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Old 09-05-2006, 08:44 PM   #1
nxwrxfx
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Member#: 92011
Join Date: Jul 2005
Chapter/Region: TXIC
Location: ATX
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2002 WRX STI EJ207
05 Baja Turbo

Default Crazy Setup Idea: Alcohol injection PLUS TMIC sprayer?

Okay everyone,
After 4 long years of backbreaking work I'm finally ready to push some more power into my 2002 Subaru WRX sedan.
It's a Stage 4 (VF34'd) with Street Tuner, and it's lightly tuned right now until I finish getting a few more upgrades prior to getting it dyno'd.

I have some questions about alcohol injection though.
I think I'm leaning towards the SMC kit, but I have a conflicting mod installed already and I wanted your opinion(s) on what to do with it!

So I have a "bugeye" WRX sedan with a full STi intercooler water sprayer conversion.
Additionally, the water spraying function is controlled by a JDM Pivot water spray controller (no funky STi IC Spray switches).

If I end up going with a SMC alcohol injection kit I would probably opt for the new STi water resevoir retrofitted kit so I could have a bigger tank for my main alcohol sprayer... but this leaves me with a non-functional Pivot water spray controller...

So I was wondering... Would there be any benefit in mounting a dual alchohol injection kit? Maybe have the SMC kit spraying inside the TMIC on top of the throttlebody connection and having the Pivot controlling a smaller, lighter spray pattern on top of the TMIC?
Or... Possibly spraying an alcohol mix or just water only onto my Koyo radiator to help cool that down?

Any comments? Concerns? Ideas??
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Old 09-06-2006, 01:37 AM   #2
Ultimate Collision Center
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I would personally mount a new tank or use your windshield washer tank and install a separate kit that way. I personally use and sell snow performance kits but the coolingmist kits are great as well and I would take either one over the smc kit any day. There are combinations of the two kits that work nicely as well that you can look into. Having two separate systems spraying at once would have no real benefits and likely be more of a hassle and area of potential problems more than anything else.
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Old 09-06-2006, 02:02 AM   #3
nxwrxfx
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05 Baja Turbo

Default

Interesting, and I was wondering that too...
But spraying water on the radiator externally in conjunction with an alcohol injection kit in the TMIC might work..

UltimateCC - Can you tell me more about the Snow Performance & Coolingmist kits?
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Old 09-06-2006, 08:37 AM   #4
Ultimate Collision Center
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I will tell you more about the snow performance kits and I will let CMTech chime in for the coolingmist. Snow performance has two kits for our cars, one is a stage1 which is the simple/basic kit that is activated at a certain psi and brings the pump on at full pressure. Then there is stage2 which is the same as stage1 but it also has a progressive control unit for spray. This means that you will have two settings, one for a starting of spray (certain maf point or psi) and then there will be a max setting that will be when the pump comes on at full pressure. This is a nice option especially for those with upgraded turbos that are a little laggy. Then there is also the failsafe that is offered by snow performance that can be used by either stage kit or the coolingmist kits. It is a control box that monitors flow and whenever it drops below a certain psi it triggers a 12v signal which triggers a solenoid to open up and cause your boost to drop to wastegate pressure (about 8psi for your wrx). If you have any other questions or concerns just let me know.
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Old 09-06-2006, 08:43 AM   #5
hippy
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ULTIMATE CC View Post
....It is a control box that monitors flow and whenever it drops below a certain psi it triggers a 12v signal which triggers a solenoid to open up and cause your boost to drop to wastegate pressure (about 8psi for your wrx).
flow-cc/min, not psi. I know you ment this, but I'm just tryin to clarify for readers.... Also, wrx's running vf34's have what people call boost creep. Many turbos out there don't have the ability to hold wastegate pressure(or anywhere near wastegate pressure) on certain setups between certain rpms at full throttle, and this might make it worthwile to test how low a given setup can hold boost before spending money on something that limits boost for safety. As always, this is just my opinion, and I'm no expert.

peace

Last edited by hippy; 09-06-2006 at 08:50 AM.
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Old 09-06-2006, 10:25 AM   #6
Ultimate Collision Center
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Thanks for getting that, I guess I was a little tired, regardless of boost creep the unit will still drop your boost drastically, and unless you have some serious issues you will let off the gas in time before you boost creep really becomes an issue but I appreciated the idea as I wasn't fully aware of the vf34s having boost creep issues, I am guesing the vf30s are the same way then?
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Old 09-06-2006, 03:13 PM   #7
hippy
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I don't agree, and as far as I know the vf30 isn't as bad because of the bearing design. I dunno though, since I've never owned a vf30(but I did have a vf34...).

peace
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Old 09-08-2006, 01:26 PM   #8
enash99
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Location: Next to turn #1
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03 WRX VF-34
PSM

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Quote:
Originally Posted by hippy View Post
flow-cc/min, not psi. I know you ment this, but I'm just tryin to clarify for readers.... Also, wrx's running vf34's have what people call boost creep.
I have never experienced any boost creep at all with my VF-34. I am still only running the cobb 2.5 OTS map. I have the full Scooby Sport Catless exhaust also, w/catless uppipe too.. i do data log my car almost weekly and my logs are always spot on.
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Old 09-08-2006, 01:34 PM   #9
hippy
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Do you live at altitude? Do you run the car in higher gears at high rpms? How long have you had this setup? Have you ever tried lowering the boost? Imo boost creep doesn't mean that you can't hold the boost you want because of a mechanical problem. It means that you can't hold wastegate pressure because of a mechanical problem. Everyone could just try to hold 25psi and say they have no boost creep, but what happens when their failsafe kicks in and the boost doesn't go down? This is why I said you should test how low you can hold the boost before getting a failsafe that limits boost. For all you know, your boost can't be held lower then 16psi at higher rpms in higher gears. If your car is tuned for injection with more advanced timing and leaner a/f ratios, even at 12psi you could have some serious problems if the injection cuts out.

peace
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Old 09-08-2006, 01:38 PM   #10
enash99
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Join Date: Oct 2004
Chapter/Region: South East
Location: Next to turn #1
Vehicle:
03 WRX VF-34
PSM

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Well i have a 4th gear pull from yesterday that starts at 2300 rpm and goes to almost redline at about 121 mph i can post that if i can figure out how.. lol
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Old 09-08-2006, 01:41 PM   #11
hippy
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No need man..... If you want to test how low you can hold the boost though, put a tube from 90 degree fitting on the compressor of the turbo to the fitting on the wastegate actuator. Do a run in fourth and see what happens. I bet you can't hold less then 16psi if that low at higher rpms.

peace
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Old 09-08-2006, 01:57 PM   #12
enash99
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Member#: 72363
Join Date: Oct 2004
Chapter/Region: South East
Location: Next to turn #1
Vehicle:
03 WRX VF-34
PSM

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Ok i see what you are saying now. Here is my details this setup has been up and running for over a year. I do experiment often with my GFB MBC where i have the boost set anywhere from 17 psi to 21 psi. In fact i jsut pulled of the MBC 2 days ago from testing it at 21 PSI. I do live pretty much at altitude. ( tampa, FL ) But my interprutation of creep is running 4th or 5th out long enough ( meaning a long pull to 6800 + rpm) and having the boost creep past my target boost setting. Also note i am fully catless. Cats will help keep creep from happeneing. I do ALOT of 150+ mph runs and have yet to creep with my current setup. I am looking over my data log from yesterday right now and i did stop a bit short i reached 6350 rpms at only 121 mph but my logs is freaking great! cobb would be proud.. lol I can e-mail this log but i would rather post it i just do not know how and if i get time ill look around abotu how to post something. I have yet to post an attachment since i have been on this board.

Here is my mod list.


Engine Perfomance
ERZ Uppipe Thermotec wrapped.
Full Scooby Sport TBE Downpipe and Mid Pipe thermotec wrapped.
VF-34 Turbo
STI Pink injectors
Samco Silcone Turbo Inlet pipe
Ver.7 JDM STI Spec - C TMIC
Ver.7 JDM STI Spec - C Shroud / Gasket
Ver.7 JDM STI Spec - C Spray Kit w/Button and Microswitch
Ver.7 JDM STI Spec - C STI y-pipe
Vishnu UD pulley
Apexi turbo timmer
K&N drop in
GPmoto sliencer delete.

Brakes/Mounts
Group N Tranny mount
Goodridge Lines
Frozen Rotor slotted and cryoed front rotors
Racingbrake rear slotted and drilled rotors
Porterfield RS-4 brake pads front / rear

Suspension:
Prodrive Springs
Koni Struts
Rota Wheels /W Kumho MX tires
Lighweight lug nuts,
Hotchkis Front Hollow Swaybar 25.1mm
Whiteline Rear Adjustable Sway Bar
Kartboy Rear Aluminum Drop Links
Noltec Front Drop Links
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Old 09-08-2006, 04:59 PM   #13
hippy
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Silver

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Tampa is not altitude... I ment like 1000 feet or something, not 70.

peace
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Old 09-08-2006, 05:15 PM   #14
nxwrxfx
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Join Date: Jul 2005
Chapter/Region: TXIC
Location: ATX
Vehicle:
2002 WRX STI EJ207
05 Baja Turbo

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Hey guys, back on topic...

Can anyone recommend a good alcohol setup that's under $500?
And something moderately easy to install as well.
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