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Old 11-04-2008, 11:54 PM   #451
parso_rex
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Will do. I had even tried a custom comp cover from my 3082R with a machined down 3" inlet but no difference, its the same unported entry though so of course you would expect that.
You can actually hear the surge on this link (and no It wasn't me videoing my car, I'm not into that)
I'll see how I go with the mechanical side of things then retune to suit and you never know I might be back on the thread again
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Last edited by parso_rex; 11-05-2008 at 12:03 AM.
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Old 11-05-2008, 01:02 AM   #452
Clark Turner
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Oh man.. That is horrible surge... What type and size of upipe do you have? That amount of surge is really going to hurt your performance. What BOV do you have? Is it possible its lifting? Can you do a pull with someone watching the valve? That much surge reminds of a certain brand of BOV. I found that it was lifting during spool and causing the compressor to let up and pressurize over and over again.

Clark
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Old 11-05-2008, 01:08 AM   #453
parso_rex
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Clark Turner View Post
Oh man.. That is horrible surge... What type and size of upipe do you have? That amount of surge is really going to hurt your performance. What BOV do you have? Is it possible its lifting? Can you do a pull with someone watching the valve? That much surge reminds of a certain brand of BOV. I found that it was lifting during spool and causing the compressor to let up and pressurize over and over again.

Clark
Custom up-pipe in both cases I cant recall the size off hand. I'm using an APS BOV , in both setups too hmmm that hadn't even crossed my mind at all. I was using a turbosmart pro-gate 48 originally but now I'm using Tial 38.
If this is a BOV issue I will die of embarassment
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Old 11-05-2008, 07:33 AM   #454
wrxsti.l
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lol parso
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Old 11-05-2008, 12:16 PM   #455
Clark Turner
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Thats the bov I spoke of. You need to take it apart and put 3 or 4 coins or washers inside for more preload.

Clark
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Old 11-05-2008, 12:56 PM   #456
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Clark Turner View Post
Thats the bov I spoke of. You need to take it apart and put 3 or 4 coins or washers inside for more preload.

Clark
Is this true of all APS dual-vent BOVs? I noticed some fluttering the last few days (and a little wastegate chatter for some time now). I am not really noticing any surging but maybe my Profec-B and Tial EWG are *handling* the disruption?
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Old 11-05-2008, 02:40 PM   #457
parso_rex
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wrxsti.l View Post
lol parso
Busted

Well I have a project for today it would seem
I'll see what happens


EDIT: Turns out it was almost on the minimum preload. While I was at it I pulled the thing to bits and regreased everything and set it up to maximum. I'm sure if this is to blame I will be able to notice , gees I hope so too LOL. Its sad that the workshops haven't picked this up before. I should have too of course

Last edited by parso_rex; 11-06-2008 at 01:06 AM.
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Old 11-07-2008, 11:13 PM   #458
parso_rex
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Well it would seem I owe Clark a beer (if you ever make it over here of course). After sneaking out to my publically owned 'test facility' I was able to log many full boost 4th & 5th gear runs and I now have no what I incorrectly termed 'compressor surge' . Its all stable. This also meant I could now sort out the boost control properly. Previously I was using the boost maps and response to sort of fight the surge but it was never really stable. Now with a couple of quick changes and few decent logs to look at I just have to modifiy the offset tables in the Autronic and I'm perfect
Thanks once again for the pointer Clark

There, now I can finally think about AVCS tuning LOL



/end of aside in the AVCS thread

Last edited by parso_rex; 11-07-2008 at 11:19 PM.
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Old 11-07-2008, 11:57 PM   #459
Clark Turner
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Glad to hear you got it working man. Just let me know if I can help in the future. I dont know everything, but I have seen alot of setups over the years. Glad I could help.

Clark
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Old 11-08-2008, 02:33 PM   #460
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Hi Clark, I have the Autronic SM4 in my S202 with the DR525 APS FMIC and APS BOV. I have the Dom 3 with the internal wastegate. This turbo is supposed to hold boost but I find it does not hold 24psi. I also have the BOV set to maximum, and am amazed how easily it blows off even under slight acceleration. Do you think putting some coins in there will help hold boost?

Thanks
Mike
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Old 11-08-2008, 07:04 PM   #461
Clark Turner
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If its leaking yes.. Most likely, You have to much pressure drop. Measure the boost pressure at the compressor housing. I think you will find its 30.

Clark
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Old 11-09-2008, 10:36 AM   #462
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Okay, will do thanks much!
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Old 11-11-2008, 07:54 PM   #463
korhan
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is there anybody tuned ej207 edm/jdm sti with cossy kk3920 cams.
specifications;
Intake Duration: 278 Degrees Intake Lift: 10.74mm
Exhaust Duration:274 Degrees Exhaust lift: 10.0mm.

my question is that, if we can use high avcs advane for example 5 or 10 at the top line like 7000 7500, is there any chance to hit the valves to pistons? in other words is there any physical limitations in avcs while using this cams?

i am sure that pro tuners dealed with this cams already and pleased to see their replies
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Old 11-11-2008, 08:22 PM   #464
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korhan,

What is the compression of your engine? Is it a stock 2.0lt EJ207?
Is there any re-surfacing on the block or on the head?

Cheers
Emre
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Old 11-12-2008, 10:06 AM   #465
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Quote:
Originally Posted by korhan View Post
is there anybody tuned ej207 edm/jdm sti with cossy kk3920 cams.
specifications;
Intake Duration: 278 Degrees Intake Lift: 10.74mm
Exhaust Duration:274 Degrees Exhaust lift: 10.0mm.

my question is that, if we can use high avcs advane for example 5 or 10 at the top line like 7000 7500, is there any chance to hit the valves to pistons? in other words is there any physical limitations in avcs while using this cams?

i am sure that pro tuners dealed with this cams already and pleased to see their replies
when we were running stock ECU, we maxed them out @ 30*
later, when we went Autronic SM4, we experimented with 40* with good results

it's alive so far
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Old 11-12-2008, 06:01 PM   #466
korhan
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emre ,

engine is stock 8 compression 207. there isnt any re-surficing only polishing on the block for head gasket sealing.

in my calculation the max value is something like 30 degree and i have to close them at 5000-5500. also there isnt any function above 5500.

40 degree seems high to me. which rpm till you used 40 degree and what is the closing rpm in your map?
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Old 11-12-2008, 06:21 PM   #467
sponaugle
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Quote:
Originally Posted by korhan View Post
my question is that, if we can use high avcs advane for example 5 or 10 at the top line like 7000 7500, is there any chance to hit the valves to pistons? in other words is there any physical limitations in avcs while using this cams?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hyper View Post
when we were running stock ECU, we maxed them out @ 30*
later, when we went Autronic SM4, we experimented with 40* with good results
it's alive so far
Quote:
Originally Posted by korhan View Post
emre ,
engine is stock 8 compression 207. there isnt any re-surficing only polishing on the block for head gasket sealing.
in my calculation the max value is something like 30 degree and i have to close them at 5000-5500. also there isnt any function above 5500.
40 degree seems high to me. which rpm till you used 40 degree and what is the closing rpm in your map?
Based on your first question (about running cam advance at 7000rpm), you are indicating that you think you could run less advance at higher rpm then lower rpm. I assume you are postulating this because at higher rpm the physical time for the valve to retract (thus follow the cam profile) is limited by the spring rate.

Typically this is not a problem as AVCS is usually off at redline. Generally you don't want the additional overlap once the car is fully spooled. There are certain cases where it may help out, but I would start with the assumption that you want to get AVCS to zero once you cross over about 5000 rpm.

As for the maximum allowed advance, I have seen similiar cams used with the stock JDM Spec C avcs map, which has >40 degrees of AVCS advance. Of course the only way to be sure is with some clay.

Jeff Sponaugle
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Old 11-13-2008, 08:15 AM   #468
korhan
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jeff thanks for the reply,

yes, i think that additional overlap is not important with that cam profile, because duration and lift is much more important than the cam advance at these revs. am i right in your point?

with stock cams we are using 44 degree at low rpm and 10 degree at high rpm. it is tapering from 44 to 10 at the all map in a interpolated way.

with cossy cams i decide to tune the map like 30 degrees at bottom 2000-4000 rpm after spool, i am going to taper to 10 degrees at 5500 and 0 below that point.

Jeff in your decision does avcs needed below 5500-6000, does it gives any power with this cam specification?

this calculation and values are only a decision when i run the car, it will be different due to power but i am just try to find the basic view and bases of the cossy cams.

turbo is a green 8 cm and i am using also cossy ultra high rev double springs and titanium retainers.
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Old 02-19-2009, 06:35 PM   #469
west_minist
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Hey guys:

Clarke or anyone, tell me something. I have two cars where the mechanics work on the heads, either reseat the valve or new valvetrain and since that, the AVCS is not working. Sometimes one side will work.

Do you know what the problem is and how it can be fix?
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Old 02-21-2009, 02:06 AM   #470
Clark Turner
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Cam timing off.

OR

Someone used an impact wrench to trq down the Cam sprockets which locked them to the cams.

Clark
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Old 02-21-2009, 09:48 AM   #471
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Clarke, I greatly appreciate this info.

I will pass this off to the mechanic. She was trained by Subaru, but not on these models, since there aren't native.
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Old 02-21-2009, 01:51 PM   #472
Clark Turner
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Its important to TRQ them down to the spec. Also.. I have had cars never advance the cams. I try 5 different Rom files. One of them will work. The AVCS system only has a few codes and if its not working it will not throw a code in most cases. This makes Trouble shooting tough...

Let me know what you find....


Clark
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Old 02-21-2009, 02:52 PM   #473
west_minist
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Ok. I will

Talking to one of the helpers, the 2005+ export WRX had AVCS, but he did not communicated thoroughly the proper torquing.

There are at a lost and do not seem to communicate issues with Subaru.

in my industry, any problems with hardware or software, we get on the phone with the manufacture. I use to work for Carriers.

I will keep you posted.
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Old 03-08-2009, 10:42 AM   #474
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Clarke, from what I was told, its was the some silicon log in the avcs solenoid area.
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Old 03-08-2009, 08:44 PM   #475
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Hi Guys,
Back in this thread once again. I thought I'd see what advice you US guys might be able to offer with my latest project, The Motors coming out once again and this time we're fitting a set of Kelford 264 cams into my 2.5L over here in Sydney. Currently I'm running the stock 2L ADM/EDM cams from my cars original 2.0L engine.
Has anyone had problems with the stock timing belt or gates belts. I haven't cracked the thing apart yet but I believe it currently has a gates belt . I've heard rumours that there can be issues where the belt itself stretches especially with increased spring pressure setups like mine. I've had some instances where the two cams report back slight differences in location (logging with the Autronic). Obviously this can be due to oil pressure and other solenoid related variables but I'd like to eliminate all possibilities. I've removed the filters
I've also had suggested to me that the STI motorsport belt is much less prone to stretching but the $$ figure is about 300% over here. With the newer cars being dual AVCS I'd be thinking the standard belts must surely be up to the task. Thoughts ??

I can put up a copy of my current AVCS map amongst other things

Cheers

Mark

Sydney AU







Specs just incase anyone asks
Sleeved 2.5L
Pauter rods and CP's 8:1 comp
Nitrided(nitrated) crank
mildly ported heads stock cams JUN retainers and springs
GT spec Style 4>1 unequal headers
Rotated GT35R
Autronic SM4
Sard 800cc inj
etc
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