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Old 06-27-2007, 10:57 AM   #1
fast_xr4
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Default Warranty denied on STI Transmission (6MT) 4th gear grind

I have an '05 STi with 46k. 4th gear started grinding a few thousand miles ago. Fluid was changed by the dealer at 35k and level was fine.

Dealer got the car a week ago Monday and tore it apart after a quick trip around the block with the service tech to show him the grind. The rear also had an odd clunk when getting off an on the throttle (it ties in just wait).

Service Mgr explains they need to take pictures to send to the regional rep for warranty. They think there is excessive clutch wear. There are supposedly hot spots as well but the flash from the digital camera washed out any possibility of seeing hot spots. I feel like my car was scrutinized for issues unrelated to 4th gear. There is clutch dust and bits of clutch all over the place. It looks like an organic clutch not that I've ever seen one. There's still a decent amount of material. I explain that I did use it to put our boat in about 5 times which did require enough clutch slippage that I could smell the dust. No pics of the internals of the tranny as they never cracked it open which is what I brought the car in for. I don't see what a hammered on clutch even proves as far as fixing a 4th gear synchro.

Onto the rear clunk. They took some pics of the rear control arms which are gouged from the sway bar flipping around. The service manager and others at Subaru thinks it's from dumping the clutch or "launching" the car. I don't see how launching this car is going to damage the rear sway bar and surrounding suspension components.

I've never dumped the clutch. It's been drag raced 10 times. All were done agressively slipping the clutch. Most times I got the normal clunk from the rear everyone hears on a good launch. Sometimes it just bogged.

My opinion on 4th anyway is that my wife and I often skip 3rd without double-clutching which may have prematurely wore out this synchro. All other gears feel good and have never had a problem. Premature wear like this seems like it would at least get fixed once.

Anyone with experience on handling a warranty claim with SoA have advice? I'm thinking I should request copies of the pictures and any other pertinent paper work. I also didn't get a quote on the work if it isn't covered. For now I've agreed to get a new clutch and am not paying them to fix the tranny.

Subaru of America denied the claim. Said the car has no defect that is covered by warranty. They think the synchro is warn from skipping gears which is a product of the way it was driven. I can't believe they would deny this without even looking at the transmission. The car will likely be sold. I'm having the dealer put in a new clutch and I will upgrade the fluids. SoA clearly does not have customer satisfaction in mind. So much for a 60k mile warranty. May as well be a guaranteed piece of sh*%. Tommy Boy quote for those who are Chris Farley fans.

Buyer beware. Just because it's a sports car doesn't mean you can drive it like one or drive like any other car that can handle skipping a gear.
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Old 06-27-2007, 11:05 AM   #2
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I think you posted this in the wrong forum...
http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=64
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Old 06-27-2007, 11:12 AM   #3
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Towing a boat in an STi?

Drag raced 10 times?

Skipping 3rd?
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Old 06-27-2007, 11:23 AM   #4
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you cant skip gears?
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Old 06-27-2007, 11:24 AM   #5
fast_xr4
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I just posted to the denied warranty thread. Thanks for the tip. I'm still looking for advice related to the power train and how to warranty it through Subaru.

The car can tow 1000 lbs with a tongue weight of 100lbs. The boat was within the limit.

Skipping gears has been a common thing for me driving turbocharged cars for so long (15 years) you get used to boosting 2nd and gently dropping it in 4th at least around town. This is especially useful on a close ratio tranny.

As far as skipping gears it's better to double-clutch (i.e. let the clutch out in neutral) if you plan to skip gears to give the synchros a chance to match the speed.

Last edited by fast_xr4; 06-27-2007 at 12:30 PM.
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Old 06-27-2007, 01:14 PM   #6
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Post the pictures if you get copies of them. Also did you buy this car new?
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Old 06-27-2007, 01:26 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fast_xr4 View Post

My opinion on 4th anyway is that my wife and I often skip 3rd without double-clutching which may have prematurely wore out this synchro. All other gears feel good and have never had a problem. Premature wear like this seems like it would at least get fixed once.
Ok, either you have watched too many Fast and the Furious or don't realize that since the early 60's double clutching is not needed being you HAVE synchros. You double clutch because the transmission doesnt have synchro's in it which they all come with them now.
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Old 06-27-2007, 01:33 PM   #8
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Sounds like abuse to me. They have every reason to deny it and have physical evidence to support it. Sorry...
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Old 06-27-2007, 01:37 PM   #9
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drag racing once will be reason to deny your claim so deal with it.
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Old 06-27-2007, 01:38 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blackfang View Post
Ok, either you have watched too many Fast and the Furious or don't realize that since the early 60's double clutching is not needed being you HAVE synchros. You double clutch because the transmission doesnt have synchro's in it which they all come with them now.
Double clutching can increase the longevity of your syncros. No, you don't _have_ to double clutch, but if you do it correctly you can save wear on your transmission.
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Old 06-27-2007, 01:56 PM   #11
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Bought it new.

F&F. That's funny. Thanks Vin Diesel.
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Old 06-27-2007, 01:59 PM   #12
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i spoke with the regional service rep for all of northeast florida about the skipping gears issue, it is the cause of the grind, he recommended GM syncromesh fluid to fix it.... as far as the clutch spots go, thats bull****... every clutch has hot spots... its a clutch for godsakes...

as for dragracing... you have doomed yourself... the people on this forum are rediculous enough to probably call your dealor and report your posts, most of which are OT trolls... so dont waste your time.

IMO the only thing you should pay for is parts in this case..

excuse my language i just dont like seeing tranny warranty denied threads... on a performance bred machine...
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Old 06-27-2007, 02:05 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cooter05WRX View Post
drag racing once will be reason to deny your claim so deal with it.
Thanks for the laugh. Driving your car 1/4 mile in a safe controlled environment to measure performance is now grounds for denying a claim.

Sir we have record that you actually floored the vehicle repeatedly in the first five gears. Sorry but we can't warranty the power train of your $35k sports car which we promote by showing commercial where we rally race and terrorize country roads. Will you be attending the next Subaru sponsored auto-cross?

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Old 06-27-2007, 02:14 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by All4bSpinnin View Post
i spoke with the regional service rep for all of northeast florida about the skipping gears issue, it is the cause of the grind, he recommended GM syncromesh fluid to fix it.... as far as the clutch spots go, thats bull****... every clutch has hot spots... its a clutch for godsakes...

as for dragracing... you have doomed yourself... the people on this forum are rediculous enough to probably call your dealor and report your posts, most of which are OT trolls... so dont waste your time.

IMO the only thing you should pay for is parts in this case..

excuse my language i just dont like seeing tranny warranty denied threads... on a performance bred machine...
We'd only report him to dealerships if he tried to change his car back to stock and try to get it warrantied.

rIdiculous
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Old 06-27-2007, 02:15 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fast_xr4 View Post
Driving your car 1/4 mile in a safe controlled environment to measure performance is now grounds for denying a claim.
Why, yes it is. Welcome to the real world.
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Old 06-27-2007, 02:29 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fast_xr4 View Post
Thanks for the laugh. Driving your car 1/4 mile in a safe controlled environment to measure performance is now grounds for denying a claim.
Sounds about right to me. You probably don't remember the whole SCCA fiasco when the WRX first came out.
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Old 06-27-2007, 02:50 PM   #17
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Are you still running catless?
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Old 06-27-2007, 02:51 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fast_xr4 View Post
Thanks for the laugh. Driving your car 1/4 mile in a safe controlled environment to measure performance is now grounds for denying a claim.

Sir we have record that you actually floored the vehicle repeatedly in the first five gears. Sorry but we can't warranty the power train of your $35k sports car which we promote by showing commercial where we rally race and terrorize country roads. Will you be attending the next Subaru sponsored auto-cross?

maybe you should read all of your warrenty paperwork before you spew out anything.
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Old 06-27-2007, 03:25 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fast_xr4 View Post
Thanks for the laugh. Driving your car 1/4 mile in a safe controlled environment to measure performance is now grounds for denying a claim.

Sir we have record that you actually floored the vehicle repeatedly in the first five gears. Sorry but we can't warranty the power train of your $35k sports car which we promote by showing commercial where we rally race and terrorize country roads. Will you be attending the next Subaru sponsored auto-cross?

Yes it is. Guess what? Every manufacturer with a performance car will void it too. Welcome to the real world as it is called abuse.

I think you need to understand marketing of a vehicle verse actually racing it and abusing it/breaking something. There is a difference and if their wasn't I would be driving my cars on the sides of a building because I saw them do that in the commercial.
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Old 06-27-2007, 04:08 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blackfang View Post
Yes it is. Guess what? Every manufacturer with a performance car will void it too. Welcome to the real world as it is called abuse.

I think you need to understand marketing of a vehicle verse actually racing it and abusing it/breaking something. There is a difference and if their wasn't I would be driving my cars on the sides of a building because I saw them do that in the commercial.
but he kind of has a point.... doesnt it say in the commerical "professional on an enclosed course"... well thats what drag racing is... so its ok for a professional on an enclosed course to floor the sti...sounds like an advertisment lawsuit to me

all you have to do now is prove your a "professional"
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Old 06-27-2007, 04:09 PM   #21
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wcbjr - I think you spoke with the rep that denied my claim or other reps are saying the same thing about gm's additive.

blackfang - Driving a car on a paved road with timing lights is not abuse.
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Old 06-27-2007, 04:11 PM   #22
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I do believe somewhere in the manual it says that it is not recommended that anything be towed by the WRX or STi.
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Old 06-27-2007, 05:22 PM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fast_xr4 View Post
blackfang - Driving a car on a paved road with timing lights is not abuse.
Ok for one, I know exactly what happens at a dragstrip, been there, done that hundreds of times, so I know what it entails. The car will see high rpm shifts and fast shifts(unless you take your time granny shifting it because you are afraid to run your car) among other things, putting abnormal stress or abuse on an engine/drivetrain to gain the fastest ET possible. No matter what you feel, think or say, this is not normal driving conditions in which SOA or any other manufacturer has offered their warranty programs to be put in place for their vehicles.

In todays society, marketing is used to sell a product. In no way would a reasonable person expect that product to uphold, what they saw it for in the commercial. They are designed to attract a particular person or group of people. I see cars driven on the roof and sides of a building, so should i sue that company because that very car I buy, can't do that? I see Ford advertising their Mustang in a close course track, so should i expect their warranty, mind you that the warranty gives the guidelines regarding racing, to cover the repairs caused by me for racing.

How many drag cars run every race without breaking a part? None. Those parts they use are normally stronger and better than factory. You can not expect a car to withstand abuse and dragracing without breaking something. The NHRA race teams rebuild portions of their car (usually the engine, clutch, etc) after every run because they know those conditions put abuse on those parts.


I think you should not dragrace your car if you can't afford to fix your car!
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Old 06-27-2007, 05:23 PM   #24
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Quote:
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blackfang - Driving a car on a paved road with timing lights is not abuse.

Driving the car repeatedly to its limits is abuse.
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Old 06-27-2007, 05:24 PM   #25
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wcbjr - I think you spoke with the rep that denied my claim or other reps are saying the same thing about gm's additive.

What? I don't think you meant to quote me.
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