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Old 09-22-2001, 11:23 PM   #1
Siper2
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Question STi ver5 struts: Stock springs or new ones?

I'm a big question-asker tonight. Here's another one... Next Spring my biggest car plan is new tires (most likely Bridgestone RE950 all-seasons). However I've been REALLY wanting some STi ver5 struts.

Now that Exeter Subaru (NH) has their new site up, www.subaruwrxparts.com , I can order through them. A set of struts is $292 not including shipping. What I can't decide is if I should keep the stock springs, or go with the Subaru Eibach set.

I would naturally assume that the aftermarket ones would be better-suited to the struts. However... In this particular case, do struts = handling and springs = ride height, or is it more complicated? (Probably.)

As far as ride height goes, I don't really want to lower the car. If it does drop, I sure don't want much. Anyway, thanks-

-S2-
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Old 09-23-2001, 12:54 AM   #2
cj917
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it is a lot more complicated than that

i have v5 struts AND v5 springs... and even that it feels like it's overdamped... with Eibach's i heard it is also overdamped to a point that you dont wanna go any lower in spring rate... nevermind trying to match those struts with stock springs

on flat surface my setup is very good... on single-bump situation it's ok, altho it really depends on how big the bump/pothole is, sometimes if i hit one while i'm cornering fast, it does give me a feeling that the car might lose control (altho in reality probably far from it) on multiple, continuous bumps/potholes (as most of the New England roads) it might get uncomfy... however i'm used to that tho and it doesn't bother me

if i were you, my best bet would be to ask for a ride in as many combinations of various springs and v5 struts as possible, to get a feel of which one you like and what to expect

-arthur
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Old 09-23-2001, 01:10 AM   #3
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Well I have been in a bunch, but keeping track of what's who and where's when isn't easy.

I'd just rather go with Subaru parts as much as possible. I forgot to mention that I was looking at Ver5 springs, too.... That's what I'd ideally end up with I think. I mean, they were designed for the car...

-S2-
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Old 09-23-2001, 12:29 PM   #4
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From what I've heard the v.5 struts have pretty high damping rates and thus overpower most of the springs out there (ie. overdamped). However, I've heard nothing but good about the v.5/H&R combo.

Driving my car (99 2.5RS) on the stock springs (with AGXs and STi Group N upper mounts) the ride is stock-like on 1/2 and very nice on 2/4 (both much more stable handling than stock, though). On 3/7 (my autocross settings) the ride was noticeably overdamped on the street and would bounce along the highway if there were expansion joints and overall it felt very stiff. On 4/8 (full stiff) it was the same as 3/7, just moreso.

However, I got my Whiteline springs installed over the weekend. It was still set to 3/7 (I've been to lazy to change it since the last autocross) but 3/7 on Whitelines rides BETTER than 2/4 did with the stock springs!!! The suspension feels so much better when matched like this! I definitely understand when people say overdamped suspensions will ride softer when stiffer springs are installed (despite the fact that it sounds so backward).
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Old 09-23-2001, 07:25 PM   #5
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Well it does kinda sound backwards, but if you think about it, it doesn't. I guess the stock springs will "boing" too much for such a stiff strut, so when you hit a corner and the springs flex enough, you'll really feel that stiff strut. But with matched springs I guess it would be better....

Now I gotta find a good price on Ver5 springs I guess. I don't mind Eibachs at all but I guess if the price is right I'd prefer Subaru stuff. (I'd ASSUME they don't lower as much as Eibach, which is what I want.)

-S2-
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Old 09-23-2001, 07:59 PM   #6
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what do you mean when you refer to over damped or under damped? is that the spring or the strut?
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Old 09-23-2001, 08:14 PM   #7
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Matey2:
You have a very good questions that I can't answer, becuase I don't really understand it completely. A search on the board would probably be a good idea.

Siper2:
Hey, sorry to bum you out here, but I am pretty sure the V5 springs are discontinued. It makes no sence to me that the V5 struts are available and the springs are not, but I am pretty sure that is the case.

Paul G.
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Old 09-23-2001, 08:17 PM   #8
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I think Sugar still has some though Paul, I remember asking her about that a short while ago. Though I could easily be wrong.

Hrmm... Is there a Ver6 set? Or is that what's in the new STi, that we've been so teased with but haven't been given yet?

-S2-
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Old 09-23-2001, 08:48 PM   #9
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Siper2,

Contact Mike @ SPD Tuning. Last I checked he still had V5 springs left. I got it from him for about $275(sans shipping). I think that will be the best price you'll get, especially since those springs are not made anymore. If you do want to get V5 struts, you should stick w/ V5 springs, although I have heard good things about the Prodrive/eibach springs. You have to be careful w/ the eibach springs since there are several versions for the Impreza.
-JOE
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Old 09-23-2001, 08:50 PM   #10
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Sweet!!! Thanks!
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Old 09-23-2001, 08:55 PM   #11
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BTW, if you do order the springs and they are black, don't worry, they are the V5 springs. They only made the pink springs in the early production runs. Later springs were just black.
-JOE
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Old 09-23-2001, 09:28 PM   #12
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Right, actually I did know that, I saw a pic of some a while ago.
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Old 09-23-2001, 10:11 PM   #13
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Quote:
although I have heard good things about the Prodrive/eibach springs
well, the Eibach springs that the Prodrive P1 kit uses (which uses the same struts as the v5) are NOT available alone, as it is only sold as a kit with the struts (or if you know otherwise, let me know cuz i want those springs)

the Eibach Pro kit springs, however, was designed with the RS stock struts in mind, and if used with v5 struts it would be even more overdamped than the v5 springs

btw, both the stock v5 and v6 GC8 (WRX and STi) uses the same springs and struts... but if we are talking about the STi aftermarket springs that's another story... i suspect that the spring rates shown on some websites which has different rates for v5 and v6 are due to this confusion

-arthur
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Old 09-24-2001, 12:13 AM   #14
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Actually, Bill @ Mastro was selling the Prodrive/Eibach springs by themselves. I tried to get them but he had sold out and they no longer deal w/ Prodrive, they were @ a good price also . Apparently Prodrive has horrible customer service practice.


-JOE
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Old 09-24-2001, 10:46 AM   #15
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Wink V5 / V6 springs...

Arthur, I believe that the V5 and V6 use the same struts, but that the V6 has stiffer spring rates. If I am wrong, someone please feel free to correct me. FWIW, I have heard that the Eibach's are a little to soft for the V5 struts, too. Why not just get the KYB/AGXs, I realize they are ~$100 more, but adjustability is a great thing, you can have them nice and soft for the street and then crank them up for the auto-x/track. Granted they will be overdamped and uncomfortable, but at the track, who cares?

BTW, overdamped is when the struts are too stiff for the springs, resulting in a very "choppy" ride. This is because the struts are meant to control the movement of the springs, when the spring rates are too low for the particular struts, the opposite happens, the spring wants to move, but the struts are too stiff.

- Trent
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Old 09-24-2001, 01:09 PM   #16
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my bad, i forgot about those Prodrive/Eibach's that Bill was selling... that would make 3 versions of Eibach springs available (Eibach pro kit, Prodrive/Eibach, and P1-specific Eibach's)

Trent,
yes the struts are the same, as i thought about the same thing too, that v5 and v6 have different spring rates... but i was just searching scoobynet the other day and it seemed like that's not the impression they get from across the pond... hence i said it was my suspicion
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Old 09-24-2001, 01:43 PM   #17
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Trent,

So the ones you're talking about must be a coilover set, right?

-S2-
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Old 09-24-2001, 03:04 PM   #18
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Siper, I hope I am reading your post correctly, yes the easiest sure fire way to make sure that you get springs that work well with your struts is to get a "kit" like the Prodrive WR or coilovers. This is IMO the best way to go. However this is also the most expensive way to go, too. A good compromise would to be to get a mild progressive spring setup like H&R, Eibach, 5Zigen, Whiteline, etc. and go with some adjustable struts, KYBs seem to be the popular choice. That way you can "tune" the struts to your springs and or taste in ride quality.

Arthur, oops didn't see the part where you said it was a suspicion, sorry. So, the Scoobynet guys think they are the same? Interesting, time to do some more investigatin'.


- Trent
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Old 09-24-2001, 06:20 PM   #19
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Trent,
the only way to find out is to get a set of v5 and a set of v6 springs and put them on a machine to measure them

unfortunately since we dont have STi6 here, we have to rely on our brothers across the pond for this information... i'll search more to see if i dig up anything else

but they all think either the v5 or v6 is not as "refined" with their road condition (and probably the same for the New England area where i am) when compared to the Prodrive ones... but then again Prodrive stuff cost a lot more
-arthur
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