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Old 09-29-2006, 01:44 PM   #1
nxwrxfx
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Default Cooling Mix-N-Match Setup question

Hey everyone,
I have a few questions about my cooling setup.
First off I've got a 2002 Subaru WRX that's VF34 equipped.

Okay, right now I have an STi water spray setup controlled by a Pivot waterspray controller.

I have a new TMIC on the way, as well as a Nitrous Express intercooler chiller setup, but I eventually want to run alky injection.

Here's my question:
Is it possible to spray C02 on top of the top mount intercooler to chill it, and simultaneously spray alky injection into the throttlebody?

And of course, if I did the above setup I would use the STi intercooler water spray setup to chill my Koyo radiator.

Any advice is appreciated, but I'd like to make the most out of using both systems!
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Last edited by nxwrxfx; 09-29-2006 at 11:29 PM.
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Old 09-29-2006, 05:14 PM   #2
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You can do whatever you want man. If I were you, I'd run alc/water injection along with nitrous(both into the engine), or just sell the n2o kit and run alc/water.

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Old 09-29-2006, 06:48 PM   #3
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I'm just a little nervous on running nitrous directly into the engine...
My goal here isn't really power, it's more for battling heat soak on the intercooler/radiator and so forth.

But thanks for your advice!
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Old 09-29-2006, 08:15 PM   #4
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i dont think there is any reason that you couldnt spray the nitrous on the intercooler and use alky.

I wouldnt just because i wouldnt spray nitrous around my engine were it could get into the intake and give you a nice little unregulated shot of nitrous. i really wouldnt use it on my radiator since the air would then travel straight at the intake
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Old 09-29-2006, 09:47 PM   #5
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Very true living4sift, but what about changing the Nitrous gas to CO2?
It would still chill the intercooler, but wouldn't cause crazy effects if it got into the air intake system.
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Old 09-29-2006, 09:48 PM   #6
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EDIT: I've done some major research, and I've definitely decided to only run CO2 in the intercooler spray bar and NOT Nitrous!

Also, I'm running an upgraded TMIC and NOT a FMIC, so I think with a good TMIC intake shroud that I won't have CO2 gases drifting into the OEM intake.

Again, I'm hoping that the intercooler spray setup will eliminate heatsoak when the car is stopped (like when waiting in traffic at a stoplight) Later on when I add alky injection that will help for tuning.

So again, if I did the setup mentioned above, would it be safe to "freeze" the TMIC with C02 and still spray alky into the throttlebody?

Last edited by nxwrxfx; 09-29-2006 at 11:22 PM.
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Old 09-29-2006, 11:23 PM   #7
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the problem with co2 is that it will make you loose power if it gets into the intake since it will actually put out the fire.

i have seen several test showing that the only power gains of using nitrous is from nitrous entering the engine and if you switch to co2 they lost power. if removing this element by hooking the intake up to a pipe to get air from someplace else they only saw like a 5hp gain.

if you are still interested in cooling the intake look into the cyofusion.com product. it is what i will be using when i switch to a reverse intake manifold.
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Old 09-29-2006, 11:26 PM   #8
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^^ living4surf, i'm betting you posted before i had a chance to finish editing my last post

The intercooler spray setup will be STRICTLY for battling heatsoak during the hot Texan summer months, I know power gains with this system are next to nothin', that's what the alky injection setup will be for later on.

So... to clarify:

TMIC CO2 Spray bar setup for battling heatsoak: Good? Bad? Meh?

Alky injection into throttle body for enhancing tuning/power: Good? Bad? Meh?

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Old 09-29-2006, 11:35 PM   #9
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Btw, living4surf, that Cryofusion intake chiller looks pretty interesting too!
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Old 09-30-2006, 07:52 AM   #10
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Here's what I was trying to say b4. Imo, using anything to cool the intake charge indirectly by cooling the intercooler is not an efficient way to cool the intake charge. Injecting water/alc/n2o(any or all) will cool the intake charge directly, and have other advantages over spraying the outside of the intercooler. Yes, you can spray the outside of anything with everything you want, and inject the inside with everything you want(even though it might be dangerous depending...). Imo you do not need this though. Water injection would probably do everything you want and more. It also has a much lower upkeep compared to something like co2 or n2o.

peace
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Old 09-30-2006, 02:08 PM   #11
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Hey hippy,
Okay that does make more sense, and I do still plan on getting water injection.
Heck, if the CO2 sprayer ends up being a real PITA i know I can sell it on eBay and get what I paid for it easily.

Still, no one has really confirmed/disconfirmed if the CO2 sprayer would be an excellent tool for killing heatsoak of a TMIC...
That's the only reason that I really bought the setup for cheap. I know it's not a power mod by any means, but it just seems like it'd be tons more efficient at destroying heatsoak when compared to the stock STi water spray system.
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Old 09-30-2006, 07:26 PM   #12
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My point was more that heat soak won't be an issue with water injection because as soon as the water sprays, the air is cooled. This can be done at idle with the right setup, and even pre-intercooler to help cool the intercooler.

I don't know the numbers, but imo the co2 would be better at cooling the intercooler then water spray while the car is stopped, but once the car is moving, the water spray would most likely become a much more efficient cooling agent then the co2. This is cause the air entering the scoop would counter the effects of the co2, while the water would help the air cool the intercooler more(since it can transfer more cooling energy to the air). Just some random thoughts on the subject I guess.

peace
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Old 09-30-2006, 07:38 PM   #13
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That makes sense too hippy.
And that's what I was thinking, which was to only use the CO2 spray at the top of the intercooler while the car was stopped in traffic. Your point on the water system is possibly valid too, as I didn't think about that.

My guess is I might rig up a setup in which to use C02 at stoplights to chill the intercooler thereby removing heatsoak, then switch to an alcohol injection system to cool the intake charge while the car is in motion.

I dunno, either setup is going to involve a lot more wiring... And here I thought I was done tearing apart my interior for a little while!
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Old 09-30-2006, 10:51 PM   #14
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the co2 will give you a more consitant run at the track but it isnt the greatest for useing at stoplights since you bottle would go empty fairly quick.

but if you just want it to battle heatsoak it should work.
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Old 09-30-2006, 11:50 PM   #15
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$$$$$$$$$$$$ That was my point about intercooler chillers. They might get the job done, but it's at the cost of using a ton of n2o or co2 which costs money every time it's used. A 30 shot of n2o would be more efficent(money/cooling/powerwise) then an intercooler chiller because you'd use a lot less n2o per run(maybe 1/5th to a 10th), and probably get better results every run. On the road you might not even get 1 run from an intercooler chiller. Imagine sitting at a light and assuming it's gonna change, so you empty a bottle of n2o or co2 onto the intercooler, and the intercooler chills. Next thing you know the light hasn't changed, and the intercooler is losing the chill it just got. Woops, there goes $20. I'd personally stay as far away from intercooler chillers as I could.....

On another note, why even get a new top mount if you're going to be cooling it with something? A $180 diy water injection kit(maybe another $100-300 in safety devices if ya want) would most likely cool the air as much as you need(if not more), and have many advantages over a bigger intercooler, intercooler chiller, and water spray. Water injection would also cost a lot less in upkeep, especially since it can be used to save fuel at hard throttle. Speaking from my own experiences, if I were you, I'd just get water injection. Course this is just my opinion......

peace

Last edited by hippy; 10-01-2006 at 09:55 AM.
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Old 10-03-2006, 05:18 PM   #16
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Hey hippy,
Yep, I am planning to get alky injection soon but just not right now. I need to concentrate funds on thermal protecting a lot of parts before I can get alky injection. Therefore, the chiller will have to work for now, and then later on I will probably sell the chiller and use that money for a water injection kit.

At the moment I lack funds for a proper dyno tune, so my plan is to purchase alky injection just before I go to get dyno tuned this winter. In the meantime I still have a couple other bits & pieces (like a turbo inlet) to buy before I concentrate on adding major power boosters like alky.
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Old 10-03-2006, 05:30 PM   #17
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I would suggest running a 35 shot and alky, you will get way more gains out of that then the chiller and alky combo, I run alky and nitrous on my evo...
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Old 10-04-2006, 01:34 AM   #18
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Well, here's my other thought. It shouldn't be too hard to convert my Nitrous NTercooler setup to a Nitrous injection system, granted I'll need to buy some extra parts.

Nice HP numbers btw UltimateCC!
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Old 10-04-2006, 01:40 AM   #19
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Yea they actually sell a kit I believe, if you need any NX stuff let me know I am now a dealer for it, nitrous is great, just very expensive, I use it because I love to drag race but the evo is mainly my autox car...the torque numbers are through the roof, they are in the 500 range due to me pushing the little 16g so hard...
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Old 10-04-2006, 07:48 AM   #20
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If you sent the intercooler and chiller back, you'd probably have enough money for injection and a tune, and you'd probably make a ton more power. You'd probably end up spending a lot less for it over time too, since water and/or water/alc injection costs less to refill then a gas tank.

peace

Last edited by hippy; 10-05-2006 at 03:36 AM.
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