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Old 06-12-2006, 05:11 PM   #1
06rexwagon
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Question PDX maps or Street Tuner?

I'm trying to decide between getting PDXtunings map or buying the street tuner software. Now that the software is down to $195, it's only a little more than PDX's maps. My question is: how usable is the ST software for the average guy who knows enough about his car to get him into trouble? Can I expect to improve on my OTS cobb maps? I currently run catted Cobb TBE and stage 2 91 oct on my '06 wrx. Thanks!
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Old 06-12-2006, 10:09 PM   #2
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with the ST, i would also recommend a WBO2 & EGT guage.

the PDX Emaps should work well. i'd say get both, that way you have good map, and can make changes when needed
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Old 06-12-2006, 10:47 PM   #3
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Do the PDX maps come in ST format? I thought they only sold them in PT format. changing an ECU between ST and PT (normal AP maps) is a pain if you plan on doing it more than a couple times. It takes two flashes everytime you switch, one to revert to stock and the next to flash in the new base map. Of course, you also have to reprogram the AP inbetween the flashes. Personnally I would buy ST, but I am biased since I have it. I paid $400 for it almost a year ago now and it is worth every penny of the price, I would buy it again at $400. You do need at least a Wideband O2 ($200 for a LC-1) if you want to really get into tuning for fuel.
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Old 06-12-2006, 11:16 PM   #4
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=\ dude just be cheap and buy an openport 1.2 cord and use the free software to tune. Youll end up saving what 320$?
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Old 06-12-2006, 11:53 PM   #5
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i know that i was protuned & have a ST map
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Old 06-13-2006, 12:09 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jebjkey
Do the PDX maps come in ST format? I thought they only sold them in PT format. changing an ECU between ST and PT (normal AP maps) is a pain if you plan on doing it more than a couple times. It takes two flashes everytime you switch, one to revert to stock and the next to flash in the new base map. Of course, you also have to reprogram the AP inbetween the flashes. Personnally I would buy ST, but I am biased since I have it. I paid $400 for it almost a year ago now and it is worth every penny of the price, I would buy it again at $400. You do need at least a Wideband O2 ($200 for a LC-1) if you want to really get into tuning for fuel.

I would imagine PDX could simply save the map as a .stb if you asked them real nice
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Old 06-13-2006, 12:13 AM   #7
06rexwagon
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sypher
=\ dude just be cheap and buy an openport 1.2 cord and use the free software to tune. Youll end up saving what 320$?
It doesn't support the '06 yet because of the drive by wire.
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Old 06-13-2006, 01:15 AM   #8
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I have not heard of anyone with a PDX map in ST format. PDX can save their maps in ST format if they want, but I would say good luck on getting them to do that.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sypher
=\ dude just be cheap and buy an openport 1.2 cord and use the free software to tune. Youll end up saving what 320$?
Which software are you talking about that has the same capabilities as ST?
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Old 06-13-2006, 09:20 AM   #9
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EcuFlash is really good.
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Old 06-13-2006, 10:38 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jebjkey
I have not heard of anyone with a PDX map in ST format.
i do, now you've heard of someone with a PDX ST map
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Old 06-13-2006, 01:34 PM   #11
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The free stuff is still a step behind. No live tuning. Much like how ECUTEK is a step behind the cobb stuff right now.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Sypher
=\ dude just be cheap and buy an openport 1.2 cord and use the free software to tune. Youll end up saving what 320$?
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Old 06-13-2006, 01:35 PM   #12
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Oh crap! Same price?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Quack
i do, now you've heard of someone with a PDX ST map
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Old 06-13-2006, 01:49 PM   #13
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it was when TimB flew out for a dyno-tune.

we have about 5 other vehicles that were also PT'd and have the ST.

my cost was $300. $125/dyno, $175/hour of tuning.
i recieved 4 maps with 94oct & 100oct
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Old 06-13-2006, 06:53 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 06rexwagon
It doesn't support the '06 yet because of the drive by wire.
It is supported with 1.26+ of ECU Flash. XML Definitions are showing up daily. Openport 1.2 and 1.3m both read the DBW ecu's.
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Old 06-13-2006, 09:02 PM   #15
06rexwagon
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Quote:
Originally Posted by turboge
It is supported with 1.26+ of ECU Flash. XML Definitions are showing up daily. Openport 1.2 and 1.3m both read the DBW ecu's.
good to know. Last time I checked it wasn't working. I'll check it out!!.
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Old 06-14-2006, 11:18 AM   #16
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I was told by Tim they could not do the mail maps in ST format. So I decided to just stick with the ST do it myself and get a ProTune down the road when I have time.
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Old 06-14-2006, 12:34 PM   #17
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That doesn't count. =P I thought you got a 150 dollar remote tune map in ST format. Booo.. I would have paid 150 just to see how they tune.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Quack
it was when TimB flew out for a dyno-tune.

we have about 5 other vehicles that were also PT'd and have the ST.

my cost was $300. $125/dyno, $175/hour of tuning.
i recieved 4 maps with 94oct & 100oct
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Old 06-16-2006, 12:39 AM   #18
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PLEASE tell me more about openport!!!

ty
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Old 06-16-2006, 01:15 AM   #19
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um ECUedit has DBW support, and yes its still itleast a year behind ST but its also hundreds cheaper. Engenuity is prettier and simpler to use though and the maker of the program is currently working on DBW support. Once hes done it will be sweet for DBW subies. Real time support might take awhile though. Im not saying its easy to use the open ecu tools or for everyone, its just if you have an AP already you can pull your map with an openport cord and modify how you see fit with out buying street tuner (to point out the obvious). Like for example (dumb example but you get the point) say I have an OTS map and I buy a wideband and I notice its running rich, well I can download my map, use ECUedit to add more boost and mess with my ignition timing slightly then reflash. Do the speedy learning trick, and boom datalog using free datalogging software. If yah screwed up you can always revert back to your previous map. idk, this is what Im going to be doing.
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Old 06-16-2006, 01:18 AM   #20
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all i know is you payed $650 for your ap you should be able to modify the maps you bought with your own $ how you see fit. Thats just my opinion =\, theres a gray line with the whole pulling your AP map using openport though. Some people refuse to do this and rather make there own maps, which Im all for if Im VERY confident in my tuning abilities. but If I just wanna add some more boost with out buying a manual boost controller or getting pdx to make a map, I think pulling your map and modifying your ap map and not posting it online and using it privatly for YOUR car, is just fine.
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Old 06-16-2006, 01:24 AM   #21
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I like this because okay say you went and god a protune or that ECUtek crap (which Im completely against) and your cars running funky or its running too rich or too lean? What does Cobb or any other place suggest you do? Get a "protune" or get it retuned at your own expense in excess for $300. Or you can buy a wideband used for $150, open port for liek 70$ datalog yourself and pull your map yourself and figure out whats wrong. I just like knowing wtf someone did to MY car, yah know. I dont wanna take my car to someone who I just met, give them $400, have them fiddle with my 25 thousand dollar car, Smile and be on my merry freaking way. I refuse to be one of these guys whom "Man I just got a protune my car is faaaaaaaaaast now, but I have NO clue what they did, and I really have no idea wtf knock is and why theres black smoke coming out of my exhaust when im at 100% throttle" I wanna learn, and I wanna be able to do things like this on my own, I think we all want to or we wouldnt be in this forum. Reading is a beautiful thing.
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Old 06-16-2006, 02:15 AM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sypher
theres a gray line with the whole pulling your AP map using openport though. I think pulling your map and modifying your ap map
The line is not grey Sypher, please have some respect for intellectual property and our engineers who work very hard to be able to offer our technology and services to the community. We do what we can to contribute to the community...not steal from it.

It sounds like your version of learning is unlawfully looking over other professional's shoulders Imitation truly is the greatest form of flattery This is an "AccessPORT" specific section of the forum...please post in the appropriate forum.

Thanks,
Christian.

Last edited by Christian.; 06-16-2006 at 02:41 AM.
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Old 06-16-2006, 03:56 AM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sypher
Reading is a beautiful thing.
Reading 3 jumbled posts of yours is not. Try some carriage returns and proof reading, before ragging on everyone, eh?

Cobb has spent a lot of time and effort building the AP+ST. Both work very well and are good value. Look at how well AP holds their resale value!

AP+ST is definitely worlds ahead of the "free" offerings in terms of usability, especially for the novice engine tuner.

If you already have the AP, picking up the ST (especially with the recently reduced price) is a no brainer if you are looking to extract more from your setup and are willing to read/learn about engine tuning. Otherwise, spend the money on a ProTune.
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Old 06-16-2006, 10:23 AM   #24
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pro-tune is like a car wash. Some people don't know how to do it.. some people do. but some people just don't have the time (or the dyno) to perform it themselves. So they take their car on down to the car was and gte it detailed (dialed in) for a price which saves them a bunch of time. Mowing the grass analogy can be put here also.

Point is, not everyone is a tuning noob... some just don't have the time... and for some its actually cheaper to get a protune then to take all that time off work to tune yourself. Don't go bashing everyone cause we don't live by the same ideals you do. Give us respect or our reasons (or offer to tune our cars for us)
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Old 06-16-2006, 01:22 PM   #25
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Currently the price of ST is 195 which is pretty much excellent for the interface and the live tuning. There is no making changes then flashing then logging etc. That's very years ago. The live tuning makes tuning the car faster. Time is money. The time you save with live tuning will pay for the 195 over time or maybe even after the first 2 times you use it. Everything has a price. Our time has a price.

The AccessECU AP+ST system also has something the free stuff doesn't. The AP! Youc an run multiple maps and switch on the fly. You can read CEL codes and reset them. You can flash antitheft and valet maps. If you really needed to, you can read boost. I don't think there is any other system out there right now like it. Closest you can come to it is UTEC which is over 1000 dollars anyways.

I'm very glad there are people out there creating free and effective tools but I'm tired of people making it sound like the current state of these tools can replace the AP+ST system. I'm tired of reading posts by people questioning why someone is considering street tuner or using street tuner when they can be using the free tools. How it's foolish to have to pay for these tools. A hyundai tiburon will get you from point A to B also. But we don't choose to drive them now do we? When and if the free stuff catches up to the Cobb stuff I would hope Cobb ups the ante again like they did with the AP and then again with the Protuner and Street Tuner softwares. Cobb, we'll keep paying for a good product.



Quote:
Originally Posted by Sypher
um ECUedit has DBW support, and yes its still itleast a year behind ST but its also hundreds cheaper. Engenuity is prettier and simpler to use though and the maker of the program is currently working on DBW support. Once hes done it will be sweet for DBW subies. Real time support might take awhile though. Im not saying its easy to use the open ecu tools or for everyone, its just if you have an AP already you can pull your map with an openport cord and modify how you see fit with out buying street tuner (to point out the obvious). Like for example (dumb example but you get the point) say I have an OTS map and I buy a wideband and I notice its running rich, well I can download my map, use ECUedit to add more boost and mess with my ignition timing slightly then reflash. Do the speedy learning trick, and boom datalog using free datalogging software. If yah screwed up you can always revert back to your previous map. idk, this is what Im going to be doing.
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