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Old 09-12-2006, 04:53 PM   #26
02blueru
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Subscribed . I also can't decide between the 2
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Old 09-12-2006, 05:08 PM   #27
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Never dynoed or ran a 1/4

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Originally Posted by InfamousDX View Post
What kinda power are you making?
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Old 09-12-2006, 06:27 PM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AZScoobie View Post
I currently have a 2.5 with 207 type ra heads. I would rather have the 2.0 back to be honest. A V7 RA or V8 EJ207 with a simple GT30R.

Clark
This would be me exact setup, I already have the 30r i would just upgrade it to the .82 housing and go from there. I put alot of miles on my car and need something i can just swap in on a weekend and not have a tone of little issues. Really i think 400wph + should be attainable on these motors. With my setup. In order to build a 2.5 i need a block and so many parts and then my heads need work cams and valve train. Really a full swap sounds the best.
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Old 09-12-2006, 07:03 PM   #29
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What ever you do dont run the 2.5 block with the EJ205 heads. Its really not a good combo. I tune them all the time. They are knock happy and just not a good sounding motor.

Dan, If you put the 2.5 block in make Damn sure you get some thick head gaskets. If you dont you will end up with Compression of 9.2-9.5 to 1 and its a BEAR to make any power on pump 91.... Get custom pistons in the 8 to 1 range or at a min get the thicker Gaskets.

Clark
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Old 09-12-2006, 07:14 PM   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AZScoobie View Post
What ever you do dont run the 2.5 block with the EJ205 heads. Its really not a good combo. I tune them all the time. They are knock happy and just not a good sounding motor.

Clark
Really?! That's good to know, I was think of doing that. Any problems with jdm heads on a 2.5? Like spec c v8?
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Old 09-12-2006, 07:17 PM   #31
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Yes.

US STI heads are around 57cc combustion chambers, EJ205's are around 52cc, V7 and V8's are a tiny 48-49.... You really need to lower the compression with pistons or with Gaskets at least. If not you will be limited on the boost you can run. This makes a huge difference on a GT35R that does not want to be at 14 psi...

C
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Old 09-13-2006, 12:17 AM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gold rush View Post
Never dynoed or ran a 1/4
how did you get the car tuned for the GT35 then?
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Old 09-13-2006, 12:31 AM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AZScoobie View Post
What ever you do dont run the 2.5 block with the EJ205 heads. Its really not a good combo. I tune them all the time. They are knock happy and just not a good sounding motor.

Dan, If you put the 2.5 block in make Damn sure you get some thick head gaskets. If you dont you will end up with Compression of 9.2-9.5 to 1 and its a BEAR to make any power on pump 91.... Get custom pistons in the 8 to 1 range or at a min get the thicker Gaskets.

Clark
Is this also true if the valvetrain is upgraded? Supposedly EJ205 heads have the same sized ports as an STi head, so would a good valvetrain kit plus cams be a good match?
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Old 09-13-2006, 12:38 AM   #34
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subcribed.
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Old 09-13-2006, 12:41 AM   #35
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token you're in the same position I was. Full motor swaps in mighty quick. We started at noon and could have been running by midnight, had the clip on the throwout bearing not wanted to pw3n me. Maybe clark can comment on the tolerances of hte build, but this motor is quiet. it makes a 2.5 hybrid sound wretched by comparison.
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Old 09-13-2006, 09:53 AM   #36
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As lovely as a Ej207 sounds in all its glory, when it is time for me to swap blocks I have to lean more towards the 2.5L. Around where I live and the way I drive, I don't quite think I could take full advantage of a 8500 + rev limiter as much as I could with the extra torque of .5L.
To utilize a range that high on the EJ207, you would also need a bigger turbo which will keep pushing the power curve further to the right the bigger you go. I'm sure these motors sing from 4k on up but while I am not trying to get my gihugenormous turbo spooled and watch my fuel gauge plummet, I would like to feel some down low torque.
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Old 09-13-2006, 10:00 AM   #37
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I compete against a bunch of 2.5l STi's in HPDE/TT events. I've noticed that the additional torque of the 2.5's is really an advantage for them coming off of a corner. I can pretty much match them as far as power down the straight. Hoping that the 18g will help equalize that a bit once I can find someone to tune it for me. (V7 shortblock, V8 Spec-C heads, VF22 currently)

-Keith-
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Old 09-13-2006, 12:43 PM   #38
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The Port size of the STI and the EJ205 is about the same. But the Combustion chamber is much smaller on the 205 heads. If you likeTrq the 2.5 is the only way to go. Its 25% larger and has a much higher power potential. But it has its disadvantages. It drinks ALOT more fuel. It took 5-6 miles to gallon right of my car the minute I put it in. They dont like to rev out, they sound harsh doing so.

To me... A V8 EJ207 with Twin scroll and a JDM 6mt is just Heaven. The sound, feel and power band matches the car.

Clark
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Old 09-13-2006, 02:33 PM   #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AZScoobie View Post

US STI heads are around 57cc combustion chambers, EJ205's are around 52cc, V7 and V8's are a tiny 48-49.... You really need to lower the compression with pistons or with Gaskets at least. If not you will be limited on the boost you can run. This makes a huge difference on a GT35R that does not want to be at 14 psi...

C
Clark I'm running the V7 Big ports with a 2.5L bottom, are the combustion chambers that small on the BP's as well? Also although the V7 heads were designed to run with a 2.0L is there any other disadvantage to running them on a 2.5L?

Lastly would I see more advantages running an UTEC with stock 02 ECU (no AVCS) or stepping up to a Hydra and running the AVCS. This currently powers a 18g 8cm but will be a Red 8cm soon.
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Old 09-13-2006, 02:41 PM   #40
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Your JDM V7 heads are small combustion chamber heads. Your Compression ratio is high. Not so big a deal on race fuel or 93-94 octane. But hell to pay on 91.

I think you should Run a V7 ECU that is made for that engine with a Utec. The Hydra for your car simply blindly pulses the AVCS solenoids and does not offer closed loop AVCS cam control. It works but its not ideal. You Def want to run AVCS however.. If not you will loose a Great amount of power.

Clark
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Old 09-13-2006, 04:03 PM   #41
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Autotune with Autronic EMS on the road.
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Old 09-13-2006, 04:22 PM   #42
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EJ207 ftw.


only real downside is the loss of OBD-II (which is required for inspections in most states AFAIK).
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Old 09-13-2006, 05:53 PM   #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JasperSTi View Post
EJ207 ftw.


only real downside is the loss of OBD-II (which is required for inspections in most states AFAIK).
You don't lose OBD-II. I passed with flying colors in VA. Certain OBD-II machines can read the JDM ecu.
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Old 09-13-2006, 05:55 PM   #44
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Very true.. The Test machines look for Fails or pending... If they are not there you pass. The Difference in US to JDM ECu is the simple fact that there are more tests in the US ECU. I have not had anyone Fail over a JDM ECU. As long as its code free.

Clark
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Old 09-13-2006, 06:40 PM   #45
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clark 205 heads with 2.5 is no good? even with the thicker 00 RS headgaskets puttting it into the 8:7:1 ratio?
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Old 09-13-2006, 06:56 PM   #46
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As I stated before. You need to use pistons with higher Combustion chamber volume or a thicker headgasket. The RS gaskets are not enough in my opinion. It sure is better then the STI gaskets however..

Clark
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Old 09-13-2006, 06:57 PM   #47
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This thread rules!! I was thinking of doing a 2.5L block with WRX heads......now I going to save my cash for a swap! Thanks for the info guys! Keep it coming!
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Old 09-13-2006, 07:08 PM   #48
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AZScoobie View Post

To me... A V8 EJ207 with Twin scroll and a JDM 6mt is just Heaven. The sound, feel and power band matches the car.

Clark


looking forward to that
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Old 09-13-2006, 07:22 PM   #49
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SonicYelloWRX View Post
Go with a built and balanced 2.5l. Back when I did my swap there weren't too many options available for built motors and swaps and the price of JDM motors was cheaper. If you have to worry about emissions testing it will be much less of a headache going with a 2.5. The V7 motor is great, but there are much better options out there and a nicely balanced 2.5 will be just as smooth as an ej207 if not smoother. A nice option would be the Gruppe-s 2.1l high rev block that is a built ej207. That's what I will do if I ever blow my 207 up.
as for emissions testing, I think that's hard to say what he should do. Where I'm at emissions testing is simple plug into the computer check for codes no codes found and you pass. now if he's gotta do a tail pipe test then yeah I can see what you are saying as a valid point. But from what I've been seeing is around the country they are doing OBDII tests only on 1996 and newer cars. Some places if it fails the OBDII test they will tail pipe test it but in Illinois your only option on a 96 and newer car is OBDII test you fail that and you have to fix it till there are no stored codes. Even if the code is something stupid like a tranny code which has no effect on emissions output.
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Old 09-13-2006, 07:34 PM   #50
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JDM motors run clean. If you keep a Cat your fine.

I have never been in or tuned a 2.5 that was as smooth or as fun to drive as a V7 or V8 EJ207. That includes:

Crawford,
Axis
DPR
Cosworth
GuppeS
STI

The 2.5 is just not a smooth motor. Its not the balancing. Its the Bore to stroke ratio. Its so oversquare its "chuggy".

Clark
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