Welcome to the North American Subaru Impreza Owners Club Friday March 29, 2024
Home Forums Images WikiNASIOC Products Store Modifications Upgrade Garage
NASIOC
Go Back   NASIOC > NASIOC Technical > Engine Management & Tuning

Welcome to NASIOC - The world's largest online community for Subaru enthusiasts!
Welcome to the NASIOC.com Subaru forum.

You are currently viewing our forum as a guest, which gives you limited access to view most discussions and access our other features. By joining our community, free of charge, you will have access to post topics, communicate privately with other members (PM), respond to polls, upload content and access many other special features. Registration is free, fast and simple, so please join our community today!

If you have any problems with the registration process or your account login, please contact us.







* As an Amazon Associate I earn from qualifying purchases. 
* Registered users of the site do not see these ads. 
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 05-17-2012, 12:42 AM   #2501
vicious_fishes
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 158864
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Aussieland
Vehicle:
2003 SOHC destroker

Default

can someone give me a brief rundown of how running E85 allows you to run more boost?
* Registered users of the site do not see these ads.
vicious_fishes is offline   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
* Registered users of the site do not see these ads.
Old 05-17-2012, 12:52 AM   #2502
punchjamesarnol
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 284835
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: S.D.
Vehicle:
2014 Hyundai Equus
White Pearl Mica

Default

subscribed...
punchjamesarnol is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-17-2012, 01:01 AM   #2503
mccanixx
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 60566
Join Date: Apr 2004
Chapter/Region: SCIC
Location: San Diego, Ca.
Vehicle:
2005 XT 5sp, 02 WRX
01 Legacy 95 Impreza L

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by vicious_fishes
can someone give me a brief rundown of how running E85 allows you to run more boost?
http://www.iwsti.com/forums/3016597-post3.html

This was helpful to me.
mccanixx is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-17-2012, 01:32 AM   #2504
the suicidal eggroll
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 51961
Join Date: Jan 2004
Chapter/Region: RMIC
Location: Broomfield, CO
Vehicle:
2005 STi
2012 WRX

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by vicious_fishes View Post
can someone give me a brief rundown of how running E85 allows you to run more boost?
Pump gas is so energetic that it rarely allows you to run whatever boost level nets you the most flow from the turbo. You generally have to turn the boost down a couple of pounds to keep the temperature lower so that you don't run into detonation.

Remember, tuning for power is about finding that right combination of AFR, boost, and timing that yields the most power without detonation. While running more boost on a given setup might net you more flow from the turbo, the tendency to pre-ignite might force you to add so much fuel or pull out so much timing at this higher boost that you actually lose power.

E85 doesn't have that problem, in general you can run whatever boost you want, and whatever timing you want, and as long as you keep the AFR around the low to mid 11s (gas AFR) it won't detonate (there are exceptions, but compared to pump gas that's what it feels like). This lets you run the optimum boost level for your turbo to maximize flow, not the optimum boost level to prevent detonation.

Last edited by the suicidal eggroll; 05-17-2012 at 02:07 AM.
the suicidal eggroll is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-17-2012, 01:51 AM   #2505
vicious_fishes
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 158864
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Aussieland
Vehicle:
2003 SOHC destroker

Default

posted in the other thread eggroll
vicious_fishes is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-28-2012, 07:29 AM   #2506
Mr645
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 320769
Join Date: May 2012
Chapter/Region: South East
Location: Boca Raton, Florida
Vehicle:
2012 WRX 5 door
Blue

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by vicious_fishes View Post
can someone give me a brief rundown of how running E85 allows you to run more boost?
That and a lot more are explained in detail on the first page of this thread
Mr645 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-28-2012, 09:05 AM   #2507
Frank A
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 49979
Join Date: Dec 2003
Chapter/Region: MAIC
Location: MD, US
Vehicle:
11 need a 2nd STI
08 black TA STI

Default

The OP's answer to the question is on the first page, but frankly I think 95% of what he's written is from the perspective of someone that just wants to run E85 to save money and maybe get a little performance boost. I've seen better explanations by tuners in other threads on why E85 is a great performance fuel.

To my (limited) understanding, E85 has three main advantages that allow you to run higher boost and thereby higher power:

1) more det resistance (base ethanol octane is 118 per OP although E85 is ~100).
2) lower energy density means more fuel added per HP means more heat is absorbed by the fuel as it is vaporized which cools the intake charge.
3) burns cooler, again helping engine temperatures and allowing more boost.

Some tuners I've seen suggest the performance advantage of tuning for E85 is as good as Q116 race gas despite its relatively low octane of 100.

Now if only the government would regulate the ethanol content and the octane of the gasoline portion of E85 more closely, it would be a more reliable performance fuel. Some racers won't touch because of the variability and risk of damaging their race engines. I found an interesting article in a non-subaru forum that runs through all the ways E85 is not controlled and just how risky it is to use. I would consider the water/gasoline tester a minimum to run it, but there's no easy way to test if the gasoline portion of the blend was made with 87 or 93 or whatever gasoline.

Frank

Last edited by Frank A; 05-28-2012 at 09:12 AM.
Frank A is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-12-2012, 04:58 PM   #2508
Red_Wrx
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 158658
Join Date: Sep 2007
Chapter/Region: SCIC
Location: California
Default

2 words: Volumetric efficiency
Red_Wrx is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-26-2012, 12:00 PM   #2509
SVT_WRX
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 164830
Join Date: Nov 2007
Chapter/Region: SCIC
Location: San Diego
Vehicle:
2002 WRX
G61 III OVE 58e

Default 139,000 Miles (35,000 on E85)

Here is a pic of the piston after the dude I sold it to blew the motor by switching it to pump gas and forgetting to turn down the boost controller:



Remarkable. They look almost brand new.
SVT_WRX is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-27-2012, 12:04 AM   #2510
907Bum
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 183634
Join Date: Jul 2008
Chapter/Region: RMIC
Location: At the "B"
Vehicle:
02 wrx/ 92 ss
Booze fueled :)

Default

Sucks about the piston but man that is impressive! Sooooo clean!
907Bum is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-29-2012, 06:49 PM   #2511
Rabid_Machina
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 167278
Join Date: Dec 2007
Chapter/Region: NWIC
Location: Lacey, WA
Vehicle:
2018 WRX STI DGM
2011 WRX WRB

Default

looking for a ballpark figure on what a 2.0l with a big 18g w/ supporting mods externally gated with 3 port EBC, ported IM and Ex. Mani's with 1200cc injectors would make.

currently sitting a 307.8whp 284.5wtq on a dynocom.

are bigger injectors necessary?

if so, i will go bigger. also plan on upgrading clutch.

what are some things i should be concerned about? my concerns are rotating assembly and tranny.

have a set of blast plates that i hope will help prevent trany flex as i go up on power.

i've read most of the first few pages, and kind of understand. it can get quite overwhelming with all the information given.

Last edited by Rabid_Machina; 06-29-2012 at 07:01 PM.
Rabid_Machina is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-01-2012, 09:26 PM   #2512
Il Capitano
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 299619
Join Date: Nov 2011
Chapter/Region: SCIC
Location: Glendale, CA
Vehicle:
2011 Evo X
WW

Default

I read the whole thing, but the conversion seems to good to be true. So all I need is a fuel pump (walbro 255) and 1000cc injectors plus a e85 tune? Also, can I run e85 on a stock 2012 wrx turbo with no problems? Thanks!!
Il Capitano is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-01-2012, 09:37 PM   #2513
the suicidal eggroll
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 51961
Join Date: Jan 2004
Chapter/Region: RMIC
Location: Broomfield, CO
Vehicle:
2005 STi
2012 WRX

Default

Walbro 255 is only good for 850cc injectors, I would go for a DW300 instead. But yes, that's all that's required.
the suicidal eggroll is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-01-2012, 09:51 PM   #2514
Il Capitano
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 299619
Join Date: Nov 2011
Chapter/Region: SCIC
Location: Glendale, CA
Vehicle:
2011 Evo X
WW

Default

Alright, I'll look into it. Thanks for the tip man.
Il Capitano is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-02-2012, 06:00 AM   #2515
RavingLunatic
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 76673
Join Date: Dec 2004
Chapter/Region: Tri-State
Location: Long Island
Vehicle:
2006 Impreza WRX STi
Crystal Grey Metallic

Default

I'm running dw300 and 1000cc top feed injectors. According to my tuner, that's the bare minimum. He normally likes 1200cc top feed
RavingLunatic is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-08-2012, 02:52 PM   #2516
ShugSTi
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 187128
Join Date: Aug 2008
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by the suicidal eggroll View Post
Walbro 255 is only good for 850cc injectors, I would go for a DW300 instead. But yes, that's all that's required.
http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/show....php?t=2277357
ShugSTi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-08-2012, 04:29 PM   #2517
the suicidal eggroll
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 51961
Join Date: Jan 2004
Chapter/Region: RMIC
Location: Broomfield, CO
Vehicle:
2005 STi
2012 WRX

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by ShugSTi View Post
...and your point is? You can't just quote somebody and then post a link to a 220 post thread with no explanation and expect anybody to know what you're trying to say.
the suicidal eggroll is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-09-2012, 02:36 PM   #2518
Silver_04_WRX_SC
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 67198
Join Date: Jul 2004
Chapter/Region: South East
Location: Inman, SC
Vehicle:
2004 WRX Wagon
WRB

Default

I am about to get tuned on the 20th. My mods are Walboro 255lph pump, modded 07 WRX injectors (740cc I think??) and a VF48. The tuner said that I would need a DW300 and 1000 injectors to run e85...is that true?

Thanks
Silver_04_WRX_SC is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-09-2012, 03:24 PM   #2519
WRX 2002
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 11211
Join Date: Oct 2001
Chapter/Region: MWSOC
Location: Gurnee IL
Vehicle:
2004 STi
Rally Blue

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Silver_04_WRX_SC View Post
I am about to get tuned on the 20th. My mods are Walboro 255lph pump, modded 07 WRX injectors (740cc I think??) and a VF48. The tuner said that I would need a DW300 and 1000 injectors to run e85...is that true?

Thanks
I was tuned for 489WHP in my STi with 1000cc injectors and a external Walboro 255lph pump with GT3076 turbo, I would think you would be fine with a VF48 turbo.
WRX 2002 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-09-2012, 04:27 PM   #2520
stalkerz
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 242207
Join Date: Mar 2010
Default

Just got my car tuned with e85, my tuner have to de-tune the car to 23psi because we were running a little lean on 24psi+. He said that he try to add more fuel but that didn't help and he think we ran out of pump.

What do u guys think? I thought the dw300 should be sufficient at this power level. Will Walbro400 solve my problem?

Car detail 06 STI
Access Port
ID1000
Aeromotive FPR
DW300 pump
Blouch 20gxt 3" 8cm2
tgv delete
70mm short ram
FMIC
GT Spec UEL headers+upipe with Tial 44mm
3 inch catless TBE
fully built motor(nitride crank, CP piston ,Eagle rods, ACL Bearings, Supertech Valve Springs&retainers, BC272)
stalkerz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-09-2012, 06:57 PM   #2521
RavingLunatic
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 76673
Join Date: Dec 2004
Chapter/Region: Tri-State
Location: Long Island
Vehicle:
2006 Impreza WRX STi
Crystal Grey Metallic

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by stalkerz View Post
Just got my car tuned with e85, my tuner have to de-tune the car to 23psi because we were running a little lean on 24psi+. He said that he try to add more fuel but that didn't help and he think we ran out of pump.

What do u guys think? I thought the dw300 should be sufficient at this power level. Will Walbro400 solve my problem?

Car detail 06 STI
Access Port
ID1000
Aeromotive FPR
DW300 pump
Blouch 20gxt 3" 8cm2
tgv delete
70mm short ram
FMIC
GT Spec UEL headers+upipe with Tial 44mm
3 inch catless TBE
fully built motor(nitride crank, CP piston ,Eagle rods, ACL Bearings, Supertech Valve Springs&retainers, BC272)
You didn't find your intake to be limiting? What numbers are you making? I had bought a walbro 460 (E85 Compliant) but was told that I was not going to make enough power to run it, so I ended up with the DW300 too. If you need the pump let me know. I have on that is brand new never installed. I need to sell it. PM me if your interested.
RavingLunatic is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-09-2012, 10:34 PM   #2522
stalkerz
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 242207
Join Date: Mar 2010
Default

according to my tuner I can go up to 27psi with a bigger pump like Walbro400, but I'm kind of shock to find out that the dw300 is ran out of fuel on my setup
stalkerz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-09-2012, 10:38 PM   #2523
RavingLunatic
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 76673
Join Date: Dec 2004
Chapter/Region: Tri-State
Location: Long Island
Vehicle:
2006 Impreza WRX STi
Crystal Grey Metallic

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by stalkerz View Post
according to my tuner I can go up to 27psi with a bigger pump like Walbro400, but I'm kind of shock to find out that the dw300 is ran out of fuel on my setup
from what I have seen, the Walbro 400 is not e85 compatible. the 460 is
RavingLunatic is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-09-2012, 11:39 PM   #2524
stalkerz
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 242207
Join Date: Mar 2010
Default

question is, I don't think I should be running out of pump below 25psi on a 20gxt
stalkerz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-10-2012, 08:49 AM   #2525
Silver_04_WRX_SC
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 67198
Join Date: Jul 2004
Chapter/Region: South East
Location: Inman, SC
Vehicle:
2004 WRX Wagon
WRB

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by WRX 2002 View Post
I was tuned for 489WHP in my STi with 1000cc injectors and a external Walboro 255lph pump with GT3076 turbo, I would think you would be fine with a VF48 turbo.
Thanks for the post.... Should I really try to push this tune then? They want me to spend some $$ and get Meth...but e85 is highly abundant in SC.
Silver_04_WRX_SC is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
What do you need to do to use E85 fuel? wantsti Rocky Mountains Impreza Club Forum -- RMIC 37 02-20-2014 01:27 AM
E85 fueling question- 850cc + fpgreen...adjustable FPR? Blown95ImpalaSS Factory 2.5L Turbo Powertrain (EJ Series Factory 2.5L Turbo) 5 09-29-2009 07:37 PM
E85-Fueled Z06, 30th Anniversary Corvettes to Pace ‘08 Indy 500 AVANTI R5 Non-Subaru News & Rumors 0 12-27-2007 01:56 PM
E85 fuel available now in Arvada 9/22/06 hotrod Rocky Mountains Impreza Club Forum -- RMIC 9 09-25-2006 02:29 PM
E85 Fuel in Austin? When? dromango Texas Impreza Club Forum -- TXIC 8 06-29-2006 01:32 PM

All times are GMT -4. The time now is 06:48 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Powered by Searchlight © 2024 Axivo Inc.
Copyright ©1999 - 2019, North American Subaru Impreza Owners Club, Inc.

As an Amazon Associate I earn from qualifying purchases.

When you click on links to various merchants on this site and make a purchase, this can result in this site earning a commission
Affiliate programs and affiliations include, but are not limited to, the eBay Partner Network.