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08-31-2012, 08:07 PM | #1 |
Scooby Specialist
Member#: 249160
Join Date: Jun 2010
Chapter/Region:
South East
Location: Madison, AL
Vehicle:2002 Swag Wagon PSM |
EJ251 Swap wont start.
Car: 2000 OBS originally equipped with a Phase II MAP based SOHC EJ22.
Donor: 2001 Forester Phase II SOHC EJ251, also MAP based. EJ22 ECU EJ251 Engine Harness EJ251 Intake Manifold Fuel pump is working, and fuel is entering the fuel rails from the filter. New spark plugs all around, all 4 plugs are getting spark. Everything is hooked up 100% except the Air Assist Solenoid seen here: Currently I have a hose connecting the two ports but no solenoid. Seeing as I'm using the EJ22 ECU I shouldn't need it. *as far as I know* Here's a quick video of it cranking. You can hear it stop cranking, then continue. That is not me, the car was doing that on it's own. It also let out a couple back fires you might not be able to hear. http://s151.photobucket.com/albums/s150/stangpics01/?action=view¤t=VID_20120831_180141.mp4 Any ideas?
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08-31-2012, 10:49 PM | #2 |
Scooby Specialist
Member#: 80465
Join Date: Jan 2005
Chapter/Region:
RMIC
Location: Denver
Vehicle:2001 2.5RS Black Diamond Pearl |
Did you check timing before install? Are the spark plugs wet with fuel? What happens if you crack the throttle ever-so-slightly when cranking?
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08-31-2012, 11:12 PM | #3 |
Scooby Specialist
Member#: 249160
Join Date: Jun 2010
Chapter/Region:
South East
Location: Madison, AL
Vehicle:2002 Swag Wagon PSM |
Timing is good to go. Spark plugs are dry and giving it a bit of gas doesn't do anything.
Thank you for the response |
08-31-2012, 11:21 PM | #4 |
Scooby Newbie
Member#: 57152
Join Date: Mar 2004
Chapter/Region:
NWIC
Location: pacific Nw
Vehicle:---- Subaru fleet garage ( 5 and counting) |
Slowly walk your hands all over the intake manifold checking the wires. My 2000 OBS has a sensor in the airbox I do not see in yours.
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09-01-2012, 12:01 AM | #5 |
Scooby Specialist
Member#: 249160
Join Date: Jun 2010
Chapter/Region:
South East
Location: Madison, AL
Vehicle:2002 Swag Wagon PSM |
Good eye! That would be the air temp sensor. I would imagine it's important, but I don't think it would keep the car from running would it?
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09-01-2012, 12:19 AM | #6 |
Scooby Specialist
Member#: 165749
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Detroit, MF'er!
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Can you log the ecu? Chk the crank and cam sensor for signal. Thought they were for ignition timing trigger only but worth a shot. Chk them for installation and connection to the harness, too
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09-01-2012, 12:25 AM | #7 |
Scooby Specialist
Member#: 249160
Join Date: Jun 2010
Chapter/Region:
South East
Location: Madison, AL
Vehicle:2002 Swag Wagon PSM |
Hmm. Would it have something to do with the cam/crank gears? I'm thinking there might be a difference in timing triggers between the motors. Going to try an ECU from an 00 RS 251 car and see if that does the trick.
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09-01-2012, 10:26 AM | #8 |
Scooby Specialist
Member#: 80465
Join Date: Jan 2005
Chapter/Region:
RMIC
Location: Denver
Vehicle:2001 2.5RS Black Diamond Pearl |
If the cam/crank sensors jive, you will get spark (which you're seeing). You said that that spark plugs are NOT wet (you did check just after cranking didn't you), which means the ECU isn't telling the injectors to fire. Troubleshoot that path. I don't know enough about the differences/similarities on the EJ22/25 ECUs to tell you much more. Have you tried starter fluid?
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09-01-2012, 12:34 PM | #9 |
Scooby Specialist
Member#: 249160
Join Date: Jun 2010
Chapter/Region:
South East
Location: Madison, AL
Vehicle:2002 Swag Wagon PSM |
Haven't tried started fluid yet. I didnt think that worked on fuel injected cars. Ill def give it a shot.
Oh, and I replaced the plugs after trying to crank it a few times but did not check them immediately after trying to crank it. Also, it seems the EJ22 timing belt has less teeth then the 251. If that's the case the cam/crank triggers are probably different as well. Swapping ecu tonight and ill update. Last edited by myrexgoesvroom; 09-01-2012 at 12:55 PM. |
09-02-2012, 06:08 AM | #10 |
Scooby Specialist
Member#: 10039
Join Date: Sep 2001
Chapter/Region:
Tri-State
Location: NEPA
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i would say check to see if the crank sprocket and the cam pulley are different.
i had a problems with mine not starting because of the differences i did basically the same swap, but my 2.5 was from a manual transmission rs and i had different timing components i also swap intakes manifolds, i used the original 2.2 one |
09-02-2012, 10:38 PM | #11 |
Scooby Specialist
Member#: 249160
Join Date: Jun 2010
Chapter/Region:
South East
Location: Madison, AL
Vehicle:2002 Swag Wagon PSM |
It was the cam/crank difference. I swapped the ECU and she fired right up. It's running pretty rough so I'm not sure if the ECU actually fixed the issue or bandaged it though. Have to put a scanner on it tomorrow to check CEL's and find out.
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09-03-2012, 08:52 PM | #12 |
Scooby Specialist
Member#: 249160
Join Date: Jun 2010
Chapter/Region:
South East
Location: Madison, AL
Vehicle:2002 Swag Wagon PSM |
Ok went and got the codes pulled.
Codes: Idle Air Control Solenoid - P1512 (signal 2 circuit low input) - P1514 (signal 3 circuit low input) - P1516 (signal 4 circuit low input) P1111 P1111 Atmospheric Pressure Sensor High Input I don't have an APS as far as I can tell. If I do it's in the ECU. I cleaned the IACV with carb/choke cleaner and a q-tip with no luck. I unplugged the MAP and bam, smooth idle and returned drivability. Since the codes are for the IACV I assume mine is bad and removing the MAP puts the car in "limp" mode and the ECU ignores the bad IACV. Sound about right? Changed the IACV for a used one from a friends RS. Now the idle surges between 1500-1700. Drivability is up, but still terrible. |
09-03-2012, 10:04 PM | #13 |
Scooby Specialist
Member#: 300551
Join Date: Nov 2011
Chapter/Region:
SCIC
Location: mariposa ca.
Vehicle:2002 FOZ STI 2.34 Fullers Garage |
I would change the crank gear, intake manifold and engine harness to the ej22 stuff and use that computer. Then everything should hook up and work.
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09-03-2012, 10:21 PM | #14 |
Scooby Specialist
Member#: 249160
Join Date: Jun 2010
Chapter/Region:
South East
Location: Madison, AL
Vehicle:2002 Swag Wagon PSM |
That's what every one keeps saying heh... Is it really possible it's an issue at this point? I'm using an EJ251 Engine, harness, and ECU. Everything should be as it would have been in the car it was removed from right?
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09-04-2012, 12:39 AM | #15 |
Scooby Specialist
Member#: 300551
Join Date: Nov 2011
Chapter/Region:
SCIC
Location: mariposa ca.
Vehicle:2002 FOZ STI 2.34 Fullers Garage |
Its alot more work to do it that way but it can be done. Go for it.
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09-04-2012, 12:49 AM | #16 |
Scooby Specialist
Member#: 249160
Join Date: Jun 2010
Chapter/Region:
South East
Location: Madison, AL
Vehicle:2002 Swag Wagon PSM |
I'm already using the EJ25 ECU and it's running, it just runs rough. The codes I posted a few posts up are what I'm getting.
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