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Old 11-20-2013, 01:25 PM   #526
manitou
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Originally Posted by Leafy View Post
I like the IWG for the simplicity. Its normally easier to deal with the slightly longer turbine than have to cram and ewg line either back behind the driver with its own muffler (required in a whole bunch of racing series) or integrate it back into the down pipe. And then you have to worry about the damn egw tube cracking. I do wish that BW would release the damn 0.64A/R vband housing for the 58mm turbine that they already make, because indycar uses it.

Chris seems pretty dead set on using garrets, which is fine. But now we know that a low mount setup fits and vaguely what it looks like, I'm sure other people will come out with different flavors.
They won't be Killer B products though and most likley will not be made of 321 SS. This low mount design already incorporates the EWG. You'll always make less with an IWG given the same size main exhaust and there is nothing wrong with using a muffler on the dump. I have a SuperTrapp in use on my car and wouldn't do it any other way. I wouldn't route it back into the main exhaust because you might as well use a IWG as long as it works well.

The .64AR is going to limit your top end along with your heads and possibly your cams. The turbine wheels of the EFR's are unique but the rest of the components of them are not that special.

I think I would try to fit a PTE turbo on one of Chris's low mounts if they can be made to fit.
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Old 11-20-2013, 02:39 PM   #527
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Originally Posted by manitou View Post
They won't be Killer B products though and most likley will not be made of 321 SS. This low mount design already incorporates the EWG. You'll always make less with an IWG given the same size main exhaust and there is nothing wrong with using a muffler on the dump. I have a SuperTrapp in use on my car and wouldn't do it any other way. I wouldn't route it back into the main exhaust because you might as well use a IWG as long as it works well.

The .64AR is going to limit your top end along with your heads and possibly your cams. The turbine wheels of the EFR's are unique but the rest of the components of them are not that special.

I think I would try to fit a PTE turbo on one of Chris's low mounts if they can be made to fit.
Off topic, but I just wanted to take the opportunity to ask if using the supertrapp muffler do you leave the discs off? And does it sound nice or does it have the woooshing sound
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Old 11-20-2013, 05:01 PM   #528
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Off topic, but I just wanted to take the opportunity to ask if using the supertrapp muffler do you leave the discs off? And does it sound nice or does it have the woooshing sound
No I added 6 discs to it, 18 discs to open it up, less back pressure. It works perfectly, my boost holds dead flat on e85 at. 28-29psi from 4k to redline at 8k! If you know what sound to look for you can hear a subtle woosh from in the cabin but it sounds good! Ask Layvon he's been in it as has Junior. On the outside it's a frickin megaphone with the KBHH , custom Cobb exhaust and the EWG ST!
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Old 12-06-2013, 01:16 PM   #529
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Does it have to be for subarus? I think with your header we can actually look at data from other engines as meaningful.
It's not quite so simple. The engine would need to be the same size (bore/stroke) with extremely similar valve size and cam profiles, funny exhaust ports, etc.. Essentially a Subaru

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Originally Posted by manitou View Post
Why IWG? It adds length to the housing that makes it hard to fit and I'd rather have a separate dump for the waste gate any way. You'll make more torque and power sooner with the EWG and it might even fit this low mount kit!

I doubt though that Chris will make accommodations for the EFR's but if you did the EWG housings would be the way to go!
I'm on board with the EWG and it can definitely be muffled, or as I've found, piping it out the side reduced sound drastically! For those in the cabin anyway

No accommodations for EFRs. At least not from us anytime soon. We choosing a turbo we looked at many things. Because of the location, size is a very important and restricting factor. Especially when I'm trying to keep it as bolt-on, no fabrication friendly, as possible. If you're game for cutting stuff a lot of other options open up. Take a peek at Crystal_Imprezav's setup and you'll see home much more space you get when you remove the lower sub-frame support and cut stuff. The other consideration was long term historical data. Due to the EFR's being in their infancy there is next to no data for Subarus and even less regarding long term reliability.

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Originally Posted by Leafy View Post
Chris seems pretty dead set on using garrets, which is fine.
So far true.
Quote:
Originally Posted by manitou View Post
They won't be Killer B products though and most likley will not be made of 321 SS.

I think I would try to fit a PTE turbo on one of Chris's low mounts if they can be made to fit.
That's true, and I'm working one something else that will improve the manifold's performance further (and for the holy-header too). Stay tuned

I'd look at Precision Turbos, if anyone can get me prints or better yet some decent CAD models. I've tried on a couple occasions to get information from them and my requests go unanswered.
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Old 12-06-2013, 01:25 PM   #530
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In the mean time we're putting our ducks in a row for a small beta batch. This just takes time.

Parts are rolling in for the engine and I've decided to get some mild cams and maybe even an auxiliary fuel cell for the truck to run race fuel, maybe. Working on a new turbo drain sump as well.

Still on the fence with TS vs SS. If I can swing it with Jr we'll test the car with both setups, which will make for a long day. We'll see.
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Old 12-06-2013, 01:47 PM   #531
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Originally Posted by KillerBMotorsport View Post
It's not quite so simple. The engine would need to be the same size (bore/stroke) with extremely similar valve size and cam profiles, funny exhaust ports, etc.. Essentially a Subaru



I'm on board with the EWG and it can definitely be muffled, or as I've found, piping it out the side reduced sound drastically! For those in the cabin anyway

No accommodations for EFRs. At least not from us anytime soon. We choosing a turbo we looked at many things. Because of the location, size is a very important and restricting factor. Especially when I'm trying to keep it as bolt-on, no fabrication friendly, as possible. If you're game for cutting stuff a lot of other options open up. Take a peek at Crystal_Imprezav's setup and you'll see home much more space you get when you remove the lower sub-frame support and cut stuff. The other consideration was long term historical data. Due to the EFR's being in their infancy there is next to no data for Subarus and even less regarding long term reliability.



So far true.


That's true, and I'm working one something else that will improve the manifold's performance further (and for the holy-header too). Stay tuned

I'd look at Precision Turbos, if anyone can get me prints or better yet some decent CAD models. I've tried on a couple occasions to get information from them and my requests go unanswered.
I'm quite familiar with the FF CD build that Crystal has done!

Chris, Here's a link to the PTE catalog with Comp housing drawings on my dropbox and a link to the 2 tech pages on their site that have all the tech drawings of the turbine housings. I also have a guy inside that I've been working with so I'll send you and email and copy him on it to connect you two.

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/...%20Catalog.pdf
http://www.precisionturbo.net/tech/t...bochargers/3-4

Quote:
Originally Posted by KillerBMotorsport View Post
In the mean time we're putting our ducks in a row for a small beta batch. This just takes time.

Parts are rolling in for the engine and I've decided to get some mild cams and maybe even an auxiliary fuel cell for the truck to run race fuel, maybe. Working on a new turbo drain sump as well.

Still on the fence with TS vs SS. If I can swing it with Jr we'll test the car with both setups, which will make for a long day. We'll see.
Please do consider me as a beta tester on this. I vote for a single scroll version or if you do a twin scroll you'd use your EWG TS merge adapter correct?

I'm sending you an email today about my winter project but if you consider me for a beta version then I would hold off on these plans that I have.
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Old 12-09-2013, 09:13 AM   #532
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Thanks for the links. I need more detailed information though. There are no external dimensions on the volutes on those prints. Thanks for the PTE contact, we'll see if I get any reply.

I will be replying to your e-mail soon too
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Old 12-09-2013, 12:16 PM   #533
manitou
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Originally Posted by KillerBMotorsport View Post
Thanks for the links. I need more detailed information though. There are no external dimensions on the volutes on those prints. Thanks for the PTE contact, we'll see if I get any reply.

I will be replying to your e-mail soon too
We just got an email reply from Justin and Grant at PTE regarding this and Grant sent engineering drawings of their new SS v-band housing, CHRA and compressor housings. It looks like the new SS v-band housings will be made for their 5558 through 6766.

I'll look for your reply!

Last edited by manitou; 12-09-2013 at 12:28 PM.
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Old 12-09-2013, 03:32 PM   #534
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The BB PTE turbos are slightly longer than Garrett turbos.

BTW I didn't have to cut anything on my kit nor remove the sub-brace. I've had that stuff off the car for weight savings.
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Old 12-09-2013, 09:36 PM   #535
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Originally Posted by Crystal_Imprezav View Post
BTW I didn't have to cut anything on my kit nor remove the sub-brace. I've had that stuff off the car for weight savings.
With your routing I don't see how you could put that subframe support back on there At the least the fender liner was cut-up. Regardless, you're right. For your application it doesn't warrant having those intact.
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Old 12-10-2013, 11:36 AM   #536
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Here is the same kit with everything intact.


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Old 12-10-2013, 12:54 PM   #537
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Tough to see in the pic (and I even tried to brighten it), but I don't know if it counts if the exhaust tubing is ON the sub-frame support

Neither has, or could have, intact fender liners or a real world air cleaner. For your application (track drag, nice weather, etc.) I'm sure it's just fine.

BTW, that black car looks like it has center section cooties
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Old 12-10-2013, 01:18 PM   #538
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the first pic has fender liners...no?
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Old 12-10-2013, 01:28 PM   #539
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Here is the same kit with everything intact.


Did you cut the frame out for that downpipe? There is usually a big piece of frame there...
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Old 12-10-2013, 01:41 PM   #540
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Not sure, not my setup. Fobia would be the man to ask.

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Old 12-10-2013, 01:51 PM   #541
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I tried to install one of these kits that was built on an 04 into an 06 and there were a lot of issues with the pipes hitting the actual frame of the car. I haven't compared the frame between the 04-05 and 06-07, but I'm guessing there is a difference as his kit did fit fur ****.
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Old 12-10-2013, 05:15 PM   #542
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Chris, Were you able to look over the drawings that Grant sent us? I've got some up pipe ideas for your headers and couple of these turbos.
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Old 12-10-2013, 06:27 PM   #543
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The prints were not detailed enough, they just provide basic info (flanges, CL distance, etc.). I'm going back and forth with the DoE right now, so I should be getting my hands on some models soon Thanks again for the contact!
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Old 12-10-2013, 06:54 PM   #544
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No worries! From what I know and can see the PTE turbos and v-band housings should be able to fit in the space with your low mount kit. I have a few questions for you on the LM.

Keep me posted on the developments with PTE. I'll send you more info on my plans when I can take a few more measurements.
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Old 12-10-2013, 08:20 PM   #545
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if you run a dump you don't need to cut anything that's smaller then a 42r. if you use a large frame turbo like a 42r ( a different header length )then you need to notch the frame for the compressor cover like in the first pic (look close). in the second pic it shows a full exhaust set up. to run that you need to cut off the sub frame mount that's on the frame. i usually don't build them for people unless i have the car to fit it on but jeff said he can have it adjusted if its off slightly. fitment on a normal dump setup should be straight forward and clear every thing except for clearing out your bumper in that corner. i have yet to have anyone with a foglight setup that i built have fitment problem and let me know about them. if i did i would fix them free of charge.
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Old 12-10-2013, 08:43 PM   #546
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Truth to that, I really thought it was going to be 10x harder to install the kit but with the flexes in there it really made install a breeze. Fobs the man being able to do all that on a jig, eyeball clearances for a pan he didn't have, and get fitment spot on. The kit also lets you get creative with exhaust and IC options. Only small downside I can think of is rain and figuring our a clean filter look, but because racecar those are not worries for me.

I like Chris' setup too mostly because of the custom awesome fmic and radiator that come with it. Once I figure out how to use my damn Tig welder, I am going to try and do a similar kit to play around with.

One last suggestion for Chris is to think about a scavenge tank especially with the PTE turbos. They are very finiky with oil pressure and return...
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Old 12-10-2013, 08:49 PM   #547
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Originally Posted by Crystal_Imprezav View Post
Truth to that, I really though it was going to be 10x harder to install the kit but with the flexes in there it really made install a breeze.

I like Chris' setup too mostly because of the custom awesome fmic and radiator that come with it. Once I figure out how to use my damn Tig welder, I am going to try and do a similar kit to play around with.

One last suggestion for Chris is to think about a scavenge tank especially with the PTE turbos. They are very finiky with oil pressure and return...
I was going to comment on your oil drain tank for this low FF set-up. That's a nicely done detail! I think with designs like Chris's and this with short direct primaries and we won't give up **** to EVO's!.....other than the block strength and head studs!
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Old 12-10-2013, 09:04 PM   #548
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I saw the tank and liked it to. Is that so that the scavenge pump doesn't cause cavitation?
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Old 12-11-2013, 08:33 AM   #549
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Originally Posted by Crystal_Imprezav View Post
One last suggestion for Chris is to think about a scavenge tank especially with the PTE turbos. They are very finiky with oil pressure and return...
I've got a (mini) sump on there. It works really well actually. I've got a couple options in the works for it as well, that are neat-o
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Old 12-11-2013, 12:09 PM   #550
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You would think it would spool up faster being directly on the manifold , not a good choice for a turbo hotside lol . What size is the hotside? All that work for the same outcome of any other fmic with a built motor , lol
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