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Old 05-13-2001, 08:17 PM   #1
Patrick Olsen
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1997 Legacy 2.5GT
1996 Impreza coupe

Talking OT: The Mustang goes under the knife (pics)

Well, there are a few pictures of the Mustang's extensive surgery here: http://albums.photopoint.com/j/Album...221&a=12911164 . First comes the rollbar and new subframe connectors, then comes the torque arm and panhard bar rear suspension setup.

For the uninitiated, the '93+ Camaros/Firebirds have a torque arm and panhard bar from the factory, which is probably the biggest reason they handle better than any Mustang (other than the '99+ Cobra with its IRS) when it comes to auto-x and OT. The torque arm gives the car a huge improvement in traction, while the panhard bar laterally locates the axle and makes things operate a bit more smoothly. You can look here http://www.alanchavis.com/mmtapb/mmtapb.htm to see 4 pages worth of photos of a TA/PB setup being installed.

I can't wait to get the car back - it should be a completely different beast. Of course, the "to do" list on the damn thing is out of control right now - Lord only knows when the thing will truly be done.

Pat Olsen
'97 Legacy 2.5GT sedan
'89 Mustang GT convertible, blown and intercooled
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Old 05-14-2001, 02:50 AM   #2
paultg
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Wow, I did not know your putting a 6-point in the car. Can you say stiff, no body flex, I thought you could..

I can't wait for a fun run in this car!

Paul G.
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Old 05-14-2001, 07:12 AM   #3
m750
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Pat,
I showed your post to a friend w/ a mustang and he wanted me to ask you a few questions,


Quote:
I have some questions about your setup. I have Flowmaster 2.5" exhaust and a stock H pipe and a FMS aluminum drivesaft. I am concerned with clearances. What affect do you expect on ground clearence? I also have an 87 lx convertable and I have Kenny brown square welded in subs. I have a mig welder and access to a lift - do see any gotchas in me doing this myself? What was the total cost of all this?

Thanks

Lou
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Old 05-14-2001, 08:33 AM   #4
Patrick Olsen
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1996 Impreza coupe

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Aaron - Tell your friend Lou to check out http://www.maximummotorsports.com/onlinecat.html for info on pricing. I went with a torque arm package, which included the heavy-duty torque arm, panhard bar, and height adjustable rear lower control arms for around $1270. The normal torque arm is $200 cheaper, but can only take 425lb-ft (at the flywheel), and I'm probably over that. Anyway, add in some H&R rear springs for another $139.

As for exhaust clearance, I think the Flowmaster pipes will be a problem around the panhard bar bracket. The bracket is designed to clear the stock exhaust routing, which Dynomax follows pretty closely, but apparently Flowmaster is a bit different. I had Flowmaster 3-chambers with Dynomax tailpipes on the car for years, so you could always do that. The Dynomax tailpipes are pretty inexpensive, much cheaper than the Flowmaster ones.

As for the subframe connectors, MM says the KB ones aren't strong enough to take the loads imparted by the torque arm. They recently began selling some add-on pieces that weld to the KB SFCs to make them taller (hence stronger in bending), or you can chop out the KB ones and get full-length MM SFCs. That's what I did, and I kinda wish I hadn't - if the KB SFCs are welded in there well, it's a huge PITA to get them out.

Last but not least, can you do it yourself? I dunno. Give the guys at MM a call - they're extremely friendly and helpful, and will tell you everything you need to know.

Feel free to email me with more questions ([email protected]) so we don't bore the Subaru crowd with too much Mustang babble.

Pat
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Old 05-14-2001, 10:33 AM   #5
Ru fan
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Cool beans yo! Hey pat, I saw your car at LRP this past Saturday, and I saw the red Stang #6.

Later,
Seth E.
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Old 05-14-2001, 03:34 PM   #6
Patrick Olsen
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1996 Impreza coupe

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Cool, Seth - it's good to be recognized! Joe in the #6 car took first in ITE, qualifying about 2.5sec quicker than the 2nd place car, and finishing the race about 20sec ahead of 2nd place. I had never been to an SCCA Road Racing event - that's quite a production! I had no idea it would be so big.

Pat
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Old 05-14-2001, 10:06 PM   #7
Jonathan
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Stupid question :

Can't you just purchase a Cobra IRS subframe ? (I am not sure if your torque tube would work with this setup or not).

I think the IRS subframe is basically a bolt-on piece holding the new Rear Diff. I would think that the torque tube setup is more for drag racers than for people searching for the ultimate in handling ?
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Old 05-15-2001, 08:53 PM   #8
Patrick Olsen
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1997 Legacy 2.5GT
1996 Impreza coupe

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Jonathan - Theoretically, yes, you could put the Cobra IRS into a Fox-body Mustang. As much as the outside of the car has changed in the past 8 years or so, the underpinnings of the Mustang (even the brand new ones) are still based on the '79 Fairmont. Sweet, eh?

Anyway, the problem with trying to do that conversion is that it's not a straight swap, and a very limited number of people have done it. Any sort of conversion stuff would have to be custom fabricated. The Max Motorsports TA and PB is a straight bolt/weld-on affair. There are other problems, too, like I think the rear track is quite a bit wider - 3" maybe? - so the fenders would have to be flared out. That wider rear track would also make the car's tendency to understeer even worse (of course, the added grip of the torque arm will do the same thing to some extent, but it will be easier to tune around that). And, of course, the cost of a complete Cobra IRS is very high at this point, because there just aren't a whole lot of them around to scavenge from.

It would definitely be sweet, but you'd have to have some serious $$$ to get it all set up right.

Pat
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Old 05-16-2001, 02:33 PM   #9
Subedave
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Question

Hey Pat,

Do you know anything about the griggs racing suspensions?

Dave
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