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Old 01-07-2013, 12:31 PM   #1
nakedbee
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Default 255 vs 257 block strength

After reading the Import Tuners article on the EJ http://www.importtuner.com/tech/impp...h/viewall.html

it got me wondering, when they are talking about the block being able to withstand 5-550, it sounds like their talking about both blocks? The 257 has to be a bit stronger correct, being semi closed and all. Or is the only thing the semi-closed offer is better sealing properties to the head since the liner won't move as much?

Trying to figure out if upgrading the pistons and rods in the 255 is even worth the trouble vs picking up a 257 block and doing pistons and rods then just swap everything over. Then at that point the block only being good for 550 bothers me, maybe just opt for the 22T closed deck and sleeve it and make a 2.65 IDK. I'm new to subies in general and also new to AL, blocks. I come from the 4g63 world of indestructibility
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Old 01-07-2013, 12:39 PM   #2
Gigs90
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The cylinder walls are not known to enjoy over 550whp , There is a company out in California that builds closed blocks which might interest you.

Drive a Subaru around 300whp then decided if you really want to sink 4-8k more into the car for more power.
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Old 01-07-2013, 12:50 PM   #3
nakedbee
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Drove a friends 3g with 297whp and 320awtq, as it was a blast and an awesome DD I have this problem (as most on this forum) I'll get use to the power and want more and more etc. Case in point, Had a 98 gsx with 550awhp and it was fast as heck until I rode in a friends 770awhp evo, game over!

One more question that goes along with this, The car is a DD running 93, now I've never messed with meth (always on corn fuel) but I realize 93 is good for 3-350 depending on the turbo, thats fine but how much can be made with meth? Is it just a question of how much is injected or does meth have it's limits as well? Also Is their a program where I could go from a "93 tune" to a "93 and meth tune" as I wouldn't want to run meth all the time.
Thanks for helping the newb btw
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Old 01-07-2013, 12:56 PM   #4
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The EJ255 and the EJ257 use the same case castings. Identical in every way. Both are the same semi-closed block. Both use the same bearings, crank, and rods. Both use the same materials in the pistons, but the EJ255 pistons are a deeper dish (more volume). The heads are the big difference, but both use the same cams.

The EJ205 is an open deck motor, but they actually seem pretty robust. Oiling issues and the subsequent spun bearings is what kills them (mostly running it low on oil while tracking it or taking tight turns). The EJ207 is a semi closed 2.0L block from the global STi and is probably the most robust and performance oriented Subaru motor of the WRX/STi motors. They come with very excellent big port heads.

Basically, you're going to find Subaru motors/modding to be a pain in the ass and way more cost and work compared to the Mitsubishi motors you're used to. Forget about numbers like 550whp and words like reliable. And 770whp? Never gonna happen. Realistically.

Last edited by kpluiten; 01-07-2013 at 01:07 PM.
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Old 01-07-2013, 12:57 PM   #5
Gigs90
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nakedbee View Post
Drove a friends 3g with 297whp and 320awtq, as it was a blast and an awesome DD I have this problem (as most on this forum) I'll get use to the power and want more and more etc. Case in point, Had a 98 gsx with 550awhp and it was fast as heck until I rode in a friends 770awhp evo, game over!

One more question that goes along with this, The car is a DD running 93, now I've never messed with meth (always on corn fuel) but I realize 93 is good for 3-350 depending on the turbo, thats fine but how much can be made with meth? Is it just a question of how much is injected or does meth have it's limits as well? Also Is their a program where I could go from a "93 tune" to a "93 and meth tune" as I wouldn't want to run meth all the time.
Thanks for helping the newb btw
What I have found is while 500 + whp is fun , there are few spaces in which to use it safely.

93 can get you up into the 400s easily. I know a guy running a Garret 3076 making around 400 right now on 93.

I mean you can add meth , Personally I don't like it but you could have two maps made for the car by your tuner. One would be a pure 93 map and the other would be a 93 + meth map. The major changes would be that you could pull more timing and a little more boost with meth. Honestly I would just go to E85 at that point if it is in your area.

My words of advice would be just to stick with a VF series turbo if you have a STi or get a VF series turbo if you have a Wrx. Play around with 300 whp and learn how it feels / how the car handles. If you want more then you can go from there.

A built motor for these cars will run you $4000 + for a quality build , Your biggest worries should be oiling related though. I would swap in a 12mm Oil pump and go with a Killer B oil pickup just to be safe. Also get a Boost , Oil Pressure and Oil temp gauges to monitor you car at all times. If you decide to go larger turbo I would also look at a wideband as well.
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Old 01-07-2013, 01:26 PM   #6
sc00by4life
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kpluiten View Post
The EJ255 and the EJ257 use the same case castings. Identical in every way. Both are the same semi-closed block. Both use the same bearings, crank, and rods. Both use the same materials in the pistons, but the EJ255 pistons are a deeper dish (more volume). The heads are the big difference, but both use the same cams.
This is only true for the early versions of the ej255 and ej257.

The 08+ is a little different. The ej257 has a nitride treated crank, different pistons as you mentioned, dual avcs, and a few other small differences in the heads.
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Old 01-07-2013, 01:27 PM   #7
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The 255 is not open deck, so the question is moot. The casting is the same.
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Old 01-07-2013, 02:43 PM   #8
kpluiten
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sc00by4life View Post
This is only true for the early versions of the ej255 and ej257.

The 08+ is a little different. The ej257 has a nitride treated crank, different pistons as you mentioned, dual avcs, and a few other small differences in the heads.
This is true. Because of the car I own and my interests, my Subaru knowledge is primarily 02-07.
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Old 01-07-2013, 02:58 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nakedbee View Post
Drove a friends 3g with 297whp and 320awtq, as it was a blast and an awesome DD I have this problem (as most on this forum) I'll get use to the power and want more and more etc. Case in point, Had a 98 gsx with 550awhp and it was fast as heck until I rode in a friends 770awhp evo, game over!
What you need, young Padawan.....is an iron STi block. When you can find this, all power questions will become equal.

Why not get a lighter car instead if you want all this acceleration?
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Old 01-07-2013, 03:20 PM   #10
kpluiten
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jack ffr1846 View Post
What you need, young Padawan.....is an iron STi block. When you can find this, all power questions will become equal.

Why not get a lighter car instead if you want all this acceleration?
Yup. A GC chassis can be brought down to 2650 without too much work. That would make a big difference over the 3250 lb GD chassis (estimates).
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Old 01-07-2013, 04:43 PM   #11
nakedbee
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Default

Actually my dream car would be the gc8 coupe but I have to have a hatch as I use the car for work and I don't like the looks of the gc wagon. Definitely know all about power to weight as I've had an FC rx7 @ 2400# and a s13 @ 2650#. Both were pretty much completely stripped down and now I just want a nice DD.

I don't me to sound like a jack wagon here dreaming about all these high HP goals etc but I hate to go and throw money at something just to turn around and do it all over.

I wasn't aware the two blocks were identical! That makes my day!! That brings up another question then. If I could make 400's on 93, then the weak point of the 55 would be the pistons over the 57 correct? Would the 57 support 4-450 on a stock short block (lets say the tune is spot on) 55's pistons are good for what 350whp?

Also I'm not really going after any particular HP number per say but the feeling associated with said number is what i'm looking for.

P.S. It sucks not knowing a thing and sounding like a doosh lol. Please someone ask me about a DSM and I'll let you know whatever you want.....
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Old 01-07-2013, 04:51 PM   #12
sc00by4life
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nakedbee View Post
Actually my dream car would be the gc8 coupe but I have to have a hatch as I use the car for work and I don't like the looks of the gc wagon. Definitely know all about power to weight as I've had an FC rx7 @ 2400# and a s13 @ 2650#. Both were pretty much completely stripped down and now I just want a nice DD.

I don't me to sound like a jack wagon here dreaming about all these high HP goals etc but I hate to go and throw money at something just to turn around and do it all over.

I wasn't aware the two blocks were identical! That makes my day!! That brings up another question then. If I could make 400's on 93, then the weak point of the 55 would be the pistons over the 57 correct? Would the 57 support 4-450 on a stock short block (lets say the tune is spot on) 55's pistons are good for what 350whp?

Also I'm not really going after any particular HP number per say but the feeling associated with said number is what i'm looking for.

P.S. It sucks not knowing a thing and sounding like a doosh lol. Please someone ask me about a DSM and I'll let you know whatever you want.....
the pistons are both equally as ****ty.
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Old 01-07-2013, 05:12 PM   #13
nakedbee
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Yeah I just saw a pic of the two pistons next to each other those things even look scary haha wtf was subaru thinking!
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