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Old 03-29-2007, 01:51 PM   #101
Phil Jr.
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Originally Posted by SloRice View Post
^^The outlet going into the uppipe is 2", not sure about the individual runners. I guess I could measure those too.
the flange going to the uppipe on mine is 2" but the runners going up to the flange are a bit larger so you kind of have a small lip there Not a huge deal cuz it could be smoothed up pretty easy.
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Old 10-03-2007, 05:27 AM   #102
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Did we get a pipe size od and ID on the perrin headers?
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Old 10-03-2007, 05:59 AM   #103
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Back from the dead....
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Old 10-03-2007, 09:24 AM   #104
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The outlet going into the uppipe is 2"

The 4 runners coming off each exhaust port are a little smaller...I'd say 1.75" to 1.5" But I did not measure them.....just guaging with my recently calibrated eye.
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Old 10-03-2007, 10:09 AM   #105
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Originally Posted by SloRice View Post
The outlet going into the uppipe is 2"

The 4 runners coming off each exhaust port are a little smaller...I'd say 1.75" to 1.5" But I did not measure them.....just guaging with my recently calibrated eye.
Lasec eh ?
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Old 10-03-2007, 04:17 PM   #106
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I was hoping for some measuremnts, I would say looking at pics they are 1.5" primeries and maybe 1, 5/8th seconderies, but GT spec use 1, 11/16 secondaires on there twin scroll headers.
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Old 03-11-2008, 12:48 AM   #107
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Anybody else do any tests recently with EL headers?

Clark?
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Old 03-11-2008, 01:01 AM   #108
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I did one on an FP green STI. Turbo came on 600 to 800 RPM faster and as a result made 40 ft lbs of trq and 25whp under 4000 rpm. From 4500 to 6000 rpm power was exactly the same and from 6000 + it lost 8whp.

Clark
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Old 03-11-2008, 01:53 AM   #109
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Clark,
this is compared to a stock header? if so, surprised that it lost power up top.
whats your opinion overall of the perrin header on an FP Green or similar?
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Old 03-11-2008, 11:08 AM   #110
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Originally Posted by AZScoobie View Post
I did one on an FP green STI. Turbo came on 600 to 800 RPM faster and as a result made 40 ft lbs of trq and 25whp under 4000 rpm. From 4500 to 6000 rpm power was exactly the same and from 6000 + it lost 8whp.

Clark
Was this with or without tuning?
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Old 03-15-2008, 03:16 PM   #111
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Stock header FTW. As Full-Race had explained before EL header's don't matter It's the Pressure drop in the header so if you have a header with larger runners the pressure drop will be more unless you have a large turbo to pressurize that system. correct me if I'm wrong.
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Old 03-15-2008, 04:03 PM   #112
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Stock header FTW. As Full-Race had explained before EL header's don't matter It's the Pressure drop in the header
strange how full race is the only company out there that says runner length is less relevant than pressure drop.

strange how when questioned about the established body of research that points to runner length being important in order to align pulses, full race avoids giving an answer.

strange how a year later everyone is still waiting for the magic numbers that have been promised from such a proprietary full race setup.
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Old 03-15-2008, 06:47 PM   #113
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where are all the super 2000 rpm spooling 600 whp full race kitted cars at? maybe they can post the graphs
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Old 03-16-2008, 04:51 AM   #114
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Was this with or without tuning?
This was the same with and without tuning. The difference was the fact that the equal length system choke flowed much faster then the 4 to 1 system. Its a balancing act. A setup like mine need big tube equal length headers.

C
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Old 03-16-2008, 04:54 AM   #115
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Originally Posted by Wrinkleboi View Post
Clark,
this is compared to a stock header? if so, surprised that it lost power up top.
whats your opinion overall of the perrin header on an FP Green or similar?
THe Perrin EL header kicks ass. It makes more power over the curve up to the top end. For a street car and or a road race car the EL is the way to go. But what I am finding is that perrin needs to make a big tube version that will support the gas flow that big turbo setups need.

C
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Old 03-16-2008, 08:46 AM   #116
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I think the comparison would have been closer if the stock manifolds were ported and wrapped.
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Old 03-16-2008, 09:58 AM   #117
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Quote:
Originally Posted by spoolinsti05 View Post
Stock header FTW. As Full-Race had explained before EL header's don't matter It's the Pressure drop in the header so if you have a header with larger runners the pressure drop will be more unless you have a large turbo to pressurize that system. correct me if I'm wrong.
yeah, that isn't right...a larger turbo will take longer to reach the same pressure...but its compressor side has the same story. The turbo has a pressure ratio and in the great majority of turbo's you always have higher exhaust pressure than intake manifold pressure. The pressure "drop" is a horrible way to put it on their behalf. What I think he's refferring to is a stepped runner. This makes for a lower pressure (higher velocity) tube right outside of the head and then is opens to a larger diameter higher pressure (lower velocity) tube. This helps to combat reversion. EQ and the tuning lenght does make an effect on the shift of the torque curve, be it a higher or lower targeted RPM.
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Old 03-16-2008, 10:00 AM   #118
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AZScoobie View Post
This was the same with and without tuning. The difference was the fact that the equal length system choke flowed much faster then the 4 to 1 system. Its a balancing act. A setup like mine need big tube equal length headers.

C
it choke flowed?!!! or you started having to great of flow losses related to RPM?...big difference.

I.E. if you are flow benching heads, you will see the air flow taper and can stall out. This isn't choke but a flow problem. Choke is a pressure problem that then stops flowing beyond a certain volume of air. When you hit choke, everything falls off the face of the earth.


Also, being as a turbo is a compounding system based up when it starts to spool; I'd imagine this choking that you had to be from the small hot side trying to handle a great airflow. That and that is was probably at a decreasing efficiency on the compressor side.
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Old 03-16-2008, 12:54 PM   #119
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AZScoobie View Post
But what I am finding is that perrin needs to make a big tube version that will support the gas flow that big turbo setups need.
1,000,000% correct!!
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Old 03-16-2008, 01:06 PM   #120
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I WANT TO SEE....

a PERRIN EL VS GRUPPE-S EL header comparisson!!

the gruppe-s is just like the perrin only the runners are a larger diameter!!
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Old 03-16-2008, 02:01 PM   #121
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the gruppe-s is just like the perrin only the runners are a larger diameter!!
really?!! they have the same stepped ID and lengths? same primarie ID and legnth too? Same degrees of bend?

They ALL effect how a manifold performs.
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Old 03-16-2008, 11:29 PM   #122
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Homemade WRX View Post
really?!! they have the same stepped ID and lengths? same primarie ID and legnth too? Same degrees of bend?

They ALL effect how a manifold performs.
from what i understand the stepped id is larger as well as the primary... length is equal... dont know exact specs... but from what ive learned, the runners are larger... get them together and snap a pic
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Old 03-17-2008, 09:58 AM   #123
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sounds good.
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Old 03-17-2008, 02:12 PM   #124
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really?!! they have the same stepped ID and lengths? same primarie ID and legnth too? Same degrees of bend?

They ALL effect how a manifold performs.
reguardless of all differences, they may just flat out perform better...
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Old 03-18-2008, 12:03 PM   #125
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The outlet going into the uppipe is 2"

The 4 runners coming off each exhaust port are a little smaller...I'd say 1.75" to 1.5" But I did not measure them.....just guaging with my recently calibrated eye.
If the outlet into the uppipe is 2" (51 mm) it's actually bigger than the 41 mm diameter of the Perrin uppipe! (for stock mount turbo) Or does Perrin have a different uppipe for their header??? I assume the Perrin rotated uppipe has a bigger i.d.

Mark.
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