Welcome to the North American Subaru Impreza Owners Club Thursday March 28, 2024
Home Forums Images WikiNASIOC Products Store Modifications Upgrade Garage
NASIOC
Go Back   NASIOC > NASIOC Technical > Built Motor Discussion

Welcome to NASIOC - The world's largest online community for Subaru enthusiasts!
Welcome to the NASIOC.com Subaru forum.

You are currently viewing our forum as a guest, which gives you limited access to view most discussions and access our other features. By joining our community, free of charge, you will have access to post topics, communicate privately with other members (PM), respond to polls, upload content and access many other special features. Registration is free, fast and simple, so please join our community today!

If you have any problems with the registration process or your account login, please contact us.







* As an Amazon Associate I earn from qualifying purchases. 
* Registered users of the site do not see these ads. 
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 12-26-2012, 10:30 PM   #1
scootarida1
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 154534
Join Date: Jul 2007
Chapter/Region: MAIC
Location: Richmond, VA
Vehicle:
2018 WRX STI Limited
Black

Default Power Wagon Build Thread

I figured I should put some pictures of the setup I am running.



[Original Post Detail]
So I recently did a compression test since my 05 FXT was consuming about a qt of oil every 500 miles or so.

Here are the results (completed within 30 min of shutdown)

3---134 psi 4---125 psi
1---129 psi 2---121 psi


Unfortunately I was not able to run a leak down test because I couldn't find a socket for the crank. But from the compression test, it looks like its time for a rebuild. Let me know what everyone one else thinks.

My plan so far for the motor is:

Manley 8.5:1 99.75 Pistons
Manley H Rods or Eagle H Rods (Not Sure Yet)
King Race Bearings
ARP Head Studs

I am also looking to convert to top feed injectors. Im looking at the Five-O Black Ops 1400cc injectors.

The car is a DD and am looking for about 425-450 WHP on 93. So I plan on running tighter clearances since the car will only see a spirited pull here and there.

I'm thinking around 0.0028" for the PW clearance and I'm not sure for the rod and main clearances yet.

Anything I'm missing?
* Registered users of the site do not see these ads.

Last edited by scootarida1; 01-05-2013 at 08:14 PM. Reason: Add pictures
scootarida1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
* Registered users of the site do not see these ads.
Old 12-26-2012, 10:54 PM   #2
Turn in Concepts
Former Vendor
 
Member#: 93646
Join Date: Aug 2005
Chapter/Region: MWSOC
Vehicle:
Many Track Records
Let us help you go fast!

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by scootarida1 View Post
So I recently did a compression test since my 05 FXT was consuming about a qt of oil every 500 miles or so.

Here are the results (completed within 30 min of shutdown)

3---134 psi 4---125 psi
1---129 psi 2---121 psi


Unfortunately I was not able to run a leak down test because I couldn't find a socket for the crank. But from the compression test, it looks like its time for a rebuild. Let me know what everyone one else thinks.

My plan so far for the motor is:

Manley 8.5:1 99.75 Pistons
Manley H Rods or Eagle H Rods (Not Sure Yet)
ACL Race Bearings
ARP Head Studs

I am also looking to convert to top feed injectors. Im looking at the Five-O Black Ops 1400cc injectors.

The car is a DD and am looking for about 425-450 WHP on 93. So I plan on running tighter clearances since the car will only see a spirited pull here and there.

I'm thinking around 0.0028" for the PW clearance and I'm not sure for the rod and main clearances yet.

Anything I'm missing?
For 93 on a dd with forged pistons and no constant beat, but with 400-425 awhp I would do:

PWC minimum .003 with a happy spot of .0035
mains at .0012-.0014
rods at .0002 more than the mains.

top rings at .014-.015
second at .017 - .018
OCR rails at min spec of .015

At least that would be my starting point.

Just do the manley rods - there's a thread on this very subject going right now.

If you were burning that much oil you WILL have to at least clean the valves, and you will have to check the seats as I'm betting you have a good bit of carbon buildup going on with those.

Last edited by Turn in Concepts; 12-27-2012 at 12:54 PM.
Turn in Concepts is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-26-2012, 11:16 PM   #3
scootarida1
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 154534
Join Date: Jul 2007
Chapter/Region: MAIC
Location: Richmond, VA
Vehicle:
2018 WRX STI Limited
Black

Default

Yeah I've been reading that thread on the manley's. I will get the heads checked out for sure. Thanks for the input on the specs. I will take them into consideration when I am assembling the block.
scootarida1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-26-2012, 11:25 PM   #4
05_wRex
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 170097
Join Date: Jan 2008
Chapter/Region: South East
Location: Chattanooga, TN
Vehicle:
2007 WRX STi PTE6266
OBP

Default

Is your current engine stock internals?
05_wRex is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-26-2012, 11:26 PM   #5
scootarida1
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 154534
Join Date: Jul 2007
Chapter/Region: MAIC
Location: Richmond, VA
Vehicle:
2018 WRX STI Limited
Black

Default

yes current is stock
scootarida1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-26-2012, 11:46 PM   #6
05_wRex
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 170097
Join Date: Jan 2008
Chapter/Region: South East
Location: Chattanooga, TN
Vehicle:
2007 WRX STi PTE6266
OBP

Default

Gotcha. I figured. My compression numbers are pretty close to yours, but my engine is built.
05_wRex is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-26-2012, 11:49 PM   #7
scootarida1
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 154534
Join Date: Jul 2007
Chapter/Region: MAIC
Location: Richmond, VA
Vehicle:
2018 WRX STI Limited
Black

Default

Yeah I felt that they were kind of low. Fairly consistent but Cyl 2 is to low for my liking.
scootarida1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-26-2012, 11:55 PM   #8
yetogetanrs2
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 153106
Join Date: Jul 2007
Chapter/Region: South East
Location: Tampa, FL
Default

Look into the Manley Turbo Tuffs. A bit on the heavier side but! Very strong.

I know for my build we are running .0038-.0041. From the research we've done that was a good happy median for a forged piston I am using.

I also plan to do a little more than just a few pulls here and there.

To add onto what TiC said. I was burning quite a bit of oil before my engine failed (seized ring). I had to get my heads at least refreshed and cleaned, but decided to just get them rebuilt for the extra bit of cash. I had ALOT of build up on the exhaust side, I mean ALOT.

Last edited by yetogetanrs2; 12-27-2012 at 09:49 AM.
yetogetanrs2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-27-2012, 11:22 AM   #9
oldandslowjim
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 259570
Join Date: Oct 2010
Default clearance

to turn in concepts do you really mean .003+ rod clearance or was that a typo or did i read it wrong
oldandslowjim is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-27-2012, 11:36 AM   #10
kakarot09
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 182375
Join Date: Jun 2008
Chapter/Region: SWIC
Location: Northern Nevada
Vehicle:
2013 Sti
World Rally Blue

Default

I think they really meant to say .002 and that it was bigger than the mains. Not mains + .002. They don't need to be that loose.
kakarot09 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-27-2012, 11:38 AM   #11
kakarot09
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 182375
Join Date: Jun 2008
Chapter/Region: SWIC
Location: Northern Nevada
Vehicle:
2013 Sti
World Rally Blue

Default

TIC it's interesting that you say .0014-.0015 top ring gap. Would you be okay with that for road racing 400whp?
kakarot09 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-27-2012, 12:53 PM   #12
Turn in Concepts
Former Vendor
 
Member#: 93646
Join Date: Aug 2005
Chapter/Region: MWSOC
Vehicle:
Many Track Records
Let us help you go fast!

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by kakarot09 View Post
TIC it's interesting that you say .0014-.0015 top ring gap. Would you be okay with that for road racing 400whp?
Nope. I would go bigger for road racing.

Given what he's doing, and it's the occasional blast to top power, not all the time at WOT that's what I would go with.
Turn in Concepts is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-27-2012, 12:54 PM   #13
Turn in Concepts
Former Vendor
 
Member#: 93646
Join Date: Aug 2005
Chapter/Region: MWSOC
Vehicle:
Many Track Records
Let us help you go fast!

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by oldandslowjim View Post
to turn in concepts do you really mean .003+ rod clearance or was that a typo or did i read it wrong
Quote:
Originally Posted by kakarot09 View Post
I think they really meant to say .002 and that it was bigger than the mains. Not mains + .002. They don't need to be that loose.
typo. meant to say .0002 bigger than mains. so if mains are .0014 rods are .0016.

Fixing that now.
Turn in Concepts is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-27-2012, 01:57 PM   #14
oldandslowjim
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 259570
Join Date: Oct 2010
Default clearance

thanks for answer tic jim
oldandslowjim is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-27-2012, 04:23 PM   #15
Turn in Concepts
Former Vendor
 
Member#: 93646
Join Date: Aug 2005
Chapter/Region: MWSOC
Vehicle:
Many Track Records
Let us help you go fast!

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by oldandslowjim View Post
thanks for answer tic jim
No prob. Sorry about the typo.
Turn in Concepts is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-27-2012, 07:27 PM   #16
KillerBMotorsport
NASIOC Vendor
 
Member#: 198281
Join Date: Dec 2008
Chapter/Region: MAIC
Location: Virginia
Vehicle:
2005 WRX/STi
WRB of course

Default

Quick question... Were those compression numbers cold or hot?
KillerBMotorsport is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-27-2012, 08:26 PM   #17
scootarida1
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 154534
Join Date: Jul 2007
Chapter/Region: MAIC
Location: Richmond, VA
Vehicle:
2018 WRX STI Limited
Black

Default

Those numbers were hot.
scootarida1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-04-2013, 04:48 PM   #18
scootarida1
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 154534
Join Date: Jul 2007
Chapter/Region: MAIC
Location: Richmond, VA
Vehicle:
2018 WRX STI Limited
Black

Default

Well just an update, this thread is becoming a build thread. I have ordered a bunch of parts and will have pictures in the next few days.
scootarida1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-05-2013, 06:36 PM   #19
scootarida1
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 154534
Join Date: Jul 2007
Chapter/Region: MAIC
Location: Richmond, VA
Vehicle:
2018 WRX STI Limited
Black

Default

Some goodies came in. I received my pistons and rods. I also received a bunch of measuring tools and a scale to balance out the components. Here is a teaser pictures along with many more as I measure and weigh the items.

scootarida1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-05-2013, 08:05 PM   #20
scootarida1
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 154534
Join Date: Jul 2007
Chapter/Region: MAIC
Location: Richmond, VA
Vehicle:
2018 WRX STI Limited
Black

Default

Measuring and Weighing the pistons using a micrometer good to 0.0001". Its been a while since I did some measuring with a micrometer so I took a bunch of measurements until they were consistent.






Piston 1:




Weight: 397.5 g (picture is lying, re-weighed with the piston skirt facing the same as the others)
Diameter: 3.9237 "



Piston 2:




Weight: 397.7 g
Diameter: 3.9237 "



Piston 3:




Weight: 397.6 g
Diameter: 3.9235 "



Piston 4:




Weight: 397.8 g
Diameter: 3.9237 "




So far the pistons seem fairly well balanced and the diameters are within the tolerances I would accept. I will see how the piston pins weigh out to see if I can balance the pistons closer and bring piston 1 closer to the others.

Last edited by scootarida1; 01-05-2013 at 08:06 PM. Reason: add detail/formatting
scootarida1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-06-2013, 11:52 AM   #21
scootarida1
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 154534
Join Date: Jul 2007
Chapter/Region: MAIC
Location: Richmond, VA
Vehicle:
2018 WRX STI Limited
Black

Default

Did some more weighing today:

Pin 1:



Weight: 131.9 g


Pin 2:



Weight: 132.0 g


Pin 3:



Weight: 131.7 g


Pin 4:



Weight: 131.8 g


All of the rings weighed 26.4g. However I think they will change slightly when I need to gap them so I am not taking them into account for picking the correct combination for balancing.






But it looks like my piston weight issue can be solved. The final combinations of pistons and pins are:

Piston 1---Pin 2
Piston 2---Pin 4
Piston 3---Pin 1
Piston 4---Pin 3

This brings all of the pistons+pins to a weight of 529.5 g.
scootarida1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-08-2013, 01:12 AM   #22
scootarida1
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 154534
Join Date: Jul 2007
Chapter/Region: MAIC
Location: Richmond, VA
Vehicle:
2018 WRX STI Limited
Black

Default

So I am going to be balancing the rods in the next couple of days. I figure I'll balance the big ends and then do the small ends.

Where is everyone removing material on the big ends? The only area that seems feasible is around the sides by the bolts and just following the contour on a belt sander.
scootarida1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-08-2013, 01:28 AM   #23
808-wrx
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 151703
Join Date: Jun 2007
Chapter/Region: NWIC
Location: bremerton Washington
Vehicle:
2002 wrx 6speed son!
WRB

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by scootarida1 View Post
So I am going to be balancing the rods in the next couple of days. I figure I'll balance the big ends and then do the small ends.

Where is everyone removing material on the big ends? The only area that seems feasible is around the sides by the bolts and just following the contour on a belt sander.
I talked to one of the tech reps (at the manley booth) at subiefest and he said it was not a good idea to shave or grind any of there rods. It weakens/takes off the strength coating and causes a weak link. Im not a pro motor builder just thats what the guy said.

Im in your same boat rite now. Just did my leak down and found lots of air coming out of the dipstick and oil fill tube.
808-wrx is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-08-2013, 08:47 AM   #24
mboulton
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 174433
Join Date: Mar 2008
Default

Not a pro, but.......


Balances small ends first, then big ends.
mboulton is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-08-2013, 10:01 AM   #25
scootarida1
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 154534
Join Date: Jul 2007
Chapter/Region: MAIC
Location: Richmond, VA
Vehicle:
2018 WRX STI Limited
Black

Default

okay thanks.
scootarida1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

All times are GMT -4. The time now is 10:48 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Powered by Searchlight © 2024 Axivo Inc.
Copyright ©1999 - 2019, North American Subaru Impreza Owners Club, Inc.

As an Amazon Associate I earn from qualifying purchases.

When you click on links to various merchants on this site and make a purchase, this can result in this site earning a commission
Affiliate programs and affiliations include, but are not limited to, the eBay Partner Network.