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Old 10-17-2010, 10:58 PM   #1451
ALTIMIT_09
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Old 10-18-2010, 11:16 AM   #1452
carl s.
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took a big rock during LSPR. Came over a crest, road was washed out on my line and bam. broke the wheel, tie rod, ball joint and axles. I think the strut is ok and the control arm might be ok but it might be cracked - haven't really looked at it yet. The GRIPPA was still holding 28psi afterward.

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Old 10-18-2010, 01:15 PM   #1453
iluvdrt
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^^Damn, that's a hell of bead to still be holding air LOL.
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Old 10-18-2010, 08:13 PM   #1454
skunkman
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dgsblb2 View Post
Wrong.

Both lift the car the exact same way (suspension lift). The only difference is that the Forester suspension will lift it about 3-4 inches. It comes down to what you want.
Nay.
Not to argue the point, but to clarify my take.
Unfortunately this forum tends to be an unfriendly forum where disagreement occurs
but here is the support for my argument:

FOR suspension provides longer suspension travel with taller springs and longer strut shafts, thus suspension lift.
Spacers use stock struts and springs, but push the body UP OFF the suspension, thus body lift.

left to right:
FOR, LEGacy, IMP


left to right:
second gen FOR, first gen OB, LEGacy


Quote:
Originally Posted by dgsblb2 View Post
The only time you will achieve a body lift is when you install cross member spacers. I don't recommend Forester suspension on an Impreza without front cross member spacers, but some people still do it. It also requires outback rear control arm mounts and a modified steering coupler, but those aren't complicated and way worth it. Your oil pan will be 1.5 inches lower, but your axles will be at a healthy angle. 1.5 inches isn't a big deal clearance wise, but axle wise it is.
These cross member spacers do not provide lift, but rather drop the drive line.
The Outback and forester strut shafts are longer than IMP or Legacy, thus providing "lift". They push everything of the car higher off the ground, including engine and transmission, but by dropping the driveline, you lower the engine and transmission so the axles/half shafts/CV joints remain in a nearer horizontal geometry from transmission/rear differential to the hub assembly.
As such, when you push the car up on OB or FOR struts and do NOT lower the driveline (with engine, transmission and rear control arm mounts), then the exles maintain a slight angle, not straight line, from engine or diff into inner CV joint, through the shaft through the outer CV joint to the hub....
At any rate, those spacers do not lift, nut rather lower driveline. Which is why, for example, a legacy on OB struts has slightly more ground clearance than it's OB counterpart, because the driveline lowering counteracts the increased ride height, but decreases albeit slightly, minimum ground clearance.

Quote:
Originally Posted by dgsblb2 View Post
Your oil pan will be 1.5 inches lower, but your axles will be at a healthy angle.
This is oil pan lowered, b/c engine, transmission, driveline lowered with respect to the body, thus losing some of the graound clearance gained by the strut swap.

This is why some people transfer those parts and others don't bother. Ideally for axles longevity one should transfer all those spacers/brackets, but ideal means different things for different folks. Ideal maximum ground clearance: forget about the crossmember spacers, ideal for increased (over stock) ride height and axle life: transfer the spacers and brackets...

I did the OB strut swap in my legacy 6.5 years ago and just replaced my first axle last week. It was a front axle due to cracking boot and some play developping in the half shaft. probably more an artifact of hard driving (rallying and off road) than an axle angle issue.

At any rate, to each his/her own, as they say. . .
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Old 10-18-2010, 08:19 PM   #1455
skunkman
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NICE!! I like that you're out of the ruts looking for freshies! Where in Utahr are you?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Touge86 View Post
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Old 10-18-2010, 09:22 PM   #1456
dgsblb2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by skunkman View Post
These cross member spacers do not provide lift, but rather drop the drive line.
Exactly! The cross member spacers make it a body lift because you still lift the body using the longer suspension, but lower the rear diff/transmission/engine with the cross member spacers.

And I'm sorry, but you're wrong about the lift spacers (ex. jackson rally 1'') being a body lift. That's a suspension lift because they are increasing the angle of the axles and raising EVERYTHING rather than just the BODY.

I've encountered a few people having problems with their axles, like myself, because they're at too steep of an angle with 4 inches of suspension lift. Obviously it would be ideal to skip the cross member spacers because they do lower the drive line, but it's something you have to do in some applications. However, a body lift allows for more body clearance, healthier axles, and bigger tires. With proper tire placement and a little common sense, it isn't an issue and well worth it if needed.

I'm sure if we talked about this in person we would both be on the exact same page.

I saw someone on here posting about how they lifted their ride with forester suspension and then an additional 1.5 inches with cross member spacers. I , but didn't feel like explaining it.
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Old 10-19-2010, 12:28 PM   #1457
Skippy5883
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Wow... I'm surprised I haven't found this thread before now!

Here's my '02 with 1" spacers in the front, 1 3/8" in the rear and a set of General Grabbers (along with a few other "bolt-ons" )

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Old 10-19-2010, 02:38 PM   #1458
skunkman
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dgsblb2 View Post
I'm sure if we talked about this in person we would both be on the exact same page.
Yeah you're right. I think we're talking circles of the same thing from different angles.

I think the deeper point here is, we agree lifting and rallying Subarus are good ideas

I really think IMPS and WRXs on FOR gear or even the spacers, with grabbers are the way the car is meant to be/function.

Cheers my lifted Subaru brother

Last edited by skunkman; 10-25-2010 at 11:37 AM.
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Old 10-19-2010, 06:30 PM   #1459
biebs96
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not lifted yet but after some offroading.

i took these pictures after we got a rain storm so imagine how dirty it was.



















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Old 10-19-2010, 06:33 PM   #1460
fgonz662
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look at all these subarus in here doing what their meant to do GET DIRTY!!! HELL YEA!
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Old 10-19-2010, 11:58 PM   #1461
dgsblb2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by skunkman View Post
Yeah you're right. I think we're talking circles of the same thing from different angles.

I think the deeper point here is, we agree lifting Subarus is a good idea

I really think IMPS and WRXs on FOR gear or even the spacers, with grabbers are the way the car is meant to be/function.

Cheers my lifted Subaru brother
Couldn't agree more! Good deal!!!
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Old 10-21-2010, 02:54 AM   #1462
Eriksport
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In the 4X4 (non Subaru) world:

Suspension Lift=creating higher ground clearance by whatever means are available.

Body Lift=creating tire clearance by moving body off the suspension higher, and thus only getting the ground clearance by running larger diameter tires.

Which of course is why we're all flogging the dead horse here, really a spacer mounted on top of the strut assembly is almost a body lift, but it also lengthens the overall strut length, thus creating a suspension lift. So lets all agree to disagree=lifting good, lowering only good if your car lives on pavement. Now if only I hadnt just bought new MX's for my goldies before lifting the car last year about this time. The snow tires never came off this year, hoping they'd wear out so I can upsize to some AT's. But alas, my Observes still look new despite my attempt and killing them with power sliding with monster truck lean.

(from last fall's Hatch Patrol wild Xmas Tree Hunt on Mt.Rainier)
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Old 10-21-2010, 04:15 AM   #1463
dgsblb2
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Just took a trip to Yosemite. Both of these pictures were taken after I simply parked, turned around, and said hey that looks like a good picture. I didn't edit these at all.


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Old 10-21-2010, 02:51 PM   #1464
kptimpreza
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does putting on bigger tires mess with speedometer and gas mileage?
how does everyone like the ride quality and handling?
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Old 10-21-2010, 04:15 PM   #1465
ansonowicz
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kptimpreza View Post
does putting on bigger tires mess with speedometer and gas mileage?
how does everyone like the ride quality and handling?
I dont' know about mileage, per se. But since my tires were about 8-10% larger than stock, then my speedometer was off by that same amount (verified with GPS and a friend in the same MY06 wrx next to me on stock tires). So since speed is affected, so is odometer...MPG calculations during fillup, etc.

As for handling, I tell people "it turns like a truck, but goes fast in a straight line like a subaru". acceleration is definitely affected since there's so much rotating mass.
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Old 10-22-2010, 03:54 PM   #1466
Charlie Sti
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I wish there were more rally roads in around phoenix
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Old 10-22-2010, 05:04 PM   #1467
ansonowicz
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Subiefest 2010. The dirt hill above Willow Springs Raceway.....the day after (drove about 150mi home), I suffered the notorious Oil Pickup Failure and my motor was destroyed





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Old 10-22-2010, 07:20 PM   #1468
wrxodee
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Quote:
Originally Posted by skunkman View Post
NICE!! I like that you're out of the ruts looking for freshies! Where in Utahr are you?
This is a picture of Downtoearth aka the low master of utah Lance. It was on a back road coming home from miller motorpark. We just got finished at the Le Mons races I forget the name of the road it was.


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Old 10-22-2010, 07:27 PM   #1469
wrxodee
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I just did some test fitting. What do you guys think? Im not done yet color or even the right rims. But I'm close
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Old 10-22-2010, 07:32 PM   #1470
cmpequeno
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what's the tire size?
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Old 10-22-2010, 09:48 PM   #1471
kickniteasy
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are those jeep rims?
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Old 10-23-2010, 09:08 PM   #1472
wrxodee
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kickniteasy View Post
are those jeep rims?
Quote:
Originally Posted by cmpequeno View Post
what's the tire size?
225/75/15

And yes sir they are the stock wheels off a 98 jeep wrangler
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Old 10-24-2010, 01:39 PM   #1473
kickniteasy
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Very nice! I thought I recognized them, my wife used to own a Cherokee when we first started dating.
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Old 10-25-2010, 11:45 AM   #1474
skunkman
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I think ride quality is fine on ATs and I've stiffened the suspension a touch and by replacing struts with KYB GR2/Excel G and springs with FOR springs.

I think my tire size (27" from stock 24") puts my Speedo and Odo off from 3-5% I'm going a touch faster than the speedo reads, but the car doesn't go that fast anymore (I think max is like 95mph, downhill with tailwind, I usually cruise 73 on hwy) anyway so its not a problem.

Handling is fine, but would prefer to upsize my sway bars to Outback bars for rally and search for disconnects for off-road and max suspension articulation...

Gas mileage is down a touch, but I still get from 19-22 city and 23-26 hwy (accounting for the 3-5% difference)

So though handling, ride quality and MPG are a little affected, the benefits WAY outweigh those minor costs...

Quote:
Originally Posted by kptimpreza View Post
does putting on bigger tires mess with speedometer and gas mileage?
how does everyone like the ride quality and handling?
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Old 10-25-2010, 11:48 AM   #1475
skunkman
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Charlie Sti View Post
I wish there were more rally roads in around phoenix
There is a group in Flag working on bringing rally to the people in AZ and their main contact/qualified guy is in Tucson...

AZ has great driving but needs more folks to make rally happen there.

So there's another reason to make the trip up the hill and get out of the valley hell. To go rally those northern AZ FS roads

*EDIT** Check here and get involved:http://www.azrally.com/

Last edited by skunkman; 10-25-2010 at 01:25 PM.
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