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Old 08-05-2010, 08:22 PM   #51
Gate4jg
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damp a rag with a rubbing alcohol gently rub it off then was off with water or air dry then wax the spot.
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Old 08-06-2010, 10:52 AM   #52
Kean
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....it makes me wonder sometimes where some folks get their information.

OP, I'm not suprised clay didn't work. Yes, while clay does help remove many types of bonded contaminants on the surface of your paint, the issue you describe is much more extreme. I agree with Krauser in his one point that clay isn't the magical device some folks seem to think it is. There are heavier cuts available for more serious contaminant removal but if you're trying to take off blobs of sap that have been baked onto your paintwork, I don't think you will have much success with those either. If heat, IPA, bug & tar remover and some of the other suggestions are not working (assuming you're being patient and doing it right), I would start thinking about enlisting the services of a good, experienced detailer. ....or at least get their advice on the matter before screwing it up even more.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Garrek11 View Post
clay bar is not really meant for that stuff if you take a close look at your paint when you use the clay bar its pretty much covering up what you trying to get rid of. its like make up....
....clay can help remove contaminants like overspray, rail/brake dust, industrial fallout, sap, honeydew, etc. What it doesn't do is act like make up and simply cover things up. The residue you see after claying a panel is mostly from the lubricant and some traces of the clay as it slowly breaks down. Both of which are easily wiped or washed away. Even when a user doesn't use enough lube and the clay catches the paint leaving transfer of the product, it is still realtively easy to wipe off with a detailer or to wash away. Any residue left after the process is not intended to remain on the paint as a "cover up".
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Old 08-06-2010, 12:03 PM   #53
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I'll take some photos today and post them of the sap.....it might be easier to show you rather than tell.

I've used

alcohol
goo gone
bug and tar remover
clay bar

it just turned the sap white so not its more obvious lol
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Old 08-06-2010, 10:08 PM   #54
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....clay can help remove contaminants like overspray, rail/brake dust, industrial fallout, sap, honeydew, etc. What it doesn't do is act like make up and simply cover things up. The residue you see after claying a panel is mostly from the lubricant and some traces of the clay as it slowly breaks down. Both of which are easily wiped or washed away. Even when a user doesn't use enough lube and the clay catches the paint leaving transfer of the product, it is still realtively easy to wipe off with a detailer or to wash away. Any residue left after the process is not intended to remain on the paint as a "cover up".[/quote]

ok so what your saying is that it takes it off clean and leaves no residue on the paint correct? so wouldnt it be logical that he could just take a putty knife and some lube and take the sap off that way? Ya no thats just dumb saying it doesnt leave anything on the paint whats the point of the clay then? and why does the area that you clayed feel like it has been waxed? Im just saying people give the clay bar WAY to much credit if you know how to detail cars right that **** is rarely used.
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Old 08-06-2010, 10:48 PM   #55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Garrek11 View Post

ok so what your saying is that it takes it off clean and leaves no residue on the paint correct? so wouldnt it be logical that he could just take a putty knife and some lube and take the sap off that way? Ya no thats just dumb saying it doesnt leave anything on the paint whats the point of the clay then? and why does the area that you clayed feel like it has been waxed? Im just saying people give the clay bar WAY to much credit if you know how to detail cars right that **** is rarely used.

The clay bar is rarely used because that's how often it's supposed to be used. You don't use it every time you wash your car. If anything, it's not given enough credit with all of the myths surrounding it and whatnot.
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Old 08-07-2010, 12:15 AM   #56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Garrek11 View Post
ok so what your saying is that it takes it off clean and leaves no residue on the paint correct? so wouldnt it be logical that he could just take a putty knife and some lube and take the sap off that way? Ya no thats just dumb saying it doesnt leave anything on the paint whats the point of the clay then? and why does the area that you clayed feel like it has been waxed? Im just saying people give the clay bar WAY to much credit if you know how to detail cars right that **** is rarely used.
....I can tell where this conversation is going given your condescending attitude/remarks. If calling me (or my explanations) "dumb" makes you feel like it lends credibility to your own argument, so be it. ....but I won't waste anymore of my time trying to reason with someone who is being unreasonable if this continues.

Quote:
ok so what your saying is that it takes it off clean and leaves no residue on the paint correct?
No. That is not what I said. Re-read my post that you quoted:

Quote:
....clay can help remove contaminants like overspray, rail/brake dust, industrial fallout, sap, honeydew, etc. What it doesn't do is act like make up and simply cover things up. The residue you see after claying a panel is mostly from the lubricant and some traces of the clay as it slowly breaks down. Both of which are easily wiped or washed away. Even when a user doesn't use enough lube and the clay catches the paint leaving transfer of the product, it is still relatively easy to wipe off with a detailer or to wash away. Any residue left after the process is not intended to remain on the paint as a "cover up".
Quote:
so wouldnt it be logical that he could just take a putty knife and some lube and take the sap off that way?
Of course not. I'm honestly curious why you that would be logical or the same? Obviously something like a QD wouldn't offer adequate lubricity or protection using the blade of the knife against the paint like that.

Quote:
Ya no thats just dumb saying it doesnt leave anything on the paint whats the point of the clay then? and why does the area that you clayed feel like it has been waxed?
....I didn't say that exactly and I'm beginning to I have doubts you actually know how clay or the process works. I have already explained what the point of clay is. As for it leaving a "just waxed" feeling, that can be attributed to several factors including the reduction/removal of contaminants and the QD (if using one). If you have doubts about what a clay bar can remove on a finish that has contamination like the items I described earlier, simply use IPA or something like prepsol on the panel after the process.

Quote:
Im just saying people give the clay bar WAY to much credit if you know how to detail cars right that **** is rarely used.
....I would urge you to take a visit over to the Autopia detailing forums and see how many reputable, knowledgeable professionals obviously don't know how to details cars right.


Here are a few links to help explain the product and process:
Clay - the can do tool by Kevin Ferrell
Detailing Clay & Pre-wax Cleaning by David Bynon
Do I need to wash my car after I use detailing clay to clay the paint? by Mike Phillips
Tips and Tricks for using detailing clay by Mike Phillips
Applying Auto Detail Clay by Anthony Oroso
How often do I need to clay my car? by Mike Phillips
How to Use Auto Detailing Clay by Autogeek

Last edited by Kean; 08-07-2010 at 12:27 AM. Reason: added links
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Old 08-07-2010, 03:37 PM   #57
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This is my hood after Turtle wax bug and tar remover, Goo Gone, Alcohol, claybar.

washed and waxed after each product and let it sit for a day before trying another.

looks worse, should have just left them as the darker spots lol....****



ouch, that one is the worse...touch up paint time lol



might be coming off? this pine stuff is a real bitch

Last edited by krauser2; 08-07-2010 at 03:37 PM. Reason: double post
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Old 08-07-2010, 05:32 PM   #58
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....unfortunately, I believe what you're seeing there is mostly damage to the paint as a result of the sap being left to dwell (not so much the contaminant itself). You may be able to use a compound/polish to help improve the appearance of those blemishes but I highly doubt you will remove them completely. Short of a repaint, you can try some off the shelf products like Meguiars Ultimate Compound and Scratch-X/Swirl-X to follow up, but it may be better to seek the services of a professional or a fellow member near you with a polisher and products who would be willing to help. What you don't want to do is over-correct something that may not be entirely correctable. ....there is a point where you need to realize that messing it it further will compromise the paint to the point where it is unsalvageable.
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Old 08-07-2010, 05:39 PM   #59
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^^^agree totally

I would like to see what a body shop can do / quote
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Old 08-07-2010, 05:53 PM   #60
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I didn't read all the other pages of posts, but judging by the pictures what you have tried didn't work. I own a logging company, and by FAR the best thing to take off pine pitch is penut butter. Something about the peanut oil breaks down the pitch/sap. Figured i'd let you guys in on that little secret..like I said not sure if its been said or not yet. I'm currently cutting pine and I take a penut butter bath everynight after work LOL.
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Old 08-08-2010, 02:54 PM   #61
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haha some of these responsesare hilarious! i would just go to the local auto paint store and get a clay bar. works wonders out here in evergreen colorado
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Old 08-08-2010, 03:08 PM   #62
krauser2
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^^^

dude read the posts

used claybar already

I used all the stated products for these results...clay bar is not some magical device. Its a cool concept but ultimately some elbow grease will do the same thing
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Old 08-08-2010, 03:17 PM   #63
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Quote:
Originally Posted by isk8emerica87 View Post
haha some of these responsesare hilarious! i would just go to the local auto paint store and get a clay bar. works wonders out here in evergreen colorado
....almost as hilarious as the folks who post stuff like this without reading the thread.
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Old 08-08-2010, 05:01 PM   #64
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^
+1
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Old 08-10-2010, 10:28 AM   #65
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ive never had problems removing sap with aggressive clay, as some seem to say clay doesnt work well with sap removal. If done heavy sap removal from pine tree with it. never had any that it wouldnt remove.

More to the pictures posted though. I do agree with kean, that is damage to the clear/paint. it needs re-sprayed.
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Old 08-10-2010, 11:02 AM   #66
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^ agree, the damage is done. I'll do what I can, not sure I want to drop the flow on that kind of job.

I;ve got primer, sand paper, WRB paint from subaru and clear coat, I'm going to see what I can do.
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Old 08-10-2010, 11:19 AM   #67
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I'd try Murphy's Oil Soap to get the sap off, or Turtle Zip wax. Murphy's works on things that noting else will touch, and I have an old car with dull paint that paint got splashed on it, and after trying every other cleaner and solvent to try to remove it, the Zip Wax was the best, though a lot of the splashed paint was already gone, but it looked like the Zip would have made it easy, as fast as it removed what was left, that nothing else was getting it all.
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Old 08-10-2010, 12:09 PM   #68
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Quote:
Originally Posted by krauser2 View Post
^ agree, the damage is done. I'll do what I can, not sure I want to drop the flow on that kind of job.

I;ve got primer, sand paper, WRB paint from subaru and clear coat, I'm going to see what I can do.
I would honestly try to use a compound and polish on one of the spots first to see if the results would be something you could live with. Meguiars Ultimate Compound is an excellent product that works well by hand or DA. When using by hand, you will need to follow up with a lighter polish since the UC will tend to leave fine micro-marring. Meguiars Scratch-X 2.0 or Swirl-X should help with that (the latter being the lightest of the three and will finish the best). However, as I said before, there is a point where you will need to realize “this is as good as it’s going to get”. I would try that approach first before re-painting.
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Old 08-10-2010, 02:42 PM   #69
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kean View Post
I would honestly try to use a compound and polish on one of the spots first to see if the results would be something you could live with. Meguiars Ultimate Compound is an excellent product that works well by hand or DA. When using by hand, you will need to follow up with a lighter polish since the UC will tend to leave fine micro-marring. Meguiars Scratch-X 2.0 or Swirl-X should help with that (the latter being the lightest of the three and will finish the best). However, as I said before, there is a point where you will need to realize “this is as good as it’s going to get”. I would try that approach first before re-painting.
ive encountered defects like pictured during a few details, wetsanding with 1500 then 2000, then using some menzerna Power gloss i was able to knock it down a bit but never able to remove it. It will help and wont be as noticeable but if your anal an its bugging you, your not going to get rid of it without a repaint.
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Old 08-10-2010, 03:05 PM   #70
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I've got scratch x and a polishing compound and 2K grit paper.

I'll try a couple things today and see what happens.

I know it will never be completely gone, but close enough is fine by me.
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Old 08-10-2010, 03:49 PM   #71
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since turpentine comes from trees, maybe it will dissolve the the sap even if it baked on, though maybe a different type of tree.
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Old 08-10-2010, 06:11 PM   #72
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hines View Post
ive encountered defects like pictured during a few details, wetsanding with 1500 then 2000, then using some menzerna Power gloss i was able to knock it down a bit but never able to remove it. It will help and wont be as noticeable but if your anal an its bugging you, your not going to get rid of it without a repaint.
....definitely. I didn't mean to imply that this solution could remove this type of damage. I’m merely giving him an alternative to repainting those areas. As I mentioned, he can compound/polish those areas and see if the results are something he can live with. If not, he’s only down a few bucks and can still have the panels painted if desired. I had similar damage on a ’99 Civic my wife had when we were first married. Although I was able to improve it (surprisingly more than I thought I could), it was never fully corrected (couldn’t be since the depth of the etching was so severe). However, it looked better than if I were to do a repaint myself and wasn’t worth the cost of paying a shop to do it for me.
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Old 08-11-2010, 01:33 PM   #73
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I used to park under redwood trees which dripped sap like crazy.

I also tried bug and sap remover, but it just didn't do anything--particularly for the old, dried in sap drops. The only thing I tried that really worked was Mr. Fantastick (that brand specifically) and lots of elbow grease.

You'll want to be careful in light of your paint job, but it really did work. Of course, if you're paints already FUBAR then there's nothing you can do.
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Old 08-18-2010, 03:03 AM   #74
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2500 grit wet sand then rubbing compound then wax works well, first try the mothers mag aluminum polish might do the job.
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Old 09-30-2010, 01:25 PM   #75
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Dang, I came into this thread hoping to find a panacea for the same problem (long baked-in sap), but apparently this is as difficult as it seems. I guess I'm going to try the peanut butter method now... what have I got to lose?
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