D-specs
Swift sport springs
Whiteline 22 mm adj rear sway and
KB endlinks
ohhh and RE92

I know I need to get better tires, but what is the difference, if you set all 4 at 1 turn. Or if you set all 4 at 6 turns=this is just to get the basic idea?
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Old 05-21-2009, 07:44 AM   #107
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Tokico D-specs
STi take-offs ('05)
GroupN tophats front and rear

Front: 3.5
Rear: 5

This is close but still need some minor tweaking. I think i will soften the front a tad first.
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Old 05-24-2009, 04:23 PM   #108
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wrxSIN View Post
07 WRX ~16k
4 turns from stiff (FRONT) 4.5 TFFStiff (REAR) - DD
Full stiff F/R for auto-x
RCE blacks
Ride height from center of hub to metal edge of fender - UNKNOWN
Group-n fronts, stock rears
none
sti bbs - re01rs
-1.4f/-1r
Comments - First auto-x season with dspecs. will be playing around with settings.
For my first auto-x, i tried 3f/3.5r and it felt a little sloppy.
For my most recent, i tried 2f/2.5r and it felt alot better.
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Old 06-26-2009, 11:40 AM   #109
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I have a 2003 WRX with 225/14/18 tires. I installed the d-spec suspension kit with the matched springs on stock tophats about 3 weeks ago. I just found out from tokico that the spring rates are 205 front and 170 rear. I have it set at 5 turns FFH front and rear right now because it was what is recommended and it feels pretty stiff for a DD right now. What would you guys suggest as a good starting point? I'm thinking about going 6 FFH front and back and making 1/8 turn changes from there.
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Old 06-26-2009, 12:25 PM   #110
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Those spring rates really are pretty soft. Based on my experiences with the D-Specs, I'm pretty sure you're overdamped right now. I would try your idea of turning them down to no stiffer than 6FFS in the front and maybe 1/2-ish turn stiffer than that in the rear. Keep in mind that if these are brand new D-Specs, they get slightly softer over the first few thousand miles. You may want to turn them a little farther down that other people have been saying. Over time, you'll slowly turn them back up as the dampers break in.

-Ty
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Old 06-26-2009, 03:11 PM   #111
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Find yourself a setting that works for you for now, until they wear in. I thought they got a little firmer once they're broken in.

And what I did, and this isn't the only metric you want to apply to tuning your dampening settings by far, but I found a route that seems to have all of the kinds of abuse that I would normally expect to see in a daily drive (without the full-length), and drove that starting from maybe a half turn hard from where I thought it should be. Drive that, and take out a quarter or eighth of a turn, and drive it again. You should be able to feel the difference.

I forgot who said it, but you can feel the bumps, and your car should simply soak up the bumps. If you go over the bump, and your car springs up at the front of the bump, then you are over-dampened. If your car springs up after the bump, you're under-dampened.

I don't know if you have any long smooth curves near you, but you should be able to drive into the turn, and feel the car settle almost immediately, and if you can drive it (legally?) anywhere near your limits, you should be able to feel how small corrections affect your adhesion in the turns. Due to weight, and typical spring rate balance, you should have just a bit of under steer under power, which you should be able to translate to neutral or very mild over steer when you lift. If there are very many bumps, transitions, ruts, potholes, etc. then I wouldn't suggest doing this.

I tried using the mathematical approach, and it still felt way over dampened. It would spring up at the beginning of the bump, and the ride was very harsh. So I started there, and softened it a bit until all felt right with the world. I think I still need to take an eighth of a turn out of the rear, but I think I'll be alright.

RD
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Old 06-30-2009, 06:13 PM   #112
breadstick
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Turn in Concepts View Post
Those spring rates really are pretty soft. Based on my experiences with the D-Specs, I'm pretty sure you're overdamped right now. I would try your idea of turning them down to no stiffer than 6FFS in the front and maybe 1/2-ish turn stiffer than that in the rear. Keep in mind that if these are brand new D-Specs, they get slightly softer over the first few thousand miles. You may want to turn them a little farther down that other people have been saying. Over time, you'll slowly turn them back up as the dampers break in.

-Ty
By 6FFS, do you mean 6 turns from full soft? Isn't that 1.5 turns from full hard?
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Old 06-30-2009, 07:32 PM   #113
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Doh, From Full Stiff is what I had meant. Bad way to phrase that. Yeah, turn it down to almost full soft for now, once the dampers begin to wear in, you'll find yourself turning them up to maintain equivalent damping.
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Old 07-01-2009, 07:06 PM   #114
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I figured I was understanding you wrong. I'll do that. Thanks for the help.
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Old 07-02-2009, 03:08 AM   #115
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Cool Luv my D-specs

MY, bodystyle, mileage: 2004, 2.5RS, 47,000

Number of turns f/r from FULL STIFF(If changing settings for different driving situations please note): street 5.5 F&R, autocross (approx) FR:3.75 RR:4-4.5 (still fine tuning on course)

Springs including MY if hats have been swapped for newer MY and rates if known: Prodrive blues for '04

Ride height from center of hub to metal edge of fender(if known): FR:15" RR: 14.5"

Hats/camber plates: FR: Cusco camber plates RR: Group N tophats

SHORT list of supporting suspension mods(no need to list every bushing replaced): Rolled rear fenders, adjustment extenders, 22mm Whiteline FSB w/ Cusco endlinks, 22-24-26 Whiteline RSB w/Mr. Joshes endlinks

I did a non conventional install on my struts. I'm using Cusco plates. I had a machine shop tap out the nuts. I also had the shop make a custom socket to use with a pass-thru socket to really secure the top nuts properly. I had the rear struts slotted to allow up to -2º of camber. I also did not use 921 spacers. I found my own way to secure 2004 tophats to the D-specs which in my opinion secures the rear strut far more securely. My suspension is completely quiet. Not a peep from anypart anywhere.

Tire/Wheel combo: Street: 225/50R16 Conti Extreme Contacts/stock wheels
Autocross: 235/45R17 Direzza Star Specs/ Rota Tarmac wheels 17x7.5"

Alignment specs if known: FR toe:0" RR toe:0" FR camber: -1.5º (street) -3º (autox) RR camber -1.8º (adjusting to -3º for autocross adds about .25" toe-out)

Comments: The struts were the last piece of the puzzle. Street driving is great. Compliant but firm, very nice really, better than I expected and better than the stock struts which were greatly overwhelmed by the stiffer springs and swaybars.

So far I have 4 autocross events on them and I'm still fine tuning. They feel great and add a lot of stability during turn in and steady state turn, but as I said I'm still tweaking.

In short I'm very glad I got them and I really love them. The D-specs were the last piece I needed to bring my suspension together. The car is fast locally and I believe I'm the only one in STX running strut/springs as everyone else is running coilovers.
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Old 07-02-2009, 03:08 PM   #116
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Turn in Concepts View Post
Those spring rates really are pretty soft. Based on my experiences with the D-Specs, I'm pretty sure you're overdamped right now. I would try your idea of turning them down to no stiffer than 6FFS in the front and maybe 1/2-ish turn stiffer than that in the rear. Keep in mind that if these are brand new D-Specs, they get slightly softer over the first few thousand miles. You may want to turn them a little farther down that other people have been saying. Over time, you'll slowly turn them back up as the dampers break in.

-Ty
You are a genius. I adjusted them how you said and took a spin around base (which has ridiculously bad roads in some spots) and this is the way my car should have felt from the factory. I know I'll be changing the damping as the d-specs break in, but I am in love with the feel of them now.
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Old 07-02-2009, 03:11 PM   #117
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Quote:
Originally Posted by breadstick View Post
You are a genius. I adjusted them how you said and took a spin around base (which has ridiculously bad roads in some spots) and this is the way my car should have felt from the factory. I know I'll be changing the damping as the d-specs break in, but I am in love with the feel of them now.
Awesome! Glad to hear that you're happy. Always nice to get called a genius.

-Ty
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Old 07-02-2009, 04:14 PM   #118
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do u want the d-spec setting more stiff in the front or in the rear?
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Old 07-02-2009, 04:37 PM   #119
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Neither, you want both ends matched to the spring on that end. So the difference (in turns) between front and rear will depend on which springs you're running. Also, the front and rear dampers are different strengths. So 5 turns on the front does not equal 5 turns on the rear. You gotta twist knobs until it feels good.

-Ty
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Old 07-02-2009, 04:39 PM   #120
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Quote:
Originally Posted by williaty View Post
Neither, you want both ends matched to the spring on that end. So the difference (in turns) between front and rear will depend on which springs you're running. Also, the front and rear dampers are different strengths. So 5 turns on the front does not equal 5 turns on the rear. You gotta twist knobs until it feels good.

-Ty
I just got the d-specs installed along with the eibach pro kit and i have 5 turns in the front and 4 in the rear, but right now they feel really stiff, but is that like some of the previous post mentioned they just need to break in first?
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Old 07-02-2009, 04:41 PM   #121
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Personally, I think 5/4 is WAY too stiff for Eibachs, even after the D-Specs are broken in. The Eibachs are really soft springs. Much softer than my STi take offs, and I'm at something like -5.875/-5.75 on my D-Specs and these suckers are WAY softer than they were to begin with. So I'm at something probably near -6.5 on "new" D-specs.

-Ty
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Old 07-02-2009, 04:45 PM   #122
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Quote:
Originally Posted by williaty View Post
Personally, I think 5/4 is WAY too stiff for Eibachs, even after the D-Specs are broken in. The Eibachs are really soft springs. Much softer than my STi take offs, and I'm at something like -5.875/-5.75 on my D-Specs and these suckers are WAY softer than they were to begin with. So I'm at something probably near -6.5 on "new" D-specs.

-Ty
so are you saying i should get some different springs or just wait a bit and tweek with them a little bit?
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Old 07-02-2009, 04:58 PM   #123
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Soften the dampers up until they feel right. Stick with what you have for now.

In the long run, yes, get better springs. The Eibachs are too low and too soft. I've also seen several sets of Eibach springs literally fall apart. They're not springs I'd choose to run.

-Ty
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Old 07-07-2009, 02:11 PM   #124
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Hey Ty,

I have a line on some gf210's but I have yet to hear from the guy on what year they are. I believe they are 04, but I would like them to be 05-07. How do the 04 GF210's (240.7 lb/in Front and 223.9 lb/in Rear) compare to the STI take offs you have on the wagon?

If you remember from last February when you last saw my car it was on WRX struts with STI springs. Now it's back to stock. I want something that's going to be stiffer than what I had, but still good for DD and RallyX.
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Old 07-07-2009, 02:51 PM   #125
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The USDM STi springs are roughly 224/193. So the GF210s are a little stiffer. However, if the GF210s are ANY lower than the STi springs AT ALL, they're going to be too low.

-Ty
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