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Old 06-10-2006, 05:10 PM   #1
meatball18
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Default max boost on stock internals

i did look up some research on this subject and all the threads i found were like two or three years old. and in those threads it said dont go over 15.5 psi but the cobb accessport stage one goes to 16 and stage two goes to 17psi. im really wanting to go to stage two when i get my accessport back. so is this safe for my car? how many of you guys are running accessports stage 1 or 2 and sre you guys having any problems? no problems? thanks for your responses
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Old 06-10-2006, 06:36 PM   #2
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no problem..stage 2
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Old 06-10-2006, 09:37 PM   #3
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Correct me if i'm wrong but I'm almost positive that boost stg2 is around 15.8 lbs +or-.5, Thats what my stg2 reads(15.4 lbs to be exact) and also states this in the map notes for stg2 93 on cobbs site
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Old 06-10-2006, 11:38 PM   #4
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From what I see the max you want your wrx to have with a controller is about 15.5 ..the accessport changes ur timing and mixture creating a more established blend. The PDX stage 2 mappings go to about 17psi-18psi if I believe, but because everything is leveled and evenly tuned you dont have problems. Yes you are pushing the turbo and decreasing its life but the accessport really gets you through and with a professional map it does wonders. Thats my .2 cents. I could be wrong but thats just my opinion
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Old 06-11-2006, 12:01 AM   #5
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Max boost and safe boost are two different animals. Which do you want?

San
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Old 06-11-2006, 12:05 AM   #6
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The off-the-shelf Cobb stage 2 map with the proper exhaust mods is considered pretty safe.

If you don't drive like an asshat all the time and stay on top of your mantinance, your car should be running strong for a long time.
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Old 06-11-2006, 12:06 AM   #7
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I have the prodrive stage 3 w/ borla header and mine pulls 18.5lbs solid through 4th and 5th... I still have the factory boost control.. and 16psi in 3rd
I dont spike boost like some folks
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Old 06-11-2006, 12:07 AM   #8
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My old stage 2 map got me 17.47 and it was tuned back a bit for a safety net.
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Old 06-11-2006, 12:33 AM   #9
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Gahhh this has been covered elsewhere, but I'll sum up what it basically says for you.

It's not about a max boost level for the stock internals, just think about what boost is. 14psi of boost on a TD04 flows a lot less than 14psi of boost on a 16G, which is less than 14psi of boost on a 20G, etc. The CFM that you are flowing is what makes the difference here. You can boost a TD04 at 22psi if you want/can, and it won't hurt the motor, just the turbo. You aren't flowing enough air to do any damage. However, if you could boost a GT35R to 22psi, you'd be saying PEACE OUT to your motor in a short while.

The problem lies with the power level. Pretty much when you get into the 320+ whp range on a stock EJ205 is when you start getting into possible reliability issues. Hope that helped you.

P.S. I hope you guys do/are going to start doing some more reading on this site. No one addressed this issue in what, 7 posts? I know there can be a lot of misinformation floating around on NASIOC but if you have common sense you can weed out the idiots. Plus you'll see retarded/asinine posts quoted often with reactions like "WTF bitch are you retarded" and . I've been constantly reading and doing my research on topics I find interesting since I joined this site 2 and a half years ago, and it's been to my benefit and the benefit of others. Alright, I guess I'm done complaining now.

Last edited by wrxfactor; 06-11-2006 at 12:38 AM.
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Old 06-11-2006, 02:39 AM   #10
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i run 21 psi daily on an 18g
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Old 06-11-2006, 04:38 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wrxfactor
It's not about a max boost level for the stock internals, just think about what boost is. 14psi of boost on a TD04 flows a lot less than 14psi of boost on a 16G, which is less than 14psi of boost on a 20G, etc. The CFM that you are flowing is what makes the difference here. You can boost a TD04 at 22psi if you want/can, and it won't hurt the motor, just the turbo. You aren't flowing enough air to do any damage. However, if you could boost a GT35R to 22psi, you'd be saying PEACE OUT to your motor in a short while.

Running high boost means you're more likely to get detonation. Detonation kills motors, not cfm.


Of course you will hit a wall eventually, but in the realm of this discussion it's a moot point.
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Old 06-11-2006, 10:49 AM   #12
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23psi boost w/alky on a VF-22 flowing approximately 500cfm or 37.25lbs of air/min into an EJ205 with stock internals. Been making great power for a while, although I now think I have a ringland failing on me. As pointed out, safe-boost versus max-boost are two different animals…
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Old 06-11-2006, 04:56 PM   #13
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ok how much for safe boost then?
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Old 06-11-2006, 06:20 PM   #14
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Are you asking just because or do you have a specific setup you're wondering will work?
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Old 06-11-2006, 07:50 PM   #15
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I have a turbo xs stage 4 and pretty much everything modded except for internals. I broke one of the tubes going to the turbo and I got it up to 27 psi with my vf39 turbo. It threw me in my f-ing seat, but I fixed it because I didn't want to f- up my engine. I run about 18 psi daily.
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Old 06-12-2006, 12:53 AM   #16
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Stock internals are capable of supporting 27 psi, but not when it is uncontrolled like what happened to you. If it's tuned for, fine. If not you get detonation which makes car go boom.
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Old 06-12-2006, 09:02 AM   #17
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Please keep in mind the concern here is “stock internals” not so much boost levels. Without quality, hardened, forged internal components the motor is more prone to damage and failure when aggressively pushed beyond the tolerances of the “stock internal” components. For example an aggressive tune which is significantly pushing ignition timing advance, can be just as damaging due to the severe pressures built during higher rpm, as detonation itself. Throw a larger flowing, high PSI turbo in the mix and you can actually damage your motor without ever seeing knock!

The point here is to identify aggressively pushing the 2.0l block with “stock internals” beyond the point of safe and reliable power. Whether it be via high boost, aggressive tuning, or a combination of both.

On the flip side, there are tons of users here with sub-300whp 2.0l setups who have reported great long-term results with dependable configurations. Perhaps you should be looking in that direction...
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Old 06-12-2006, 01:04 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xcntrk75
Please keep in mind the concern here is “stock internals” not so much boost levels. Without quality, hardened, forged internal components the motor is more prone to damage and failure when aggressively pushed beyond the tolerances of the “stock internal” components. For example an aggressive tune which is significantly pushing ignition timing advance, can be just as damaging due to the severe pressures built during higher rpm, as detonation itself. Throw a larger flowing, high PSI turbo in the mix and you can actually damage your motor without ever seeing knock!

The point here is to identify aggressively pushing the 2.0l block with “stock internals” beyond the point of safe and reliable power. Whether it be via high boost, aggressive tuning, or a combination of both.

On the flip side, there are tons of users here with sub-300whp 2.0l setups who have reported great long-term results with dependable configurations. Perhaps you should be looking in that direction...

I agree with you for the most part. However, the OP said "max boost on stock internals" and to be honest, you could boost 10psi max but have a bad tune and ruin the motor. So I really think the boost psi is pretty irrelevant for this argument. The motor can handle 22psi out of a TD04 just fine, but might see problems with a GT35R, even if the tune was safe. The problem here is the amount of air being flowed.
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Old 06-12-2006, 04:14 PM   #19
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quick side question: what is the optimal boost in psi for stock td04, and stock engine, if tuned correctly? i read everyone having 17-18psi but i read somewhere on here that 15psi is most efficient.

just trying to get something cleared up.
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Old 06-12-2006, 04:21 PM   #20
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i run 21 psi on a td06 20g daily, and 23 psi when i mix in enough race gas to get to about 98 octane. From everything i have heard/seen over the years from tuners/forums ect, 23 psi on the stock internals is the max you really want if reliability is a concern, which is the case for almost 100% of us. You can run more i believe, but at that point its a ticking time bomb....

anybody who has done more for a prolonged period of time, i'd love to be proved wrong......
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Old 06-12-2006, 04:43 PM   #21
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^^ are you sure about that? Every tuner I have spoken to around here (even one that used to put together Subaru's rally effort in Canada reommend no higher than 20psi).Prior to the EJ257 comming out, they ran higher on the rally cars, but then again, they replaced shortblocks like they are bic pens as well so....

How much whp does that 23psi of boost net you?

In my opinion however, the tune itself is what really matters, and not so much what exact boost number one is running. As long as the said turbo is efficient at that boost level, then gas, tune, and common sense dictate the rest
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Old 06-12-2006, 05:18 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 04blue-meanie
From everything i have heard/seen over the years from tuners/forums ect, 23 psi on the stock internals is the max you really want if reliability is a concern
Man some of you guys are just not getting the fact that max flow is not the same as max boost (psi, kg/cm, bar, whatever)… The amount of flow for the tiny TD04 is in no way equivalent to larger turbos, etc. For example a TD04 at 20psi is flowing only 30lbs of air/min whereas a 20G at 20psi is flowing 51lbs per/min. So max boost is completely irrelevant unless directly associated with a particular turbo.
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Old 06-12-2006, 06:10 PM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xcntrk75
Man some of you guys are just not getting the fact that max flow is not the same as max boost (psi, kg/cm, bar, whatever)… The amount of flow for the tiny TD04 is in no way equivalent to larger turbos, etc. For example a TD04 at 20psi is flowing only 30lbs of air/min whereas a 20G at 20psi is flowing 51lbs per/min. So max boost is completely irrelevant unless directly associated with a particular turbo.
this should sum it up all together..i agree 100%
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Old 06-12-2006, 06:57 PM   #24
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there is no definitive answer... no one can tell you XXpsi is going to make your block go boom. i was running 24+ psi on a TD06H/20G for close to a year, and now i'm retuning on my SZ55. right now, i'm running 20-21psi on pump, but i plan to run the boost up to 24-25psi when i tune for WI/AI.
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Old 06-12-2006, 08:46 PM   #25
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I ran 23psi, on an SR40 for a long time even in hot weather of florida. Everything has been great until recently my engine started making noise. I got a 2.5 short block to put in.
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