Welcome to the North American Subaru Impreza Owners Club Friday March 29, 2024
Home Forums Images WikiNASIOC Products Store Modifications Upgrade Garage
NASIOC
Go Back   NASIOC > NASIOC Technical > Factory 2.0L Turbo Powertrain (EJ Series Factory 2.0L Turbo)

Welcome to NASIOC - The world's largest online community for Subaru enthusiasts!
Welcome to the NASIOC.com Subaru forum.

You are currently viewing our forum as a guest, which gives you limited access to view most discussions and access our other features. By joining our community, free of charge, you will have access to post topics, communicate privately with other members (PM), respond to polls, upload content and access many other special features. Registration is free, fast and simple, so please join our community today!

If you have any problems with the registration process or your account login, please contact us.







* As an Amazon Associate I earn from qualifying purchases. 
* Registered users of the site do not see these ads. 
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 10-09-2007, 07:01 AM   #126
ride5000
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 32792
Join Date: Feb 2003
Chapter/Region: NESIC
Location: lincoln, ri
Vehicle:
2003 GGA MBP
12.9 / 105+

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by 1x2 View Post
What if I pulled both hoses and plugged the 4 outlets? Any downside?
the downside to this is you have "dead ends" where coolant will no longer flow.

over time these can develop deposits since they are not flushed out with fresh coolant.

Quote:
Originally Posted by williaty View Post
Pop!.
it won't go pop.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MasterKwan View Post
I wouldn't. Without knowing if that bypass is needed in the cooling system I'd leave it the way the factory intended it to be (meaning do what that picture shows above).
in the informational section of the fsm the coolant path is indicated. in fact, i think i posted a screencap of that system diagram in a prior discussion about thermostats.

in short, it is not needed.

Quote:
Originally Posted by crampfan View Post
TB icing is not a winter problem, 60-70 deg. with high humidity. with the throttle closed, you can get ice. I have only seen it happen one time (motorcycle) but it can happen.
any pilot will tell you that icing is not a cold weather thing.
sure, pilots will tell you that. it's cold up there!

take it from someone who has put on 60k+ miles in new england without a TB heater--ice is not a problem.

Quote:
Originally Posted by anickode View Post
I wonder if the coolant passages in the Throttle body would stand up to having CO2 vented through them... perhaps en route to an IC spray bar?
in order for it to absorb heat, co2 must be allowed to expand. the change of state from liquid to gas is what actually draws in heat from the surroundings.

not to mention the fact that the water jacket is probably not designed for the high pressures commonly seen in co2 systems.
* Registered users of the site do not see these ads.
ride5000 is offline   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
* Registered users of the site do not see these ads.
Old 10-09-2007, 08:00 AM   #127
nhluhr
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 7327
Join Date: Jun 2001
Chapter/Region: NWIC
Location: Seattle, WA
Vehicle:
2008 Mazdaspeed3
2006 Wrangler Sport

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by ride5000 View Post
the downside to this is you have "dead ends" where coolant will no longer flow.

over time these can develop deposits since they are not flushed out with fresh coolant.



it won't go pop.
depending on the type of 'plug' used


Quote:
in the informational section of the fsm the coolant path is indicated. in fact, i think i posted a screencap of that system diagram in a prior discussion about thermostats.

in short, it is not needed.
yep - the throttle body is a parallel circuit all by itself and comes after everything else that needs cooling. it's the last parallel path before heading back to the thermostat.


Quote:
sure, pilots will tell you that. it's cold up there!
on the last flight i was on, the 767 had those informational screens that tell you all kinds of data including outside air temperature. at 38,000ft the OAT was around -50*F on a hot, summer day.

Quote:
take it from someone who has put on 60k+ miles in new england without a TB heater--ice is not a problem.
I too have had absolutely 0 trouble with this over many thousands of summer and winter miles.
nhluhr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-09-2007, 12:05 PM   #128
williaty
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 71092
Join Date: Sep 2004
Chapter/Region: MWSOC
Location: Licking County, Ohio
Vehicle:
2005 2.5RS Wagon
Regal Blue Pearl

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by ride5000 View Post
it won't go pop.
If you put just a vacuum cap over the end of the tube on the block like most people use to seal tube the TB coolant passage after it's been disconnected, the first time you pressurize the coolant system, that little bugger is going into orbit. Which will lead to you spraying coolant all over the heated engine bay.

Which will lead to massive quantities of white smoke coming out of the grille, the hood shut lines, the vents, everywhere really. Which will lead to everyone in the car freaking out. Which will lead to the driver swerving across 5 lanes of rush hour traffic to catch the first exit. Which will lead to shooting off the exit ramp into the entry to an ER cause that's what the ramp was for. Which will lead to driving around a small roundabout at high speeds again and again because the driver can't figure out what to do now. Which will lead to a very clear corkscrew of smoke rising up into the air. Which will lead to the the ambulance crew that's waiting to get their gear back laughing their asses off. Which will lead to you calling your parents to tell them the car caught on fire and you're now at the ER.

OK, so maybe the last paragraph won't happen to you. But take it from me, that's not a fun thing to be a passenger for...
williaty is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-09-2007, 12:47 PM   #129
MasterKwan
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 98961
Join Date: Oct 2005
Chapter/Region: MAIC
Location: NOVA
Vehicle:
2003 WRX
Black

Default

Which is another arguement for just looping the factory coolant line.
MasterKwan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-09-2007, 01:14 PM   #130
ride5000
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 32792
Join Date: Feb 2003
Chapter/Region: NESIC
Location: lincoln, ri
Vehicle:
2003 GGA MBP
12.9 / 105+

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by williaty View Post
If you put just a vacuum cap over the end of the tube on the block like most people use to seal tube the TB coolant passage after it's been disconnected, the first time you pressurize the coolant system, that little bugger is going into orbit. Which will lead to you spraying coolant all over the heated engine bay.

Which will lead to massive quantities of white smoke coming out of the grille, the hood shut lines, the vents, everywhere really. Which will lead to everyone in the car freaking out. Which will lead to the driver swerving across 5 lanes of rush hour traffic to catch the first exit. Which will lead to shooting off the exit ramp into the entry to an ER cause that's what the ramp was for. Which will lead to driving around a small roundabout at high speeds again and again because the driver can't figure out what to do now. Which will lead to a very clear corkscrew of smoke rising up into the air. Which will lead to the the ambulance crew that's waiting to get their gear back laughing their asses off. Which will lead to you calling your parents to tell them the car caught on fire and you're now at the ER.

OK, so maybe the last paragraph won't happen to you. But take it from me, that's not a fun thing to be a passenger for...
no, you're right.

when someone said the phrase "plug a line," i made the foolish assumption that they didn't do it like a complete and utter jackass.

while we're at it, i think we should also warn people not to use hair scrunchies in place of hose clamps either, for when they "loop a line." i wouldn't want folks to get the false impression that looping is inherently less prone to popping than plugging is.

we should also point out that you have to do everything else (ie, removing the tmic, removing the tb inlet coupler hose, disconnecting the bov, and then putting it all back together again) properly to avoid things that won't be fun for passengers.

oh yeah, and you have to be able to drive too.

ride5000 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-09-2007, 02:42 PM   #131
williaty
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 71092
Join Date: Sep 2004
Chapter/Region: MWSOC
Location: Licking County, Ohio
Vehicle:
2005 2.5RS Wagon
Regal Blue Pearl

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by ride5000 View Post
no, you're right.

when someone said the phrase "plug a line," i made the foolish assumption that they didn't do it like a complete and utter jackass.
Unfortunately, that isn't a safe assumption on NASBISCO. You get a lot of people reading this stuff who haven't worked on cars (or anything, really) much before. Thats complicated by the fact that either in this thread, or another one on this topic, the use of vacuum caps to plug the now-empty line in the TB is mentioned several times. It's not a long leap for someone who doesn't know any better to connect plugging the coolant line on the TB with a vacuum cap to plugging the line in and out of the block with a cap. After all, it's the same system, right? And someone said the vacuum caps were a good idea...

You're right though, one would hope that someone would be smart enough to do it correctly and use a plug that would hold 15psi or so (safety margin). I just don't have that much faith in humanity.
williaty is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-09-2007, 04:03 PM   #132
ride5000
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 32792
Join Date: Feb 2003
Chapter/Region: NESIC
Location: lincoln, ri
Vehicle:
2003 GGA MBP
12.9 / 105+

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by williaty View Post
Unfortunately, that isn't a safe assumption on NASBISCO.
thanks for setting me straight, but frankly i don't give two craps about the idiots who use VACUUM caps on PRESSURE sources.
ride5000 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-09-2007, 04:18 PM   #133
rkramer
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 118209
Join Date: Jun 2006
Chapter/Region: MWSOC
Location: North Dakota
Vehicle:
2015 WRX Limitec

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by ride5000 View Post
we should also point out that you have to do everything else (ie, removing the tmic, removing the tb inlet coupler hose, disconnecting the bov, and then putting it all back together again) properly to avoid things that won't be fun for passengers.
You can actually do it without removing ANYTHING. I did it on my 02, just need a pair of long needle nose pliers and a hemostat to grab the hose.
rkramer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-09-2007, 04:43 PM   #134
plode
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 116910
Join Date: Jun 2006
Default

is there any need to bleed the cooling system of air after doing this?
plode is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-09-2007, 05:23 PM   #135
williaty
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 71092
Join Date: Sep 2004
Chapter/Region: MWSOC
Location: Licking County, Ohio
Vehicle:
2005 2.5RS Wagon
Regal Blue Pearl

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by devb16a2vtec View Post
is there any need to bleed the cooling system of air after doing this?
No, if you're the least bit careful, there's going to be about 3 drops of coolant spilled. If you know you screwed up bigtime and let a massive quantity out (I have NO idea how you'd do that), then you ought to top it off and burp it.
williaty is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-09-2007, 05:48 PM   #136
plode
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 116910
Join Date: Jun 2006
Default

thanks, Im going to get the coupler and do this tomorrow.
plode is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-10-2007, 02:25 PM   #137
vogun16
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 93206
Join Date: Aug 2005
Chapter/Region: NESIC
Location: somerville, MA
Vehicle:
02 WRX....
JDM V7/8/9 RA-R Rotated

Default

hey guys, i dont know if im an idiot or not but i did this mod about a year ago and right after the idle went nuts and i got a cel for iacv safe mode. what did i do wrong?
vogun16 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-10-2007, 03:16 PM   #138
ride5000
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 32792
Join Date: Feb 2003
Chapter/Region: NESIC
Location: lincoln, ri
Vehicle:
2003 GGA MBP
12.9 / 105+

Default

from the sounds of it, you messed up your iacv...
ride5000 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-10-2007, 03:37 PM   #139
vogun16
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 93206
Join Date: Aug 2005
Chapter/Region: NESIC
Location: somerville, MA
Vehicle:
02 WRX....
JDM V7/8/9 RA-R Rotated

Default

well i reconnected the hoses and it returned to normal.....
vogun16 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-11-2007, 12:32 PM   #140
NSandman95
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 116533
Join Date: Jun 2006
Chapter/Region: MAIC
Location: Hampton Roads Virginia
Vehicle:
2002 WRX
Silver

Default

I have done the coolant bypass mod, and I also have phenolic spacers. Now I am seeing a temp differential of about 20 degrees F from the left hand side to the right hand side of the intake manifold(using IR temp gun). Where is the coolant resovoir relocation FAQ ??? What is causing the large temperature differential? I find it hard to believe the turbo/uppipe is heating the manifold on the Righthand side that much. I think the next logical step in cooling the intake would be getting that hot arse resovoir far away as possible.

Who has done the coolant resorvoir relocation? IS there a thread for it? Perhaps a set of spacers and longer bolts (between resorvoir and manifold) would be enough to minimize the heat transfer.
NSandman95 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-14-2007, 09:22 PM   #141
E_Jay_Twenty
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 124875
Join Date: Sep 2006
Chapter/Region: Tri-State
Location: The Sticks
Vehicle:
2002 WRX-MBP
1992 240sx coupe sr20

Default

Now I've allways thought that the hot coolant running through the throttle body was a stupid idea... And clearly it is. Now how about this, you run an 12.01 at the track every time, and you just cant break that 12. Maybe run COLD WATER through the throttle body? Make a aluminum box and put ice water in it when you get to the track. Wire up some sort of small pump to circulate the cold water from the box, into the throttle body? Just curious why noones ever mentioned it or thought about it. Shotty copyright
E_Jay_Twenty is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-15-2007, 01:22 PM   #142
Kurokaze
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 73080
Join Date: Oct 2004
Chapter/Region: South East
Location: Tallahassee, FL
Vehicle:
2005 Impreza WRX STi
Obsidian Black Pearl

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by NSandman95 View Post
I have done the coolant bypass mod, and I also have phenolic spacers. Now I am seeing a temp differential of about 20 degrees F from the left hand side to the right hand side of the intake manifold(using IR temp gun). Where is the coolant resovoir relocation FAQ ??? What is causing the large temperature differential? I find it hard to believe the turbo/uppipe is heating the manifold on the Righthand side that much. I think the next logical step in cooling the intake would be getting that hot arse resovoir far away as possible.

Who has done the coolant resorvoir relocation? IS there a thread for it? Perhaps a set of spacers and longer bolts (between resorvoir and manifold) would be enough to minimize the heat transfer.
Can anybody confirm this temperature difference? Would this cause undue wear/fatigue in the throttle body or turbulence within?
Kurokaze is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-15-2007, 02:01 PM   #143
paintbing
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 59388
Join Date: Apr 2004
Chapter/Region: RMIC
Location: Utah --> Monterey, CA
Vehicle:
2003 WRX - Hybrid
I do my own stunts

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by E_Jay_Twenty View Post
Now I've allways thought that the hot coolant running through the throttle body was a stupid idea... And clearly it is. Now how about this, you run an 12.01 at the track every time, and you just cant break that 12. Maybe run COLD WATER through the throttle body? Make a aluminum box and put ice water in it when you get to the track. Wire up some sort of small pump to circulate the cold water from the box, into the throttle body? Just curious why noones ever mentioned it or thought about it. Shotty copyright
Actually, I can see that you didn't even remotely read this thread. Your idea was already talked about and dismissed. Check back a few pages and you'll find it.
paintbing is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-15-2007, 03:14 PM   #144
Broxma
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 158006
Join Date: Aug 2007
Chapter/Region: TXIC
Location: San Antonio
Vehicle:
2003 WRX IdleWagon
1992 GVR4 379/1000

Default

I've been watching this post and am somewhat surprised at the length it has achieved at this point.

I did this to my throttle body when I replaced my turbo inlet pipe the other day. It would appear to me that even the greenest of mechanics would be able to understand the coolant flow and how to bypass the throttle body without any problem. You don't need any new parts. No plugs, no couplers, nothing. One of the two coolant lines is long enough to reach and span the hard pipe coolant ports. I even cut some of the line off cause it was too long. There are more clamps there than you need since you only need 2 and the factory setup uses four. I'm didn't figure there would really be this much to talk about, and now I'm just adding to the problem.

Addressing the question of does it do anything? Who knows. But the DSM community has been doing this same mod since the early 90's for all the same reasons.

Will this ever end is the question.

/Brox
Broxma is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-15-2007, 10:39 PM   #145
scaB
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 160669
Join Date: Oct 2007
Chapter/Region: TXIC
Location: Texas
Vehicle:
02 Hoopty WRX
Silver

Default

scoobymods.com
scaB is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-15-2007, 11:10 PM   #146
prometheum
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 92003
Join Date: Jul 2005
Chapter/Region: SCIC
Location: Tatooine
Vehicle:
04 bicycle!

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by E_Jay_Twenty View Post
Now I've allways thought that the hot coolant running through the throttle body was a stupid idea... And clearly it is. Now how about this, you run an 12.01 at the track every time, and you just cant break that 12. Maybe run COLD WATER through the throttle body? Make a aluminum box and put ice water in it when you get to the track. Wire up some sort of small pump to circulate the cold water from the box, into the throttle body? Just curious why noones ever mentioned it or thought about it. Shotty copyright
because the .0000000000001 hp you would net from that would be offset by the 5 extra pounds of useless crap you just put in your car
prometheum is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-16-2007, 06:37 AM   #147
ride5000
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 32792
Join Date: Feb 2003
Chapter/Region: NESIC
Location: lincoln, ri
Vehicle:
2003 GGA MBP
12.9 / 105+

Default

the problem with cooling via the tb comes down to temp differentials.

consider the case of ice water. that's a 32*f minimum. if ambient temps are around 70, we can expect the average output of the ic to be somewhere around 85 or so. 85 - 32 = 53*f difference

consider the case of coolant. according to my datalogs, average coolant temp with an oem t-stat is around 185*f. 185 - 85 = 100*f difference.

so even if you could keep that ice bath going it would still be half as effective at lowering charge temps as the coolant is at raising them.

jm2c
ken
ride5000 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-16-2007, 10:35 AM   #148
wrxwhite
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 28632
Join Date: Nov 2002
Chapter/Region: Tri-State
Location: North Wales Pa
Vehicle:
2011 Legacy 3.6R
Dark grey metallic

Default

Ok, on the question of plugs (yeh, I know), there appears to be a factory
plug/cap on a line that is near the left tumble generator postion sensor. What is this used for?
wrxwhite is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-03-2007, 02:08 AM   #149
simprezl25
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 71647
Join Date: Oct 2004
Chapter/Region: MAIC
Location: Maryland
Vehicle:
2002 Bug iD

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by firebox40dash5 View Post
Unfortunately, without phenolic spacers, your aluminum intake manifold is also connected to your aluminum heads, which are hot as hell. Obviously, doing both is preferred, but removing the coolant lines is a whole lot easier to do.
i just did this mod today at 10:30 pm that how easy it is but yeh i plan on getting the grimmspeed phenolic 8mm spacers for the intake manifold.

wonder if both will make a difference.
simprezl25 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-03-2007, 10:36 AM   #150
bushflyr
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 89628
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Hawaii, Oahu
Vehicle:
'02 Wagon VF39'd
& Quick Racked

Default

FWIW, the shorter line actually fit much better for this mod on my '02. Taking off both clamps and rotating the line makes it fit just like factory.
bushflyr is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Throttle body coolant bypass problem? SubasaurusWrex Factory 2.0L Turbo Powertrain (EJ Series Factory 2.0L Turbo) 4 04-27-2006 02:05 PM
Throttle body coolant bypass = blocking flow instead of rerouting? athakur999 General Community 7 04-13-2006 08:33 PM
Throttle body coolant path. Aus_RS Normally Aspirated with bolt-on Forced Induction Powertrain 3 04-26-2004 11:55 PM
Turbo Q: Can you use the Throttle Body coolant lines for the Turbo? Kostamojen Normally Aspirated with bolt-on Forced Induction Powertrain 35 02-22-2004 09:14 PM
Throttle Body coolant line mod WRX Joe Factory 2.0L Turbo Powertrain (EJ Series Factory 2.0L Turbo) 41 07-14-2002 11:55 AM

All times are GMT -4. The time now is 11:30 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Powered by Searchlight © 2024 Axivo Inc.
Copyright ©1999 - 2019, North American Subaru Impreza Owners Club, Inc.

As an Amazon Associate I earn from qualifying purchases.

When you click on links to various merchants on this site and make a purchase, this can result in this site earning a commission
Affiliate programs and affiliations include, but are not limited to, the eBay Partner Network.