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04-22-2011, 06:05 PM | #1 |
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Decided to start a new thread for everyone to discuss the different options for stock location twin scroll turbos. Many of us have been following the Blouch thread, Moore Performance etc, and it wouldn't have been appropriate for me to hijack their threads with discussions of competing products, which brings us here.
I haven't seen a thread dedicated to discussion on all the brands, so this one will cover any info found of each along with prices and hopefully first hand results to compare. Hopefully this will help those that are looking into twin scroll to know what their options are while saving them time. Here's the list I've come up with so far. DOWNPIPE SOLUTIONS http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/show...roll+downpipes Litchfield turbos "LM400 (HP rating) - S (Exhaust housing size S=small L=large) 60 (Compressor cover size) Examples of popular Turbo combinations: The LM400-S60 turbo is rated for around 400bhp with near standard spool up characteristics. This Turbo is designed to run on the 2.0litre STI engines and uses the smaller internal volute in order to maximize boost response. The turbo uses the 0.60 Compressor cover with the 58mm intake. This is the same spec of turbo we ran on our 2009 Type-20. The LM450-S60 turbo is rate for around 450bhp with peak boost arriving 500-700rpm later than the LM400. This Turbo is also designed to run on the 2.0litre engine and uses the smaller internal volute in order to maximize boost response. The turbo uses the 0.60 Compressor cover with the 58mm intake. The LM450-L60 is the 2.5litre version which produces 450bhp and uses the larger internal volute which does not become overwhelmed by the larger engines exhaust gas flow. This turbo uses the 0.60 and offers instant throttle response and no lag making a superb street turbo." They have recently announced that they have new billet wheels available, no pricing yet but many believe it to be the same. They also do thermal coating as standard. http://www.litchfieldimports.co.uk/l...roll_turbo.asp Pricing range from $2,400-2600 without shipping/duties Dyno Results LM480L60 http://bbs.scoobynet.com/showpost.ph...&postcount=416 http://bbs.scoobynet.com/showpost.ph...&postcount=430 http://bbs.scoobynet.com/showpost.ph...&postcount=661 LM450S60 http://bbs.scoobynet.com/showpost.ph...&postcount=521 LM400S60 http://bbs.scoobynet.com/showpost.ph...&postcount=728 http://bbs.scoobynet.com/showpost.ph...&postcount=831 LM400-s60 billet vs VF42 (2.0l JDM AVCS (intake), supporting mods: Kelford 264/260, ID725, 3-port solenoid, adjustable cam gear (exhaust). 3'' exhaust) WHP FUEL: VP100 http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/show...&postcount=676 http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/show...&postcount=681 Thread on Scoobynet http://bbs.scoobynet.com/scoobynet-g...oll-turbo.html Scoobyclinic (made by Blouch) These turbos are custom spec for SC by Blouch and use Billet wheels. SC42TS 420BHP No other details yet. http://shop.scoobyclinic.com/index.p...product_id=137 SC46TS 460BHP Believed to be 56.5mm Turbine 71mm Billet wheel, 7cm housing (possibly recently increased to 8cm or 10cm, 47lbs of flow) http://shop.scoobyclinic.com/index.p...product_id=139 SC50TS 500BHP. No exact details yet, most likely similar to the Blouch 3.0XT-R-TS http://shop.scoobyclinic.com/index.p...product_id=141 Dyno Results SC46 twin scroll E85 http://bbs.scoobynet.com/showpost.ph...&postcount=318 http://bbs.scoobynet.com/showpost.ph...&postcount=776 SC46 twin scroll on meth http://bbs.scoobynet.com/showpost.ph...&postcount=898 SC38 Twin scroll E85 http://bbs.scoobynet.com/showpost.ph...&postcount=815 VF37 vs SC46 TS both on E85 http://bbs.scoobynet.com/showpost.ph...postcount=1557 List of other SC turbo dyno graphs http://bbs.scoobynet.com/showpost.ph...&postcount=929 Scoobynet thread. One thing to note is that they have a SC46/36/38/30 single scroll and a twin scroll, so make sure when you see a dyno figure for a SC46 that it is for the twin scroll. http://bbs.scoobynet.com/trader-anno...an-better.html Blouch 1.5XT-R-TS: 47lb Ball Bearing Garrett CHRA 56.5mm Turbine, 71mm wheel. http://www.bptstore.com/Subaru-WRXST...ger_p_130.html 2.5XT-R-TS (using VF37): 47lb Ball Bearing Garrett CHRA. 56.5mm Turbine with 71mm wheel. This is the same as the new 1.5XT-R-TS, but the 1.5 has slightly better volutes. This turbo is not listed on their site, but they will still make it. 2.5XT-R-TS (new housing): 49lb Ball Bearing Garrett CHRA. 60mm Turbine with 71mm wheel. This is not listed on the site, but they will make it. They recommend you just go with the 3.0XT-R-TS though. 3.0XT-R-TS: 55lb Ball Bearing Garrett CHRA. 60mm Turbine, 76mm wheel. http://www.bptstore.com/Subaru-WRXST...ger_p_135.html Turbo Blankets The DEI T3 blanket will fit both the 1.5XT-R-TS and 2.5XT-R-TS Dyno Results Blouch 1.5XT-R-TS (V8 EJ207, 90 + meth) http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/show....php?t=2604726 Blouch 2.5XT-R-TS (I believe this is one of the old versions) http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/show...&postcount=691 Blouch 1.5XT-R-TS on a 2.5 with 8cm housing Fuel: 93 http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/show...&postcount=599 Same car but with the 10cm housing installed. http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/show...&postcount=641 Blouch 1.5XT-R-TS vs HTA68 vs FP Green http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/show...&postcount=647 Blouch 1.5XT-R-TS http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/show....php?t=2411269 Blouch 2.5XT-R-TS (new housing) E85 2.5L http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/show...&postcount=542 Moore Performance This is a interesting one being that they have created their own header setup to use EVO turbo's. Limited info on these right now but great potential with many turbo options. They are currently working on a setup for TMIC. UPDATE: New custom downpipe along with uppipe/header which work with the stock location turbo. http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/show...&postcount=637 Prices: Base kit - $2950 (includes everything but the turbo) With turbo- Starts at $3950 One benefit with this kit is you can sell your current setup entirely, which is really a pro for those with stock twin scroll. This could knock $1200-1400 off the price. IWSTI thread http://www.iwsti.com/forums/engine-p...turbo-kit.html Dyno graphs Custom Borg Warner http://forums.nasioc.net/forums/show....php?t=2153550 Evo9 turbo http://www.iwsti.com/forums/2899976-post138.html Not sure http://www.iwsti.com/forums/2994396-post192.html Evo8 used turbo http://www.iwsti.com/forums/3224989-post298.html Videos http://www.iwsti.com/forums/2893323-post123.html GT Pumps http://www.gtpumps.com.au/subaruturbos.html GTPS05T (TD06SL2-73HTA) twin scroll GTPS03T twin scroll (TD06SL2-20G) GTPS02T twin scroll (TD05H-20G) Pricing: Not listed for the twin scroll Thread at Rexnet http://www.rexnet.com.au/forum/index...os-at-gtpumps/ Tomei Arms twin scroll http://www.tomei-p.co.jp/_2003web-ca...rms_rset3.html Turbos: M7760: $1780 on their site (others say $2400) Dyno graph by them, not impressive IMO http://www.tomei-p.co.jp/_2003web-ca...60graf_e_b.gif Thread comparing it to the single scroll version on a EJ205, did poorly but can be blamed a bit on the EJ205 not having avcs. http://forums.nasioc.org/forums/show....php?t=2016008 NEW results: triniscoob running it with supporting mods and meth (321whp/283tq) and mentions it is horribly laggy and poor overall. http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/show...postcount=1583 Owen Developments Prices/Name of turbo not known yet. Dyno sheets Road Dyno logs
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Last edited by LIQUIDSK8S; 06-07-2014 at 10:13 AM. |
04-22-2011, 06:31 PM | #2 |
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It's a tough call for me between the LM450S60 and the SC46 TS. The LM450 get's a 3 inch inlet vs the 2.4 of the SC46. Very few dyno graphs out there, and no SC46 TS on pump while there are no LM450's on E85.
There's two SC46 TS's on E85 one with TMIC making a identical power curve to the LM450 on VPower while the FMIC makes 30bhp more (different tuners). There is a SC46 single scroll (I think) dyno sheet on Vpower which makes the same power as the LM450 on VPower, but it makes 60lbs more TQ, BUT it doesn't hold peak HP as well. The LM450 dropped from 460bhp at peak to 430bhp. The SC46 dropped from 460 to 370.....but this could be due to the tune/boost etc, details we don't have. Being that with the LM450 I can sell my VF37 for prolly $600ish, that will make it only $2-300 more than sending my turbo to Blouch. Not a big difference in price, it makes the decision even more difficult. |
04-22-2011, 06:33 PM | #3 |
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Thank you very much for this compilation, it's much appreciated!
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04-22-2011, 10:44 PM | #4 |
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Great thread...
From the research Ive done, the GTPumps, Scoobyclinic, and Tomei all use the same hotside (TD05 or TD06 18G/20G) for their turbos. (Except the SC46 which uses a Vf37) Only the compressor side and wheel might be different. The Litchfield looks to be the best and thats why it costs much more. |
04-22-2011, 11:41 PM | #5 |
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well i like what you have put together, kinda stinks, i gave up on stock locations and went with a bit twinscroll t4 and have to say i miss the spool some, but im keeping all my stock stuff incase i want the insta spool again lol or untill someone offers me the right amount for it
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04-23-2011, 08:05 AM | #6 | |
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04-23-2011, 08:21 AM | #7 |
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I'm not seeing any massive spool differences. I'd love to see what a green on a 207 w/avcs does vs some of these bigger twin scrolls. It would have to be big for me to change from my very drivable green with stock headers and stock style dp. Interesting options though. Thanks for posting it. If anyone wants to mail me a kit, I'll post the differences side by side
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04-23-2011, 09:24 AM | #8 | |
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04-23-2011, 11:43 AM | #9 | |
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04-23-2011, 12:54 PM | #10 |
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looks of research here man, good thread, looking forward to seeing what you decide to do.
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04-23-2011, 09:49 PM | #11 |
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Good thread. Subscribed.
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04-24-2011, 01:52 AM | #12 |
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Got an email out to blouch and Mike about the Vf37 turned Dom 2.5 xt-r. I'll be able to hopefully to give you guys a total cost and turn around time soon.
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04-24-2011, 09:45 AM | #13 | |
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04-24-2011, 11:25 AM | #14 |
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I was just on litchfield's site, it looks to me like the 76mm (3 inch) ported inlet is an additional option. That makes the base turbo price for the 450-60s $2400 plus another $206 for the larger housing. Also the 450-60s is rated to 450bhp (hence the name) where as the polka pickle is rated to 490bhp
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04-24-2011, 11:37 AM | #15 |
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I may go with blouch simply for being in the states, and knowing how well they support their turbos and rebuilds.
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04-24-2011, 01:28 PM | #16 | |
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04-24-2011, 01:30 PM | #17 | |
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04-24-2011, 01:57 PM | #18 | |
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04-30-2011, 10:26 PM | #19 |
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Good thread. But there is no way in H-E-L-L I would ever spend $2000ish on these bolt-ons when they are only going to net you maybe 30-50whp over what a stock vf36/37 will give ya. Thats why like seanathanq I decided to retain my stock twin scroll header and build a custom rotated twinscroll setup 8-)
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04-30-2011, 10:35 PM | #20 | |
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Granted, a new up pipe to run rotated twin scroll turbos/EVO turbos would be nice. I'd much rather spend $150-200 on a up pipe than $3k on the Moore setup. |
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04-30-2011, 10:56 PM | #21 |
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Less modification to the engine bay is worth it to me. Even the TD05-20G would make 350-360 on an ej20. The version 8 motor stock tuned w/ light bolt ons only makes about 280-290 on a mustang dyno, I don't know where people are finding vf37's making 350, less it be on a higher reading dyno.
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05-01-2011, 01:17 AM | #22 | |
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I have a v8 with a VF37, Tomei EL headers and a Tomei eXpreme DP. @ 21.5 Psi peak, I was making 272whp/307wtq on airboys. Switching to E85 later this week. Should be interesting. |
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05-01-2011, 10:22 AM | #23 |
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Do let us know the results of that, or link to a proven power thread why did you lose the stock manifold?
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05-01-2011, 10:49 AM | #24 | |
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05-01-2011, 12:24 PM | #25 |
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Another point to add, if you look at the SC46 vs VF37 its making an extra 100bhp. At near 400whp it's making a good 60-70whp more while not losing any response or spool.
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