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Old 11-09-2001, 10:23 AM   #1
wrxxtc
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Default if you do go over 4000rpm in break in period...

what can this actually do to the engine?
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Old 11-09-2001, 10:28 AM   #2
supermarkus
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you could break your muffler bearings
It is recommended that you keep it under 4000 under normal driving unless it's an emergency. Reving it hard all the time during break in will cause excess wear and improper lapping of the pistons. However there is much debate on how well the pistons are lapped at the factory and whether break in is important. I have always followed manufacturer break in procedures, on lawn mowers, chain saws, both new cars I've owned, and two out-board yamaha boat motors. Haven't seized one yet. YMMV
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Old 11-09-2001, 10:35 AM   #3
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nothing... don't worry about it if you don't make it a normal occurence.

edit: I should clarify, since I read it wrong. See post below, I'm with him

don't do it, unless you have to.

Last edited by JGard; 11-09-2001 at 11:07 AM.
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Old 11-09-2001, 11:04 AM   #4
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If you do it often enough, your engine won't "seat" right and you will have oil leakeage down the road. Be patient.
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Old 11-09-2001, 12:00 PM   #5
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I kind of...ahem..."forgot" about the break in period
on mine. Was revving it the first day I got it...

Now at almost 8500K miles, driven it from FL to NC and
back, and haven't had any problems. Kept it mostly
stock (just took out the silencer last week, K&N going
in today), however.
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Old 11-09-2001, 12:34 PM   #6
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Rumour has it that the factory oil is thinner to allow the rough edges to wear themsleves away. There is also 'work hardening' taking place which improves the toughness of the surfaces of the components.
Work Hardening - adjusting the metal's crystalline microstructure by manipulating it by force. When you bend a paperclip back and forth it gets stiffer due to work hardening. Things like engine components and Karabiners are deliberately work hardened to improve their strength.
toerag
PS. I've just done the 1000 mile break in on my forester and have now started to drive it harder. Ideally I'd wait for the freebie oil change, but they can't do it until next Friday
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Old 11-09-2001, 02:20 PM   #7
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i was told at the dealer that the oil that comes in it is just plain old Castrol GTX.
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Old 11-09-2001, 03:08 PM   #8
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Quote:
what can this actually do to the engine?
Nothing - but the evil monkey living in your trunk will poke you in the eyes!
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Old 11-10-2001, 02:50 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally posted by wrxxtc
what can this actually do to the engine?
There is a chance that you could glaze the oil in the cross hatched patterns on the cylinder walls due to the extreme heat generated by high revving. When your cylinders are glazed, your piston rings will never be broken in and will never be fully seated. If this happens, you will be burning oil between oil changes because your piston rings can no longer do their jobs of keeping oil from entering the combustion chamber and keeping the combustion gas from entering the crankcase.

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Old 11-10-2001, 07:37 AM   #10
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I brought it up to redline but while it was in neutral. I've got 27000 miles and no problems so far *crosses fingers.*
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Old 11-10-2001, 11:00 AM   #11
Richard L.
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If you are not burning any oil between oil changes, then you are OK. Once the piston rings are fully seated or fully mated to the cylinder walls, you can rev your motor up to your heart's desire.

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Old 11-10-2001, 01:24 PM   #12
02 T-WREX
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If you ask any professional engine builder, you will learn that the whole "keep it under 4000 rpm" break-in routine is a wives tale.

Basically, car manufacturers see MOST new car owners as idiots... and they cannot handle breaking-in a new engine the correct way, so they just make it easy on them and say don't go over 4000. What you REALLY want to do during a break-in is get some good mid-range combustion pressure on the rings (for example, drive 20mph, then accelerate quickly to 50mph but without reving the engine too high). The worst possible thing you could do to a new engine would be to lug it around and baby it. The only time I have ever seen a new engine with glazed rings was when the engine was babied. Don't get me wrong, you shouldn't go around redlining all the time... but the 4000rpm limit isn't as important as people make it out to be. You should also avoid driving with the engine at a constant speed, you definitely need to vary the revs. I always break in new/rebuilt engines on a nice loooong drive on a twisty country road. That way you're shifting a lot, and getting some good load on the car, but without revving excessively. In fact, Hastings (manufacturer of piston rings & engine parts) doesn't reccomend any type of 4000rpm rev limit or 1000 mile break-in period at all. They simply say to accelerate from 20-50 quickly about ten times, without reving too high... and then that's it, no more break-in required.

Think about this... when a race team builds a new engine for their race car, do you think they drive it around the track for 1000 miles under 4000 rpm? Nope. When I broke in the engine in my Alfa racecar (3.0L NA V6), I did the 20-50 routine... and then kept my rev limit to 5000 rpm for the first 400 miles, then 6000rpm until I hit 1000 miles, then I went racing... over 2.5 hours of abusive track time, reving over 7000 rpm at times (very breif times). The result? Strong motor, uses no oil to date... good compression, etc, etc, etc.

Just my .02

-Chip
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Old 11-10-2001, 04:21 PM   #13
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02 T-WRX is exactly right.

I also come from a racing background (formula fords mostly) and follow the same philosophy. Flog that sucker. In addition to what has already been said, if you do have a defect in the build or in the composition of a part, you want to find that sooner rather then later. Whenever and engine came in from the builder at my father's race shop, it went straight into the car and then abused in a test session. In racing, you want to know on the first test session if you are going to need to replace an engine while there is still time to do so and not in the middle of a race. Similarly, you want to find out if you engine is solid or not while it's still under warranty, not after.

And the same applies not only for a clear breakage, but also for more minor problems that can result in a performance loss. Sooner is definetly better then later in these cases.
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Old 11-10-2001, 08:34 PM   #14
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Default Disagree

I have to disagree with 02 T-WREX. And here's why. I own a 2000 Celica GTS. Granted it's not a WRX but we're just talking about engines here. I've had 2 engine in my 2000 to date. The first I didn't follow the instructions at all. I redlined it 5 times in the first 1000 miles and several times after reaching "lift". Mind you this was not prolonged redlining or racing, just full throttle 2nd gear runs. At 11k miles I noticed alot of knock in the engine. And then, at 11087 the engine went. Mostly due to manufactuer defect but it was also because the engine was not broken in right. The new engine I have, I've done it right. And there is no pinging and a hell of a lot more bottom end and throttle responce. I did take it to redline once to make sure rings don't develop in the cylinder walls but only that once. And the new engine rocks. I'd say treat it like a very expensive new toy and take care of it. But it's not a Ford, so have fun with it.
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Old 11-10-2001, 09:03 PM   #15
dhs
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This is a direct quote from a guy I respect, Larry Widmer, he is talking about a Honda rebuild:

<blockquote>Use 0-30, or 5-30, or 10-30 motor oil and a Honda filter. Do NOT use synthetic motor oil for break in.
Make sure the fluid levels are where they should be.
Start it up and keep the engine at 2500 -3000 rpm for about 20 minutes. Make sure there are no leaks, or mechanical problems. The only idling will be for setting the timing.

Before doing the schedule, remember that running the engine at steady rpm (like cruising on the freeway) is not good for break-in.

0-200 miles. Try to keep the highest rpm under 3000 rpm. Every 15-20 miles, zing the engine to 4500 rpm in first and occasionally in second gear.
200-400 miles. Try to keep the revs limited to 3500 rpm. Raise the "zing" rpm to 5500 with the same frequency as above.
400-600 miles. Go to 4000 rpm for driving limit. Raise the "zing" to 6000 - 6500 rpm and include 3rd gear pulls, same frequency.
600-800 miles. 4500 rpm driving limit. "Zing" it to 7000+ rpm and include partial 4th gear pulls.
800-1K miles. 5000 rpm limit with "zing" to 7500+ with some pulls all the way through 4th and partial fifth gear pulls.
Now, don't misunderstand me on the zings. You don't HAVE to scream the engine religeously at the prescribed intervals. If you don't have the space to run the engine up in the selected gears, don't do it. Just know that you can, and IF the opportunity comes around lay into it. Don't over-do the procedure.

I recommend that the oil be changed at the 1K mile marker. If the plugs are looking good and if the compression's (and leak down numbers) good, switch to Mobil 1 for life. Use either 0-30, or 10-30.
After the oil change, you might want to reset the valves and from that point on, drive it the way you'd normally run it.</blockquote>

Now that differs from what Subaru says. I put it in here to just show that the engine builder should let you know how to break in the engine (like subaru does).

As far as racing engines, they are different animals, purpose built and frequently rebuilt. The cylinders are more coarsely finished to require minimal break-in. Not many racers would be willing to wait 1k to race the motor.
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Old 11-11-2001, 07:07 PM   #16
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The WRX is my first new car that I've had. I used to drive a prelude. I asked the service manager from my dealer how to break in. He says vary the rev, do not drive in constant speed, max rev is 5000rpm. I took my car to dallas and I rev it often but not redlining for the first 1000miles. Right now I am consistently rev matching when I down shift or heel and toe it. The result is my engine much much more stronger and has better boost. I compared this with my friends WRX who bought it a couple of weeks after I got mine and we have almost the same amount of miles. HIs car doesn't appear to be as fast as my car. One of the reason is that he does baby his car. The service manager also drove my car and said that my car is one of the cars that has the best break in because its more responsive and faster. I have not had any problems with the engine so far. I have 6000 miles on it right now. That is my experience and observation.
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Old 02-15-2002, 11:55 PM   #17
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Default Re: Disagree

Quote:
Originally posted by onikageka
[b] I did take it to redline once to make sure rings don't develop in the cylinder walls but only that once. And the new engine rocks. [b]
What are these "rings" you're talking about? I don't see how redlining the engine will cause the cylinders to do anything but move faster.

Paul
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Old 02-16-2002, 03:43 AM   #18
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Quote:
Originally posted by Snowphun:
What are these "rings" you're talking about? I don't see how redlining the engine will cause the cylinders to do anything but move faster.
Dude, please check out Howstuffworks.com

All pistons have rings. When the air/fuel mixture ignites or being compressed, the rings are forced outward against the cylinder wall to keep combustion gas from escaping into the crankcase.

FYI, cylinders do not move. Pistons move inside the cylinders.

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Old 02-16-2002, 10:04 AM   #19
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Quote:
Originally posted by SilverWRX02
The service manager also drove my car and said that my car is one of the cars that has the best break in because its more responsive and faster.
Your service manager is out seeing how fast and responsive your car is? Sounds like a joy ride. I'd be pissed.
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Old 02-16-2002, 04:55 PM   #20
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As if anybody could gleen any useful information from such a contradictory set of posts....

Here's yet another opinion. The reason I think you keep the rev's down during break-in is because until the pistons and cylinders fit well together there's extra heat due to friction. This extra heat could cause damage (to metal parts, rings and oil) if you run at high rpm's for an extended period. I agree that in general you should vary the rpm's (this causes the piston to work its way further up the cylinder bore), begin working your way up the rpm scale during the first 1000 miles, and don't drive very hard consistently (avoid prolonged heat creation) in the first few hundred.

Once the pistons become round, and the cylinders become round, and everything fits well, and the heat from friction is lower, than have a blast.
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Old 02-16-2002, 05:37 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally posted by Richard L.

Dude, please check out Howstuffworks.com

All pistons have rings.
"Dude", learn to read more carefully. Onikageka said rings would develop in the cylinder walls. These are the rings I'm asking for more info on. Not the ones in the pistons. I have a pretty good idea of how engines work, thanks.

Paul
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Old 02-16-2002, 06:02 PM   #22
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and the "cylinders moving faster" must, of course, refer to the fact that the cylinders are attached to the car that as a whole will be "moving faster" because of the higher revs... right?
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Old 02-16-2002, 07:13 PM   #23
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Quote:
Originally posted by IXLR8
and the "cylinders moving faster" must, of course, refer to the fact that the cylinders are attached to the car that as a whole will be "moving faster" because of the higher revs... right?
God forbid if someone makes a typo. I meant to say piston, as you know. However, regardless of how many times I read your petty post, it still doesn't make any sense.

I guess you're jumping in here because you have something to add?

Paul
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