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08-04-2008, 12:42 AM | #1 |
Scooby Guru
Member#: 36135
Join Date: May 2003
Chapter/Region:
Tri-State
Location: New York City
Vehicle:2005 WRX Aspen White |
first cylinder 1 misfire, after plugs, 1,3,4 misfire!
and a blinking CEL! I recently got one step colder NGK iridiums for my 05 WRX, vf39, supporting mods (to hopefully cure a cylinder 1 misfire) but literally 20 mins after the installation, the cEL came back. And about 2 days or driving, I pulled the code again and it was cylinder 1&3 this time. I then replaced cylinder one's coilpack to see if that was the original problem and no change at all. The misfire comes and goes randomly. I thought it was dirty wiring harness but I cleaned everything nicely.
a week later of no driving, then I get the code pulled again today and it's 1,3 & 4! Do you guys think that coincidentally, the one step colder plugs could have caused cylinder 2 and 4 to misfire as well? I honestly don't know what else to check. I'm thinking about just buy cheap NGK coppers (will that be ok with my vf39?) and seeing if thaqt fixes it. I wouldnt know how to check for bad wiring? Please help. The car runs PERFECTLY and for some reason it started with the cylinder one misfire a few weeks ago. My friend datalogged the car and said there was nothing wrong mechanically, but he said it could be the gap. I bought the iridiums regapped at .028 from oakos. isn't that correct? When i drive, i smell gas, so im not sure what that means.
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Last edited by DieselClown; 08-04-2008 at 12:48 AM. |
08-04-2008, 12:58 AM | #2 |
Scooby Guru
Member#: 36135
Join Date: May 2003
Chapter/Region:
Tri-State
Location: New York City
Vehicle:2005 WRX Aspen White |
can somebody tell me what to possibly check for when taking out the plugs again? I remembered the first time this happened, when I swapped all 4 plugs...cylinder one's plug was noticeably more white. What does that mean?
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08-04-2008, 07:19 AM | #3 |
Scooby Guru
Member#: 32792
Join Date: Feb 2003
Chapter/Region:
NESIC
Location: lincoln, ri
Vehicle:2003 GGA MBP 12.9 / 105+ |
here's a pretty good page on reading plugs:
http://www.4secondsflat.com/Spark_plug_reading.html as far as systemic misfires, it is unlikely to be the cause of all four plugs or coils. generally it's something more global, like AFR. do you have access to an OBD scanner? even better would be someone with a tactrix cable. i would be interested in your fuel trims, especially at idle. an exhaust leak, a front o2 sensor on the way out, a dirty maf sensor, an induction leak can all throw off the mixture enough to cause the car to miss. |
08-04-2008, 02:46 PM | #4 |
Scooby Specialist
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NESIC
Location: Waltham Ma
Vehicle:2011 Subaru Legacy White |
if your smelling gas, I believe its possible that your car isnt firing in those specific cylinders and its just kinda lurking through your system. Are you back firing a lot? along with hesitations and bucking?
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08-04-2008, 02:56 PM | #5 |
Scooby Specialist
Member#: 24129
Join Date: Sep 2002
Chapter/Region:
MAIC
Location: annapolis Md
Vehicle:2002 wrx,EVO3 big16g WRB 4.444fd Enginuity,E85 |
what do these conditions indicate? My car does this. I changed the coils and the fuel pump and new plugs, It runs fine up to 12psi and 5000 rpm. If you floor it it hesitates at 5000rpm If you roll into throttle smoothly it will Go higher really well. I also changed my clutch and flywheel to a Sti 6speed unit in my 5 speed housing along with 4.444 conversion and front LSD , after my car was last tuned. Do you think the old tune could be my issue?
Last edited by frdawg; 08-04-2008 at 03:09 PM. |
08-04-2008, 03:08 PM | #6 |
Scooby Guru
Member#: 36135
Join Date: May 2003
Chapter/Region:
Tri-State
Location: New York City
Vehicle:2005 WRX Aspen White |
thanks for the info. Im trying to see if somebody locally can help me scan my car again. I had a tatrix cable a long time ago, and if I find it, what software can i use? Enginuity?
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08-04-2008, 03:11 PM | #7 |
Scooby Guru
Member#: 36135
Join Date: May 2003
Chapter/Region:
Tri-State
Location: New York City
Vehicle:2005 WRX Aspen White |
also, I have no excessive backfiring as far as I can tell. The hesitations are strongest at idle and lower rpms. It used to be random, but now it's constantly hesitating and I feel like I can walk faster than my car.
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08-05-2008, 01:29 PM | #8 |
Scooby Newbie
Member#: 147339
Join Date: Apr 2007
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Location: Lexington, Kentucky
Vehicle:05 STi |
I'm pretty close to being in the same boat as you are. Cylinder 1 and 3 seem to be the ones that like to miss on mine. I do backfire alot while giving it gas right after start up though. Just thinking about trying to find the source of my misfires makes me want to curl up in a ball. There are so many possibilities.
Keep us updated so that I can know if anything seems to help yours out. Could it be the 1 step colders? That's what I have too. |
08-05-2008, 08:37 PM | #9 |
Scooby Guru
Member#: 36135
Join Date: May 2003
Chapter/Region:
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Location: New York City
Vehicle:2005 WRX Aspen White |
thanks...i was thinking it could be the one step colder plugs too. Are they too much for a vf39?
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08-06-2008, 06:33 AM | #10 |
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Location: lincoln, ri
Vehicle:2003 GGA MBP 12.9 / 105+ |
that depends on your driving habits mostly, and your tune to a lesser extent.
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08-07-2008, 05:45 PM | #11 |
Scooby Specialist
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Join Date: Sep 2002
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Vehicle:2002 wrx,EVO3 big16g WRB 4.444fd Enginuity,E85 |
I fixed mine. I had replacedtwo coils based off misfires on 1/4 cyl turns out 2/4 were really bad. Switched coils. And voilà
Last edited by frdawg; 08-08-2008 at 06:05 PM. |
08-09-2008, 08:49 PM | #12 |
Scooby Guru
Member#: 36135
Join Date: May 2003
Chapter/Region:
Tri-State
Location: New York City
Vehicle:2005 WRX Aspen White |
thanks again all. I'm going to try swapping out coils to see if that works. So the .28 gap is correct on the NGK iridiums? I shouldn't touch that right?
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08-11-2008, 03:34 AM | #13 |
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Just curious, did you actually measure the gaps or just assumed they were correct out of the box?
Always check the gaps regardless. Who knows who threw those boxes around before they got to you. |
08-11-2008, 11:01 AM | #14 |
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yes, that gap is fine. I think anywhere from 28 to 31 is okay.
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08-11-2008, 11:52 AM | #15 |
Scooby Guru
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Join Date: May 2003
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Vehicle:2005 WRX Aspen White |
i double-checked them before and they each measured around .28. do you think having the one step colder plugs made the other 2 cylinders misfire? Before i swapped plugs, only cyl 1 misfired and then only randomly. after i swapped them, 1,3,4 misfired.
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08-12-2008, 11:23 AM | #16 |
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What plugs were they when cyl 1 misfired (heat range and type [copper, plats, iridium])? (Gap is .028-.031", not .28-.31")... Since you're running a vf39 I assume you swapped injectors, did you check to make sure they're not leaking, were they purchased new or were they tested?
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08-12-2008, 12:34 PM | #17 |
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Even with the .028 gap it may need to be adjusted closer to the .031. As I had problems with the gap even at the the quote correct gap.
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08-12-2008, 12:47 PM | #18 |
Scooby Guru
Member#: 36135
Join Date: May 2003
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Vehicle:2005 WRX Aspen White |
they were the stock plugs when only cyl1 misfired. I thought it might have been the coilpacks, but when I swapped out all 4 plugs, the car was fine and the CEL cleared. Then about 20 mins later, it misfired again. the injectors are sti pinks which were new when i bought them. how do I check it they are leaking?
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08-12-2008, 01:09 PM | #19 |
Scooby Specialist
Member#: 82243
Join Date: Mar 2005
Chapter/Region:
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Vehicle:13' BMW X3 35i |
I meant literally check if there is a fuel leak near, specifically around the o-rings since you said you smelled gas. If they're new though I doubt they would have an issue, unless the o-rings were torn. I would try to go back to the stock heat range - try out coppers because a few people (myself included) have had problems with iridiums and misfiring.
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08-12-2008, 01:09 PM | #20 |
Scooby Guru
Member#: 32792
Join Date: Feb 2003
Chapter/Region:
NESIC
Location: lincoln, ri
Vehicle:2003 GGA MBP 12.9 / 105+ |
misfires can also be caused by a bad tune, particularly fuel-related in the idle region.
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08-12-2008, 01:38 PM | #21 |
Scooby Specialist
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Vehicle:2004 STi 2004 A4 |
If a cylinder was not firing, the ECU would inject extra fuel to make up for the unburned O2 it's seeing at the O2 sensor. Things end up running so rich that the extra fuel causes more misfire events... that may explain your fuel smell. Also, it may sound weird, but if you're getting codes for cylinders 1, 3, and 4... then I would take a look at cylinder 2 first.
- Examine the condition of the plugs for clues - Compression test (why is everyone so hesitant to do this?) - test/check the ignition coils - test/check the fuel injectors |
08-12-2008, 02:23 PM | #22 |
Scooby Guru
Member#: 36135
Join Date: May 2003
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sorry but how do you do a compression test?
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08-12-2008, 02:42 PM | #23 |
Scooby Guru
Member#: 36135
Join Date: May 2003
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Tri-State
Location: New York City
Vehicle:2005 WRX Aspen White |
i can get a hold of a scanner! Can somebody tell me what to look for?
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08-12-2008, 07:25 PM | #24 |
Scooby Guru
Member#: 36135
Join Date: May 2003
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Vehicle:2005 WRX Aspen White |
ok,...got the following freeze frame data.
shot term fuel trim 0.0 coolant temp 135 Lt fuel trim 7.8 Map 9.4 IGN ADV 16.0 IAT 113 degrees MAF lb/min .506 ABSLT TPS 16.1 I'm not really sure what all this means! |
08-13-2008, 02:17 AM | #25 |
Scooby Guru
Member#: 62856
Join Date: May 2004
Chapter/Region:
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Location: McDowells
Vehicle:MBP SQC#197 Stockpiling parts... |
Compression test.
BTW, motoracer can do it for you also. http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/show...mpression+test Ahh just realized the pics are gone. |
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