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01-02-2015, 12:19 PM | #1 |
Scooby Newbie
Member#: 406620
Join Date: Nov 2014
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MWSOC
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Vehicle:2019 WRX STi World Rally Blue |
Adding battery acid to battery verse replacing battery
So I was talking with my uncle on Christmas about my new car and up came the point that I'm pretty sure my battery about to go with all the cold weather coming around and thing about replacing my battery. He said for the past 5 years he has just been adding battery acid to his boat battery because after every winter his battery his dead and that a lot cheaper then buying a new battery every year and he said I should be able to do the same thing with a my car battery. So I was wondering if anyone has heard of this before or has done it themselves? Also if you now any reasons why this would be bad to do?
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01-02-2015, 12:39 PM | #2 |
Trust no one
Moderator Member#: 11170
Join Date: Oct 2001
Chapter/Region:
Tri-State
Location: NYC
Vehicle:02 RAV4 MT 15 WRX/11 CRZ |
You aren't supposed to add acid. If the battery has removable cell caps you add distilled water to the proper level and then charge the battery on a charger. Assuming the battery is in good condition the water will be converted into acid through the chemical reaction that occurs during charging.
If regular charging doesn't bring the battery back to a full state of charge on all cells, the plates are probably sulfated or shorted. Some chargers have a reconditioning cycle to remove or reduce sulfation but if that doesn't work the battery is junk. Let your uncle pour acid into his boat battery, but if your car battery takes a dump just go to the store and get a new one (or trade the old one in if it still has warranty). |
01-02-2015, 12:44 PM | #3 | |
Scooby Newbie
Member#: 406620
Join Date: Nov 2014
Chapter/Region:
MWSOC
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Quote:
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01-02-2015, 02:53 PM | #4 | ||
Trust no one
Moderator Member#: 11170
Join Date: Oct 2001
Chapter/Region:
Tri-State
Location: NYC
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Quote:
Here's something I found looking around- Quote:
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01-02-2015, 09:04 PM | #5 |
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I will NEVER buy another 'flooded cell' lead/acid battery EVER again.
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01-18-2015, 03:18 PM | #6 |
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W. Canada
Vehicle:2004 WRX STI White |
Could consider a battery blanket? Might help out a little bit and they're relatively cheap to buy.
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11-02-2015, 10:02 AM | #7 |
Scooby Specialist
Member#: 198067
Join Date: Dec 2008
Chapter/Region:
Tri-State
Location: RAMSEY, NJ
Vehicle:2009 IMPREZA 2.5i 4d WHITE Premium |
I added this to my battery last week. the open circuit voltage was 12.11v before
adding and is now 12.40v. http://www.amazon.com/Solder-It-Charge-It-Concentrated-Battery-Additive/dp/B000AMBOA8 I use this to test the voltage in the morning before starting. http://www.amazon.com/INNOVA-3721-Battery-Charging-Monitor/dp/B000EVWDU0 |
11-02-2015, 10:02 AM | #8 |
Scooby Specialist
Member#: 198067
Join Date: Dec 2008
Chapter/Region:
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This is my original battery (over 6 1/2 years old).
Last edited by CRAZYHAWK; 11-02-2015 at 10:23 AM. Reason: Double post |
11-02-2015, 11:31 AM | #9 |
Scooby Specialist
Member#: 266122
Join Date: Dec 2010
Chapter/Region:
Tri-State
Location: Patchogue, NY
Vehicle:2007 WRX Limited UGM |
Penney wise and pound foolish. That tester is useless for testing the condition of your battery. With very little surface area on the plates you will measure full charge. The problem is the battery cannot supply the cranking current.
Lead acid batteries are wear item and need to be replaced. Is the cost of a new battery worth the inconvienience and cost of being stranded someplace? The fix will be a new battery. Replacing the battery before it fails is called preventative maintenance. |
11-02-2015, 11:42 AM | #10 | |
Scooby Specialist
Member#: 198067
Join Date: Dec 2008
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Testing the battery while drawing 300 amps would be better. With the door
open observing the interior light while cranking also gives a good indication of the state of charge of the battery. Mine is better now. This product will not work on a mechanically bad battery. I used this product back in the 1970s with reasonable results. Quote:
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11-02-2015, 11:52 AM | #11 |
Scooby Specialist
Member#: 266122
Join Date: Dec 2010
Chapter/Region:
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Vehicle:2007 WRX Limited UGM |
If you can use the dome light, why buy the meter? There is the right way and to test a charging system and then all other ways. This is an other way.
Get a DMM, a clamp on ammeter rated for greater than the max output of your alternator. These tools are much more useful than a cigarette lighter powered meter. You can get the same readings from your Accessport as from this meter. I used two 6 volt batteries in series for my old MGB. Doesn't mean anything today. Messing around with an old battery with today's sophisticated electronics is a badddddd idea. Save $80.00 on a battery and damage a $400.00 ECU. |
11-02-2015, 03:00 PM | #12 |
Scooby Specialist
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Join Date: Dec 2008
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11-02-2015, 03:17 PM | #13 |
Scooby Specialist
Member#: 266122
Join Date: Dec 2010
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No it doesn't. One of these days, when I'm really bored, I'll write a tutorial on how to troubleshoot and test the charging system.
In a nutshell, the alternator is a current generator and a voltmeter measures, well, volts. See the problem? |
11-02-2015, 03:26 PM | #14 |
Scooby Specialist
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Join Date: Dec 2008
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LIChuck "No it doesn't. One of these days, when I'm really bored, I'll write a tutorial on how to troubleshoot and test the charging system.
In a nutshell, the alternator is a current generator and a voltmeter measures, well, volts. See the problem?" There is a resistive load on the system. E = I x R Voltage and current are proportionally related. Last edited by CRAZYHAWK; 11-02-2015 at 04:11 PM. |
11-03-2015, 09:39 AM | #15 | |
Scooby Specialist
Member#: 198067
Join Date: Dec 2008
Chapter/Region:
Tri-State
Location: RAMSEY, NJ
Vehicle:2009 IMPREZA 2.5i 4d WHITE Premium |
Quote:
How is an old battery in reasonable condition going to damage an ECU? |
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11-03-2015, 04:21 PM | #16 |
Scooby Specialist
Member#: 266122
Join Date: Dec 2010
Chapter/Region:
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Location: Patchogue, NY
Vehicle:2007 WRX Limited UGM |
Obviously you don't see the problem. A little knowledge is a dangerous thing.
E = I X R so if you are saying a battery can be modeled as a resistor Ohm's Law applies. In reality a battery is not a resistor so Ohm's Law is the wrong model. The charging of a battery is an electrochemical reaction and more complex than Ohm's Law. As far as the source (alternator), you are applying a Kirchoff's equivalent circuit when Norton's applies. The alternator sources current and the voltage rises as a result of an electrochemical reaction. A certain voltage threshold needs to be met for the reaction to initiate. Too high of a voltage will permanently damage the battery. The voltage is determined by the charging current and the battery properties. Also the load on the system is not purely resistive. In a steady state condition, with DC voltage, the complex components of the loads don't matter and may be viewed as purely resistive. However as soon as you have switching, the complex components come into play. How is an old battery in reasonable condition going to damage an ECU? First, you don't know the condition of the battery. Secondly, an old battery can contribute to various sags, surges and transients. For more info read the SAE specs on automotive electrical systems. Check out load dump transients. You can hold onto your misconceptions and misinformation but I am responding for those who are considering following your advice. Maybe now is the time to tell you I am a EE with years of testing experience of automotive products as well as military, aerospace and industrial products. Electrical testing involves simulating potential electrical failure. Products may pass when they are new and in the lab but after being in the real work for a while, performance can change. |
11-03-2015, 07:50 PM | #17 |
Scooby Specialist
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I never said the battery can be modeled as a resistor. It has internal resistance, which
increases with deposits on the plates. The voltage reading of 14.5 volts with the engine running allows the battery to charge. The load can be looked at as resistive. It will change with switching and the voltage regulator will handle it. A capacitor will become an open (stop DC) and an inductor will become a short in a direct current circuit. I seriously doubt the chemical reaction in the battery will cause electrical spikes (various sages, surges and transients). I am aware that there are multiple parallel circuits that can switch on and off. Writing "misconception & misinformation" about my post doesn't make it so. Bringing Kirchoff and Norton to describe parallel circuits wasn't necessary. |
11-04-2015, 03:35 PM | #18 |
Scooby Specialist
Member#: 266122
Join Date: Dec 2010
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Vehicle:2007 WRX Limited UGM |
Enjoy your bliss.
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05-11-2016, 05:28 PM | #19 |
Scooby Specialist
Member#: 198067
Join Date: Dec 2008
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The meter can be used as an acceptance test. I traded the 2009 Impreza 3 weeks ago. It started all winter, even on Valentines Day, -9 F.
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