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Old 09-06-2006, 12:22 PM   #1
WoohooRX
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Lightbulb List of Turbo Spool + Whp characteristics (averages)

I've been researching turbos for the past few days, and realized there's no cohesive turbo spool + whp thread. I understand that it all depends on the TUNE and not all dynos are created equal, however, there seems to be an AVERAGE/COMMON spool/whp for most turbos.

I was hoping there could be a single thread, where newbies, like myself, could have a starting point, just so we don't see a million "____ turbo spool characteristics" or similiar type threads (which there have been a plethora of in the past few days)

This is what I've gathered going through the Factory 2.0L and PPB sections. Please keep in mind, these are all AVERAGES, there is a wide spectrum, absolutely dependent upon the tune.

I'll also need your help, please add anything I've missed, or correct me if I'm wrong in something.

The following is some of the more popular turbos which people ask about. A range of average spool times, and lastly, average Whp with accompanying basic mods (TBE, Injectors, Fuel Pump, IC if required), all data below is on 91-93 oct. pump gas.

Spool = The rpms listed below reflect the time where the turbo is fully engaged, ie the point where your head gets pushed back against the seat.

Turbo_____________Full Spool_____________Avg Whp_______Max Whp

Stock Td 04..........................2900 - 3100......................150 - 185
Td 04..................................2500 - 3000.......................210 - 230..............245
VF 23..................................3300 - 3500........................unsure
VF 34..................................3300 - 3500.......................250 - 270..............300
VF 30..................................3500 - 3700.......................240 - 270..............
VF 39..................................3750 - 4000.......................250 - 270..............
VF 22..................................3500 - 3800.......................265 - 290..............
Small 16g.............................3500 - 3700.......................260 - 280..............
Big 16g................................3500 - 3700.......................260 - 290..............
EVOIII 16g............................3500 - 3700.......................260 - 300..............
18g.....................................3750 - 4000........................280 - 310+............
20g.....................................3800 - 4200........................310++................. .

(The use of P&P, alky/meth, AVCS, etc. will usually decrease the spool times, and increase whp)

For the Max Whp line, keep in mind the following:
1. Dyno reading uncertainty
2. Highly modded, usually includes P&P, and may include alky/meth
3. Validated by atleast 1 person

Please don't bite my head off, I know spool times and whp threads usually end up in people arguing, but hopefully this can be a ROUGH guide.

Let me know if you want to add any other turbos to the list.


VF series turbos: Information taken from amukaoen (http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/show...highlight=vf23)

VF22:
This turbo has the highest output potential of all of the IHI VF series turbos and is the best choice for those who are looking for loads of top end power. The top end power however, does not come without a cost. The VF22 spools significantly slower than the rest of the IHI models due to the larger P20 exhaust housing and is much less suited for daily driving than some of the other models. Although the largest VF series turbo, the VF22 is not quite optimal for stroked engines or those who wish to run more than 20PSI of boost. The VF22 is best mated with the 2.0 block and in applications of 20lbs of boost or less.

VF30:
The VF30 is commonly considered the best bang for the buck turbo in the IHI VF series line. A relatively new model the VF30 features the the same exhaust housing as the VF24 but a larger compressor side similar to the VF22. The combination of these two parts results in increased output potential without the lag associated with the VF22. Although it doesn't offer the top end supremecy of the VF22, the VF30 is a great compromise between these unit and the quicker spooling models.

VF34:
The VF34 is nearly identical to the VF30, with the same exhaust housing and compressor. However the VF34 goes back to the ball bearing design, and in doing so achieves full boost approximately 500RPM sooner than the comparable VF30. The VF34 is the most recent IHI design and as such costs slightly more than its counterpart. Top end performance and maximum output are identical to the 30.

VF23
This turbo is considered a great all-around turbo. Like the VF22 it utilizes the largest P20 exhaust housing. This housing is mated with a smaller compressor housing of the of the VF24 for fast response and excellent low and mid-range performance. It does not have the same top end power of the VF22, but spools up significantly quicker. Standard ball bearing center section. Excellent bolt-on replacement for the standard WRX turbo on cars without any other major modifications. Expect flows around 430 CFM at 18 PSI.

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Last edited by WoohooRX; 09-21-2007 at 08:55 AM.
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Old 09-06-2006, 12:30 PM   #2
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Im not biting off your head at all. This is a good idea. Well done.
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Old 09-06-2006, 12:37 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WoohooRX View Post
I've been researching turbos for the past few days, and realized there's no cohesive turbo spool + whp thread. I understand that it all depends on the TUNE and not all dynos are created equal, however, there seems to be an AVERAGE/COMMON spool/whp for most turbos.

I was hoping there could be a single thread, where newbies, like myself, could have a starting point, just so we don't see a million "____ turbo spool characteristics" or similiar type threads (which there have been a plethora of in the past few days)

This is what I've gathered going through the Factory 2.0L and PPB sections. Please keep in mind, these are all AVERAGES, there is a wide spectrum, absolutely dependent upon the tune.

I'll also need your help, please add anything I've missed, or correct me if I'm wrong in something.

The following is some of the more popular turbos which people ask about. A range of average spool times, and lastly, average Whp with accompanying basic mods (TBE, Injectors, Fuel Pump, IC if required).

Turbo_______________Spool____________Avg Whp
Stock Td 04.........................2600 - 2800.......................200 - 220
VF 34..................................3300 - 3500.......................250 - 270
VF 30..................................3500 - 3700.......................unsure
VF 39..................................3750 - 4000.......................250 - 270
VF 22..................................3800 - 4000.......................265 - 290
Small 16g..............................unsure
Big 16g.................................unsure
EVOIII 16g............................3500 - 3600.......................260 - 290
18g.....................................3750 - 4000........................280 - 310+
20g.....................................3800 - 4200........................310++

(The use of P&P, alky/meth, AVCS, etc. will usually decrease the spool times, and increase whp)

Please don't bite my head off, I know spool times and whp threads usually end up in people arguing, but hopefully this can be a ROUGH guide.

Let me know if you want to add any other turbos to the list.


+1 Good idea, well done
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Old 09-06-2006, 12:57 PM   #4
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Well Done.

This thread should serve your intended purpose quite well.

-Joe
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Old 09-06-2006, 01:00 PM   #5
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Nicely done! A VF30 should make almost exactly the same power as a VF34, since they're both the same design. The only difference between them is that the VF34 is ball-bearing, so the spool is faster, but the power is the same.
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Old 09-06-2006, 02:31 PM   #6
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Nice chart. What gear was used to obtain those spool times? Makes a big difference.
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Old 09-06-2006, 02:38 PM   #7
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It'd be good to post which gear those spool times are in. Also, if people can include logs and which gear the pulls were done in, we could get a better idea of how each turbo spools and maybe which mods help/hurt spool.
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Old 09-06-2006, 02:52 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SparkysJDMSpeedWagon View Post
Nicely done! A VF30 should make almost exactly the same power as a VF34, since they're both the same design. The only difference between them is that the VF34 is ball-bearing, so the spool is faster, but the power is the same.
Thanks, I'll add the change


Quote:
Originally Posted by peterex View Post
Nice chart. What gear was used to obtain those spool times? Makes a big difference.
To be honest I'm not sure what gear all those were done in. I just looked through a ton of threads to get those numbers, some people noted it, but most didn't.

I'll try to go through them again, and see what I can pick up.
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Old 09-06-2006, 02:54 PM   #9
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I'm pretty sure most of people compare the spool up at 3rd since that's the widely used during highway pull
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Old 09-06-2006, 02:55 PM   #10
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nice, when enough information gets compiled. i bet theres a great chance that it'll end up as a sticky... cause there are way too many.. "how much WHP and how bad will the spool be" threads everyday.
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Old 09-06-2006, 03:06 PM   #11
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just to make a note, there ARE TD04 powered WRX's making 240-250whp (albeit heavily modified)

(and FYI, my ported TD04 hits 18psi (in 5th gear) @ 2350ish RPM....4th is roughly 2500rpm, 3rd = ~ 2900rpm, 2nd (17.9psi) = ~ 3200rpm, and i managed to hit 16.6psi in first @ 3800 (although i cant get it to stay constant, it'll surge between 16 and 18psi, gotta mess w/ my WGDC's and temp compensation a bit more, because it changes with the weather)
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Old 09-06-2006, 03:33 PM   #12
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my vf22 doesnt spool that late. its around 3400
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Old 09-06-2006, 04:20 PM   #13
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I run a vf39 and I believe that in general they spool a bit more quickly (~ 3300 rpms) than the other vf series turbos because it is the smallest of those you have listed aside from the td04. The horsepower figures are right on target though.

my .02..
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Old 09-06-2006, 04:26 PM   #14
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Nice...............

Now if there was some type of topend chart for the 2.0 to go with it.

Like
TopEnd Distance

16g/Vf -----?
Evo3 -------??
18g --------???
Anything Bigger - ? +
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Old 09-06-2006, 04:27 PM   #15
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even though they are approximate times, i think the stock td04 is the hardest to get right since a full exhaust significantly changes the spool characteristics of the turbo. after cobb stage 2, i can hear my turbo spool at 1800-1900 rpms...insanely early. but its a nice idea; especially for noobs.
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Old 09-06-2006, 04:32 PM   #16
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Awesome idea. Subscribing in case it doesn't get stickied.
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Old 09-06-2006, 04:36 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ThisizBrian View Post
my vf22 doesnt spool that late. its around 3400
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blown95ImpalaSS View Post
I run a vf39 and I believe that in general they spool a bit more quickly (~ 3300 rpms) than the other vf series turbos because it is the smallest of those you have listed aside from the td04. The horsepower figures are right on target though.

my .02..
It's important to keep in mind that everyone has access to different tuners. I really think you guys have really good tunes. The general concensus out there, is that the VF34 is the quickest spooling of the vf series turbos. Followed by the VF39, and then lastly the VF22.

I just put those numbers up because it seems like, from reading a ton of threads on these turbos, that the 39/22 are later spoolers, but tend to have a higher top end.

If some more people chime in with their comments/setups/results then we can change it.

Last edited by WoohooRX; 09-06-2006 at 05:05 PM.
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Old 09-06-2006, 04:53 PM   #18
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I'd say most peoples TD04 on EM are at least the 220 whp mark. maybe 220-230 average.
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Old 09-06-2006, 05:11 PM   #19
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Sticky!!
Awesome work. I was just deciding on a turbo, and this would have saved me many hours of searching.
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Old 09-06-2006, 05:15 PM   #20
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id say 210-225 whp for TD04 is average. So you're definatly spot on. Cobb OTS Stage 2 map probably claims the majority of these users.
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Old 09-06-2006, 05:17 PM   #21
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i got a small 16g spools at arround 3400ish can't tell you how much hp though
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Old 09-06-2006, 05:28 PM   #22
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What PSI do u consider spool? 18? 19? 22? etc might want to add that to the list.
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Old 09-06-2006, 05:32 PM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TJRCS View Post
I'm pretty sure most of people compare the spool up at 3rd since that's the widely used during highway pull
you'd be surprised at how many schmucks here on nasioc quote 5th gear pulls on the highway under load...
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Old 09-06-2006, 06:10 PM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Token-Negro View Post
What PSI do u consider spool? 18? 19? 22? etc might want to add that to the list.
Good Point there. When everyone says "it spools at xxxx, what do you really mean ? Are you at full boost at xxxx, or just making boost then?
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Old 09-06-2006, 06:49 PM   #25
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Very good write up. I always did the research on the interweb about the different turbos, but there wasnt really anything to compare them. Thanks for taking the time to do this for us.
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