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Old 08-13-2006, 08:37 PM   #1
ram95
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so my lady friend has an 05 wrx which has been having problems for a while. She took it to the dealership (who didnt even drive the car) and they replaced an o2 sensor and the MAF. We pick the car up, its still broken. The turbo wasnt hitting till about 4500 and the boost was at like 8 psi.


We call and take it back in and actually go for a ride with the tech. The tech yells at my girl friend for having a blow off on the car. He takes it back and tells us to take it off before they can do anything else to the car.


My friend and i take the blow off valve off and change it for the stocker. We take the car back, the guy keeps talking to us about her EWG (damn idiot) and doesnt understand that it was a blow off. and kept saying a bunch of stuff that made it seem like it was my girl friends fault that her car wasnt runnin, and she ended up crying because the guy wouldnt leave it alone....


So they finally check out the car and said the pre-cat on the up-pipe exploded and the o2 sensor went into the turbo and f'ed it up. Then the tech yells and explains to us that if the blow off was on that they wouldnt fix it and it was just a really bad experence.


my thought was there is no way in hell that the blow off could do this. I dont know i am upset about this whole thing, and dont like the dealership too much since my buddy just got an 06 there and they said they tend to over look mods.....
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Old 08-13-2006, 09:19 PM   #2
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funny, most people on here are going to yell at you just as much for having an aftermarket BOV on there..

you may also want to read up on the FAQ's... an aftermarket BOV could have destroyed the cat, the dealer was well within their right to deny it.

http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/show...hreadid=468038
Are there any negative effects with aftermarket BOVs? Yes. The downside of releasing the air to atmosphere is that it has already been metered by the mass air sensor, and when it blows off, the ECU will be injecting the wrong amount of fuel into the cylinders. The engine temporarily runs extremely rich, meaning too much fuel is injected into the cylinders.

This temporary rich condition isnít usually that harmful, but it can cause bucking or hesitation on lift-throttle. If the condition is really bad, it can eventually foul spark plugs and even clog the catalytic converter as unburned fuel on the catalytic converter burns very hot, and too much of it can melt the cat.
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Old 08-13-2006, 09:20 PM   #3
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blow off valves can cause a rich condition, causing unburnt fuel to get trapped into the UP cat and burn there, causing it to break loose and eat your turbo. without taking it apart who knows, but the BOV could most CERTAINLY cause a turbo failure.
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Old 08-13-2006, 09:37 PM   #4
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oh wow. I just read that information
"If the condition is really bad, it can eventually foul spark plugs and even clog the catalytic converter as unburned fuel on the catalytic converter burns very hot, and too much of it can melt the cat."


She only had the blow off on there for about 5 months. She has had the car for a year now and only 7000 miles on the car...



maybe ill just show her that and see if she leaves the stock one on... I know she'll want the sound (mainly why she wanted one in the first place.) so what about they 50/50 bpv? that vent back into the intake and then to the air!? Any good companys that make those!?



Ya i am mainly mad at the dealership for just treating her so badly and making her cry. I dont think the guys should have treated her like he did. yes explain but not repeating the same thing over and over till she crys...
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Old 08-13-2006, 09:45 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ram95
oh wow. I just read that information
"If the condition is really bad, it can eventually foul spark plugs and even clog the catalytic converter as unburned fuel on the catalytic converter burns very hot, and too much of it can melt the cat."


She only had the blow off on there for about 5 months. She has had the car for a year now and only 7000 miles on the car...



maybe ill just show her that and see if she leaves the stock one on... I know she'll want the sound (mainly why she wanted one in the first place.) so what about they 50/50 bpv? that vent back into the intake and then to the air!? Any good companys that make those!?



Ya i am mainly mad at the dealership for just treating her so badly and making her cry. I dont think the guys should have treated her like he did. yes explain but not repeating the same thing over and over till she crys...

you first need to find out the problem, maybe it was the BOV, maybe it wasn't.

After you figure that out, you need to figure out why you let someone yell your at your "friend" until she cried right in front of you. . .shame on you!

after that, please ask to have this moved to either the service forum or the review forum.
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Old 08-13-2006, 11:02 PM   #6
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A lot of stuff seems to be going on there. If the cat in your up pipe "exploded", then that is obviously what caused the issue. I am not sure, by your wording, if they actually fixed it or not.

Don't get mad at a dealer for not fixing a car that aftermarket modifications broke. Dealers can get into a very large amount of trouble for fixing those kinds of things under warranty. Still, I agree that the tech (or service writer/manager) could have been nicer to your girl.

Does she have other mods? This is the first time I've actually seen a BOV do that to a catalytic converter.
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Old 08-14-2006, 12:19 AM   #7
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BOVs kill UP cats. It's well known.

Davenow started a thread with pics from it happening...
It's more common than you'd think.

Dealership was right in their assessment, and shouldn't fix it with the BOV on, unless using a catless UP instead. They shouldn't have been jerks, however.
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Old 08-14-2006, 08:11 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 02WHITEDUB
BOVs kill UP cats. It's well known.

Davenow started a thread with pics from it happening...
It's more common than you'd think.

Dealership was right in their assessment, and shouldn't fix it with the BOV on, unless using a catless UP instead. They shouldn't have been jerks, however.
+1,

there's NO reason to be a tool to a customer. Unless the customer starts it.

But your friend did sew the seeds of her demise by installing that BOV. My recomendation is to get a cheap TD04 from somewhere. Replace the uppipe with a gutted stocker while you're in there, and give her and yourself a slap on the wrist for modding a car without first knowing how because you just can't put bigger and better stuff on a car and expect it to always work.

Shane
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Old 08-14-2006, 08:56 AM   #9
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The dealer should have yelled louder. When you modify a car without knowing the consequences and then try to pawn the problem off on the dealer, that's just lunacy. Getting a 50/50 will do nothing to help the problem as you didn't read the BOV FAQ well enough.
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Old 08-14-2006, 09:28 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Unabomber
The dealer should have yelled louder. When you modify a car without knowing the consequences and then try to pawn the problem off on the dealer, that's just lunacy. Getting a 50/50 will do nothing to help the problem as you didn't read the BOV FAQ well enough.

The Bomber is on a rampage today. Tough love there. But sometimes we have to be thrown out into the HOV lane before we learn how to run. lol.

Shane
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Old 08-14-2006, 06:28 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Unabomber
The dealer should have yelled louder. When you modify a car without knowing the consequences and then try to pawn the problem off on the dealer, that's just lunacy. Getting a 50/50 will do nothing to help the problem as you didn't read the BOV FAQ well enough.

Ya i looked at it i thought it might help a little bit under the full boost because it would put the air back in... guess not!
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Old 08-14-2006, 06:32 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hallis
+1,

there's NO reason to be a tool to a customer. Unless the customer starts it.

But your friend did sew the seeds of her demise by installing that BOV. My recomendation is to get a cheap TD04 from somewhere. Replace the uppipe with a gutted stocker while you're in there, and give her and yourself a slap on the wrist for modding a car without first knowing how because you just can't put bigger and better stuff on a car and expect it to always work.

Shane

Yeah i told her to leave it stock when she first got the car ( i mean like not doing anything till she had stage 2 at least) But she wanted the sound of the blow off just like many others do for the "cool" sound. Its her car i cant control what goes on.

But we just got a turbo xs stealth back and she is all affraid of putting it on because of how the dealership acted.


They are covering everything for free...the car sould be outta the shop soon and back on the road with a new uppipe and new turbo
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Old 08-14-2006, 11:27 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ram95
But we just got a turbo xs stealth back and she is all affraid of putting it on because of how the dealership acted.
And she is right. Do not do it without engine management, or you will find out about OL/CL delays and broken ring lands next.
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Old 08-15-2006, 03:47 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ram95
She only had the blow off on there for about 5 months. She has had the car for a year now and only 7000 miles on the car...

...I know she'll want the sound (mainly why she wanted one in the first place.) ...

Ya i am mainly mad at the dealership for just treating her so badly and making her cry...
...The potential of BOV messing up the car is no less than a manual boost controller without proper engine management....So again, the BOV proved such short period of time/mileage can do great damage. Fair enough.

...She wants the sound...She cried... How much she knows about cars? Sorry but I have to say it is SHE who made herself cried, and ruining the turbo and a nice WRX... You know, she couldn't know what's actually a "B. O. V." unless some of her friends persuaded/urged to her how good is the BOV. Probably it is her friends who encouraged her to put the BOV on. She needs a re-evaluation of her friends, or how to pick trustworthy friends.

...I don't know how mean was that tech coz we didn't witness that, but from dealership's perspective, they are doing right things. Do you even know the risks behind all these if the dealership fixes all your problems but SoA (Subaru of America) does not approve the expense? Labor, Parts (turbo, uppipe, seals, oils, gaskets, etc) could cost them a lot.


She cried probably because she felt guilty ruining the nice Subaru (and it is still considerably new) by listening to one of her friends and installed the BOV, not because the tech scolded her. I hope she learned a BIG lesson, and think wisely, act wisely.
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Old 08-15-2006, 04:01 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ram95
so my lady friend has an 05 wrx which has been having problems for a while. She took it to the dealership (who didnt even drive the car) and they replaced an o2 sensor and the MAF. We pick the car up, its still broken. The turbo wasnt hitting till about 4500 and the boost was at like 8 psi.


We call and take it back in and actually go for a ride with the tech. The tech yells at my girl friend for having a blow off on the car. He takes it back and tells us to take it off before they can do anything else to the car.


My friend and i take the blow off valve off and change it for the stocker. We take the car back, the guy keeps talking to us about her EWG (damn idiot) and doesnt understand that it was a blow off. and kept saying a bunch of stuff that made it seem like it was my girl friends fault that her car wasnt runnin, and she ended up crying because the guy wouldnt leave it alone....


So they finally check out the car and said the pre-cat on the up-pipe exploded and the o2 sensor went into the turbo and f'ed it up. Then the tech yells and explains to us that if the blow off was on that they wouldnt fix it and it was just a really bad experence.


my thought was there is no way in hell that the blow off could do this. I dont know i am upset about this whole thing, and dont like the dealership too much since my buddy just got an 06 there and they said they tend to over look mods.....

No offense, but I sorta don't believe this story...

a) they replaced parts without even driving it.

b) they 'yelled' at your gf or friend whatever? It's pretty damn unlikely that a subaru tech will yell at you for what you've done for your car. They might tell you that warranty won't cover it or that that's what's causing the problem, but to yell and cause the girl to cry? sounds weird.
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Old 08-15-2006, 07:41 PM   #16
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ooooop. Bov's just suck. Kid toy on a serious car.

Ie Pinwheels or cards in the spokes of a bicycle. That eventually eat up the bike.....
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Old 08-15-2006, 07:43 PM   #17
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Find a used turbo, finish gutting her uppipe, car fixed, GF happy.
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Old 08-16-2006, 03:53 AM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Blue Pilot
No offense, but I sorta don't believe this story...

a) they replaced parts without even driving it.

b) they 'yelled' at your gf or friend whatever? It's pretty damn unlikely that a subaru tech will yell at you for what you've done for your car. They might tell you that warranty won't cover it or that that's what's causing the problem, but to yell and cause the girl to cry? sounds weird.

a)no no no... it threw a code and they replaced the o2 on the down pipe and the MAF. We told them something else was wrong, but they didnt drive it to see they said that should have fixed it. Then the next day we went back in....

Today we talked to the tech that is actually working on the car (the guy that yelled was not the one that was working on the car) and he said he should have driven the car and seen/felt what was wrong.

The tech said this has happened to 4 other cars in our town (this is the only dealership kinda a small town) and none of the other ones had blow off valves.


She took a pic of the up pipe, and its burned to hell. everything that fell out of the cat looks like its welded to the turbo. Its crazy, ill try to get the pics up
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Old 08-16-2006, 03:55 AM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WRX03
Find a used turbo, finish gutting her uppipe, car fixed, GF happy.
They are covering everything for her. Which is nice of them. Also i told her about all of this and she is going to leave the stock by pass on and Sell the BOV.

Also on the way is stage one from cobb!
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Old 08-16-2006, 07:38 AM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ram95
They are covering everything for her. Which is nice of them. Also i told her about all of this and she is going to leave the stock by pass on and Sell the BOV.

Also on the way is stage one from cobb!
She got REAL lucky that the stealership decided to cover it.

I can't wait to see pics of the carnage.

Shane
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Old 08-16-2006, 10:51 AM   #21
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Crazy. My friend also encouraged me to get a BOV and I did buy one (for a pretty low price). But, I never installed it because I saw that the factory bypass reused the air via a medium sized hose. My friend abviously didn't know enough about it because he didnt know what to do with the hose. I learned a couple of options but didnt understand the benefits. Not knowing... I decided not to use it and it was never installed.

Ram, I'm sorry for your friends trouble but, I'm glad all of you posted this thread. It helped me, if that makes a difference. I just joined Nasioc so it's nice to have all of this info in front of me.
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Old 08-16-2006, 11:57 AM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cardshark
Crazy. My friend also encouraged me to get a BOV and I did buy one (for a pretty low price). But, I never installed it because I saw that the factory bypass reused the air via a medium sized hose. My friend abviously didn't know enough about it because he didnt know what to do with the hose. I learned a couple of options but didnt understand the benefits. Not knowing... I decided not to use it and it was never installed.

Ram, I'm sorry for your friends trouble but, I'm glad all of you posted this thread. It helped me, if that makes a difference. I just joined Nasioc so it's nice to have all of this info in front of me.
Try reading Unibomber's Manifesto which is in the FAQ's on the top of this section. It will open your eyes to MUCH good information.

Shane
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Old 08-16-2006, 12:05 PM   #23
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Lesson to be learned? BOV's really set the zealots off, even more than CAI.
I know several people who have run them for years and never had a hitch.

Would I run one? No, but thats because i think it makes the car too ricey.
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Old 08-16-2006, 01:43 PM   #24
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Originally Posted by MS WRX
Lesson to be learned? BOV's really set the zealots off, even more than CAI.
I know several people who have run them for years and never had a hitch.

Would I run one? No, but thats because i think it makes the car too ricey.
Or anybody who understands mechanics. The up pipe is a fragile thing stock. They have had several let go. A BOV makes this worse. This is a fact proven over and over again that many seem to enjoy ignoring. Then things go boom, and they blame Subaru. It is amazing to me how so many people here sound so much like the addicts I deal with.
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Old 08-16-2006, 02:20 PM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bofh
Or anybody who understands mechanics. The up pipe is a fragile thing stock. They have had several let go. A BOV makes this worse. This is a fact proven over and over again that many seem to enjoy ignoring. Then things go boom, and they blame Subaru. It is amazing to me how so many people here sound so much like the addicts I deal with.
Though I agree that we should not blame Subaru, BOVs do not guarantee disaster. If this was true, then you'd see alot more of these stories as many run BOVs (though nobody likes to admit it).

If memory serves, the most prolific destroyer of up-pipe cats used to be an MBC.
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