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Old 02-07-2008, 12:34 PM   #1
mgoss79
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Default Catless UP and DP and emissions testing in PA

First a dumb question - how many cats are on a 04 WRX and how many cats are required to pass PA emissions testing?

Will converting to a catless UP and DP then getting a CB exhaust not allow me to pass emissions testing in PA? Would it be better to get a TBE?
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Old 02-07-2008, 12:37 PM   #2
silverwerx
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3 cats are on it i think u just need the one in the dp to pass
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Old 02-07-2008, 12:37 PM   #3
silverwerx
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go catless and do cel fixs
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Old 02-07-2008, 12:47 PM   #4
mgoss79
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how do you go about doing the cel fix?
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Old 02-07-2008, 12:49 PM   #5
mgoss79
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I kinda want one cat so when all these people are b*tching about global warming I don't feel too guilty and I can feel kinda like I am doing my part. I was thinking of getting a DP with a high flow cat and then getting a TBE either catless or with a high flow cat.
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Old 02-07-2008, 04:42 PM   #6
MDRex
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First off you need to understand the TBE is turbo back exhaust, which includes the downpipe. There is no cat in a catback exhaust, hence the name cat back. There is one cat in the stock DP, one cat in the front mid pipe and a pre-cat in the uppipe. An aftermarket DP normally replaces the stock DP and front mid pipe, replacing both cats.

Some DPs have cats and some dont. You can easily find one that does.
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Old 02-07-2008, 06:26 PM   #7
thunder_lizard_1976
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For an 04 car in PA, it only has to LOOK like there's at least as many as stock, whether it's functional or not. Most Emission inspectors will not know how many a given vehicle is supposed to have; it can vary wildly from one to as many as four, so the majority of the time just having one present is sufficient. They do a visual inspection, as well as an OBDII plug-in test.. the CEL must be off; commanded off by the ECM, and no codes present to pass. So if you want, gut the uppipe, buy a cheap catted DP( or full TBE), gut it, so the housing is intact, and hook it up to whatever exhaust you like. It will look like two perfectly functional cats. And do the CEL fixes for the 02 sensors/ catalyst monitors to keep it out for good. Hope this helps
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Old 02-07-2008, 08:40 PM   #8
NewShockerGuy
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thunder_lizard_1976 View Post
For an 04 car in PA, it only has to LOOK like there's at least as many as stock, whether it's functional or not. Most Emission inspectors will not know how many a given vehicle is supposed to have; it can vary wildly from one to as many as four, so the majority of the time just having one present is sufficient. They do a visual inspection, as well as an OBDII plug-in test.. the CEL must be off; commanded off by the ECM, and no codes present to pass. So if you want, gut the uppipe, buy a cheap catted DP( or full TBE), gut it, so the housing is intact, and hook it up to whatever exhaust you like. It will look like two perfectly functional cats. And do the CEL fixes for the 02 sensors/ catalyst monitors to keep it out for good. Hope this helps
I don't know if I agree with this...

I always pass and I'm completely catless TBE... have been for 3 years. As long as you don't throw a CEL normally your good. I've never run into an issue of cats nor have my friends..etc. But I do think it depends on where you take your car so in that point you would be definatly correct... so places are super strict.

-Nigel
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Old 02-08-2008, 12:08 AM   #9
thunder_lizard_1976
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NewShockerGuy View Post
I don't know if I agree with this...

I always pass and I'm completely catless TBE... have been for 3 years. As long as you don't throw a CEL normally your good. I've never run into an issue of cats nor have my friends..etc. But I do think it depends on where you take your car so in that point you would be definatly correct... so places are super strict.

-Nigel
It really depends on how easygoing the Inspector is, as well as how he perceives the individual vehicle.. a lot of techs out there ( myself included most days) rarely bother with the visual inspection on the '96 and newer cars (OBDII). Our reasoning is, if a component is not present, it would cause a CEL in it's own right.. the ECM does it's own checks. Unless we're suspicious of a setup by the DOT; they've really been cracking down lately.... then it's by the book. You're basically right though, some places are stricter than others

My 98 Legacy was also catless.. I gutted it after an incident with a rock in the Pine Barrens...long story short, the light only came on once in the four years I had it after that....my guess is if you drive it just hard enough, the conditions for running the catalyst efficiency monitor are never met.
No monitor test = no codes = no CEL = passed emissions
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Old 02-08-2008, 12:22 AM   #10
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Just go to a local garage and ask. You'll get the most accurate answere there.
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Old 02-11-2008, 05:38 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mgoss79 View Post
First a dumb question - how many cats are on a 04 WRX and how many cats are required to pass PA emissions testing?

Will converting to a catless UP and DP then getting a CB exhaust not allow me to pass emissions testing in PA? Would it be better to get a TBE?
It depends upon where in PA. Not all counties *have* emissions testing, and for those that do (and which use a dyno-based test), AWD cars are exempt, because they don't have AWD-capable dynos.

I don't know if there are any "in between" counties, where there's only a tailpipe-at-idle sniffer these days.

At any rate, it's not like California. Depending upon the garage, the mechanic might not even look to see if there's more than one cat.
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Old 02-11-2008, 11:11 PM   #12
thunder_lizard_1976
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AWD cars are only exempt from dyno testing, cause the crap-ass machine they give us to work with is only a two wheel, 35 mph MAX floor dyno. If a car requires a tailpipe test, it is done at 2500 rpm, and idle, with no load on the engine, off the dyno. Certain counties are just a visual inspection as part of the regular state inspection.. anything missing and you fail; this is mostly northern counties where there are fewer cars per sq. mi. Some counties are OBDII- the plug in test.. which his would qualify, being 96 or newer. Very few cars today actually get a dyno/ tailpipe test...mostly 95 and older cars in the metro area, and some 3/4 ton and up trucks. Like previously mentioned.. what determines the specific test criteria is the county you are registered in, and the year of the vehicle, and in some cases, GVW.
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Old 02-12-2008, 08:55 AM   #13
styng88
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Quote:
Originally Posted by extrachrispy View Post
It depends upon where in PA. Not all counties *have* emissions testing, and for those that do (and which use a dyno-based test), AWD cars are exempt, because they don't have AWD-capable dynos.

I don't know if there are any "in between" counties, where there's only a tailpipe-at-idle sniffer these days.

At any rate, it's not like California. Depending upon the garage, the mechanic might not even look to see if there's more than one cat.

In my local counties, we have emission testing that's only visual (for cats and CEL) and gas cap. The sniffer is supposedly coming, but not yet.
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Old 02-12-2008, 09:18 AM   #14
Mechie3
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Maddad makes a 3rd pipe cat delete pipe with a fake cat welded onto the outside of the pipe. It doesn't affect flow at all, but looks like a cat.
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