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09-15-2011, 08:22 AM | #1 |
Scooby Guru
Member#: 767
Join Date: Jan 2000
Chapter/Region:
Tri-State
Location: N.J.
Vehicle:04 FXT 20 OB Onyx XT |
UOA by Oil Analyzers Inc.
Driving conditions: Oil in use since March 2011; 7 mile daily commute each way; spirited driving with a few redlines here and there on days where I have a 30 minute drive. A trip to SC during June. Most of my consumption is usually on trips if I’m driving on the interstate at steady highway speeds (3500 rpm's at 80 mph). I went AP Stage I OTS 700 miles ago. Probably not done early enough to affect this OCI though. Comments: Lubricant and filter change is suggested if not done at sampling time; Infared results indicate OXIDATION is SEVERELY HIGH. Infared results indicate that NITRATION is at a SIGNIFICANT LEVEL; FLAGGED ADDITIVE levels indicate slight LUBE MIXING Equipment make: Subaru Equipment model: 2.5L Turbo Oil use interval: 6022 miles Oil type & Grade: Motul X-Lite 0W-30 Make-up oil added: 1.5 Liters Miles on unit: 112,407 Air filter: Amsoil Ea panel filter Oil filter: OEM Honeywell Overall severity of report = 4 abnormal Code:
(newest to oldest, left to right) X-lite; PU 5W40; M1 0W40; Amsoil SSO; Amsoil SSO Iron 4 8 7 11 11 Chromium 0 0 0 0 0 Nickel 0 0 0 0 0 Aluminum 0 2 0 3 3 Copper 8 8 15 5 6 Lead 1 1 0 10 4 Tin 0 0 0 1 0 Cadmium 0 0 0 1 0 Silver 0 0 0 0 0 Silicon 7 7 8 10 11 Sodium 2 10 22 28 90 Potassium 0 0 3 2 2 Titanium 0 0 0 0 0 Molybdenum 4 24 123 2 1 Antimony 0 1 2 0 0 Manganese 0 0 0 4 0 Lithium 0 0 0 3 0 Boron 6 117 112 7 7 Magnesium 13 19 30 17 17 Calcium 3323 2347 2805 3497 3423 Barium 0 0 0 0 0 Phosphorus 984 824 880 654 677 Zinc 1145 1050 1061 717 755 Lube chg No Filter chg No Fuel % <1 <1 <1 <1 <.5 Soot <.1% <.1% <.1% .1% <.1% Water <.1% <.1% <.1% <.1% <.1% Vis @ 100C: 11.3 12.1 13.2 10.1 9.6 TBN 4.93 3.78 1.99 4.35 4.01 Oxidation 47 (4 critical) 15 37 43 38 Nitration 26 (3 abnormal) 27 27 32 27 Haven't changed the oil yet. Comments, flames, or questions? /Uncle Scotty voice dOOOOOOOd. Stop using that expensive crap and head to Wal-Mart for Rotella! /Uncle Scotty voice -Dennis
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Last edited by bluesubie; 09-15-2011 at 08:29 AM. |
09-15-2011, 11:07 AM | #2 |
Scooby Specialist
Member#: 12344
Join Date: Nov 2001
Chapter/Region:
MAIC
Location: Mountains of Maryland
Vehicle:2002 2JC blue |
For your particular car and type of use, perhaps you need to at least do the next run with Rotella T6.
I hate to think it has anything to do with the engine itself. So the T6 oil check seems to be the next thing in the logic flow. |
09-15-2011, 12:25 PM | #3 |
Scooby Guru
Member#: 767
Join Date: Jan 2000
Chapter/Region:
Tri-State
Location: N.J.
Vehicle:04 FXT 20 OB Onyx XT |
I should probably pull another sample and send to Blackstone as it would probably be considered a very good report. That's the problem sometimes with having too much information with OAI. They do acknowledge that my numbers may be from lube mixing, but esters are known to show bonky oxidation numbers with this type of uoa. Not that there is actually much oxidation going on. Terry Dyson used to talk about this when he posted free advice at BITOG.
I'm hesitant on running 5W-40 in the winter with my weak OEM battery. Starts took a little longer than I liked running PU last winter. Although uoa didn't show any additional wear. My wife's car starts very easily with 5W-40. Heck, I ran 10W-40 conventional one winter in her Outback and never had problems (Interstate battery). My battery is only 2 years old and I hate to waste it. -Dennis |
09-15-2011, 02:19 PM | #4 |
Scooby Specialist
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Join Date: Nov 2001
Chapter/Region:
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Location: Mountains of Maryland
Vehicle:2002 2JC blue |
I put a pc680 dry cell and a handmade soldered welding lug multipoint grounding harness on my wrx in 2002. I replaced the first pc680 a couple of years ago and used the original for a 100 watt halogen searchlite I adapted to it. Talk about lighting up the forest!
Theory says I shouldn't use a dry cell like that in the area I live. I was able to start at -6F, but a thin 5w-30 oil was in the car. I had no trouble with T6 last year, but I usually thin it a bit with a different oil. Usually Ultra or Platinum 5w-30. Purists would never mix oils fearing that a runaway explosive event could occur. he original engine and turbo, with 22 psi utec tune 97 octane txs stg 3 utec. Mostly twisty hill driving with much quick merging plus quick hill climbs near Camp David and high rock. |
09-15-2011, 02:58 PM | #5 |
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Location: Arizona Bay
Vehicle:2000 Miata LS Evo Orange Mica (1/644) |
With 112,xxx miles and that consumption, I'd just ditch the PCV and get an AOS in there.
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09-15-2011, 06:10 PM | #6 | |
Scooby Guru
Member#: 767
Join Date: Jan 2000
Chapter/Region:
Tri-State
Location: N.J.
Vehicle:04 FXT 20 OB Onyx XT |
And I guess the only thing that RT6 would offer is thicker viscosity which might help consumption. The X-lite may have better cleaning ability from 3x the calcium and ester base stocks.
Oh, and speaking of PCV, and don't even remember when it was past changed so I'll have to check. Love those roads in Central (?) MD. I have an Uncle just off 340 in Knoxville and was just there a few weeks ago. Good post from SubLGT at BITOG: Quote:
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09-16-2011, 09:35 AM | #7 |
Scooby Specialist
Member#: 12344
Join Date: Nov 2001
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MAIC
Location: Mountains of Maryland
Vehicle:2002 2JC blue |
Just for fun, in case anyone wants to check the temperature effect on viscosity changes of various oils, you can buy a dip type paint viscometer for a few bucks. All you need then is a stopwatch.
Temperatures that you can expose the oil to are: freezer, refrigerator, ambient, and if you get curious, boiling water. You can then see Newtonian viscosity stuff without all the hype. You won't see Non-Newtonian pituitivity stuff easily this way. You could try the thumb and index finger snap apart test for that. The rate of elongation depends on your reflexes. Detonation prevention and the quality of the fuel I tweak seem to be more important, for the way I drive, than the oils I have used. I always warm the engine oil up before hitting boost, except for emergency situations. This is just a general thing I do, even a resonable temperatures, since the car is parked under a carport and not a heated garage. Summers can be be hot at mid-day so a 40 has worked well, thus the use of T6 in recent years. It has been T6 with enough other oil to get a complete fill. I have used that summer and winter, and never had to change that ratio. I fill the new filter, and then the use a 30 wt to get to the upper line on the dip stick. I don't lift the vehicle when draining and filling. It is very simple for me. I am a Physical Chemist, and according to my son in laws, still very physical. If I ran in Florida or the high desert I might do it differently. At China Lake, firing 50 cal incendiary ammo at jet fuel cans, the temps in the sun were about 130 F. These results were the beginning of the thinking about a diesel fuel additive, since combustion was more complete with the virtual elimination of black smoke. Too high a concentration and you started to get into too much shock viscosity increase and a kind of bullet proof effect which was only important as one method of pilot protection, but there are other ways to do which do not require high shear homogenizers to remove the effect. You really are in trouble with fuel that won't burn otherwise. I had a rental car there. Also jugs of water in the trunk, for me, not the car. I also tested 2 stroke motorcycle fuel which always requires lube content. with and without a few ppm of my diesel fuel additive. At home freezer temps it was stable from precipitation provided the concentration of additive was at the use recommendation of 10ppm. Too much and there was precipitation. You check the engine oil at ambient temperature, refrigerator temp, freezer temp, and optionally at the temperature of boiling water. The last is not necessary, and you sure don't want pour boiling on your self. As you all know a lot of oils are really thick at low temperatures. So the freezer test should hammer home the concept of very easy warm up of the engine before you take off like a bat out of hell. Also the oil temp lags a bit behind the oil temp. My wrx came with an oil temp gauge, so I have seen this behavior. |
09-16-2011, 04:48 PM | #8 |
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09-16-2011, 05:04 PM | #9 |
Scooby Guru
Member#: 767
Join Date: Jan 2000
Chapter/Region:
Tri-State
Location: N.J.
Vehicle:04 FXT 20 OB Onyx XT |
I think he just got carried away explaining how to play backyard chemist to experiment with cold oil flow. Oh, and at the end I think it should be the oil temp lags a bit behind the coolant temp. -Dennis |
09-17-2011, 05:57 PM | #10 |
Scooby Specialist
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Join Date: Nov 2001
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MAIC
Location: Mountains of Maryland
Vehicle:2002 2JC blue |
I got carried away describing a simple viscosity test for oil; as if anyone wanted to do that to see temperature effects on oils they use. However, I went too far and edited it.
I was surprised to see the unedited one get posted. I just let it ride since I have seen worse stuff on Nasioc. The carried away part stems from my background. says it pretty well. |
09-17-2011, 08:10 PM | #11 |
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our resident chemist and somewhat mad scientist z&cobb is likely the most learned contributor in these matters
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09-19-2011, 05:03 PM | #12 |
Scooby Specialist
Member#: 12344
Join Date: Nov 2001
Chapter/Region:
MAIC
Location: Mountains of Maryland
Vehicle:2002 2JC blue |
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09-19-2011, 05:47 PM | #13 |
Scooby Guru
Member#: 7164
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: Arizona Bay
Vehicle:2000 Miata LS Evo Orange Mica (1/644) |
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09-20-2011, 08:52 PM | #14 |
Scooby Specialist
Member#: 12344
Join Date: Nov 2001
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Location: Mountains of Maryland
Vehicle:2002 2JC blue |
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09-21-2011, 12:42 PM | #15 |
Scooby Newbie
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Vehicle:2011 WRX Ltd Hatch SWP |
Wow thanks Dennis for posting that. I am now considering Amsoil Signature Series 5W-30 for a future oil change. $10/qt direct from Amsoil but if it lasts 7500 mi it will be cheaper than Castrol Edge Syntec at $6/qt from Walmart at 3750 mi OCI.
And holy batman, that Motul goes for nearly $14/qt on Amazon! Last edited by furiouswrx; 09-21-2011 at 01:00 PM. |
09-21-2011, 02:41 PM | #16 |
Scooby Guru
Member#: 767
Join Date: Jan 2000
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Location: N.J.
Vehicle:04 FXT 20 OB Onyx XT |
Check my two oldest uoa's posted above. My lead jumped to 10 on the second run of SSO. Ever since the problem with oil line screen sludging in the 2.5's, Amsoil has not recommended intervals longer than 3,750 miles in ANY Subaru turbo and the same info is still there if you look up your car in the Amsoil application guide. The Signature Series also does not have API certification if that is a concern for you. Although, I believe Amsoil addresses this on their web site.
With your screen name you should run a more furious oil. HDD 5W-30 has more zinc and phosphorus than their DEO 5W-40 diesel oil. The Dominator race oil has even more than that (although the detergent levels are too low for extended use). -Dennis Last edited by bluesubie; 09-21-2011 at 03:22 PM. |
09-21-2011, 04:47 PM | #17 | |
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Quote:
Yea it might say furious but I baby my car. Remember I do 90% highway at 65-70 mph, no need for race or diesel oils...maybe. |
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09-21-2011, 08:06 PM | #18 |
Scooby Guru
Member#: 767
Join Date: Jan 2000
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Location: N.J.
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7,500 and 8k miles. My turbo blew 3k miles later although I'm not saying that the oil failed. It was a "lubrication related" failure.
2011 SUBARU IMPREZA 2.5L 4-cyl Engine Code EJ255 Turbo Lubricants & Fluids Engine Oil Grade 1......SMSUBARU TURBO SPECIAL MESSAGE: Subaru has published Service Bulletin # 02-103-07 that identifies a factory design related problem with premature clogging of the oil mesh screen located inside the oiling system that supplies the turbo charger on all model turbo charged cars. A clogged screen will result in oil starvation and turbo charger failure. Subaru has reduced their recommended oil drain interval in half, as a solution, from 7,500 miles to 3,750 miles (3-3/4 months) and requires the oil mesh screen to be inspected, and possibly serviced, at every oil change. With this Subaru factory related design issue, AMSOIL INC. therefore must recommend customers follow the new Subaru oil change interval of 3,750 miles or 3-3/4 months until Subaru resolves this issue. Amsoil says Signature Series 5W-30 is good for up to 15k miles in unmodified turbos. But they've got an "out" with the above statement even though it's outdated. JMO. -Dennis Last edited by bluesubie; 09-21-2011 at 08:13 PM. |
09-21-2011, 11:41 PM | #19 | |
Scooby Newbie
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Vehicle:2011 WRX Ltd Hatch SWP |
Quote:
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09-22-2011, 07:28 AM | #20 |
Scooby Guru
Member#: 767
Join Date: Jan 2000
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Location: N.J.
Vehicle:04 FXT 20 OB Onyx XT |
'04 - '07's.
-Dennis |
09-22-2011, 07:53 AM | #21 | |
Scooby Specialist
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Vehicle:2011 WRX Limited 5dr WR Blue Pearl |
Quote:
http://stis.subaru.com/index.html You don't have to subscribe to read the descriptions of the TSB's. Go to Online Reference -> Pick your year, car, engine type. Change Publication Type to Technical Service Bulletin It will list everything that applies to your vehicle. |
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09-22-2011, 10:51 AM | #22 | |
Scooby Newbie
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Join Date: May 2011
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Quote:
Thanks for the link, jon. I think I'm going to have my dealer fix my squeaking tonneau cover per TSB 12-126-11 at the next oil change. Right now I just shove folded up paper into the plastic/aluminum interface to muffle the squeaks and rattles. Doesn't look very nice and the paper keeps falling out... Last edited by furiouswrx; 09-22-2011 at 11:00 AM. |
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09-22-2011, 11:17 AM | #23 | |
Scooby Specialist
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Quote:
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09-22-2011, 03:49 PM | #24 | |
Scooby Newbie
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Join Date: May 2011
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Quote:
Thanks though for the TSB link - very helpful. |
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