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Old 02-12-2007, 05:37 PM   #1276
sajohnson
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Default Good News

Quote:
Originally Posted by rane View Post
Called Subaru thrice and mentioned all of the above. The customer service rep. listened to everything and then told me that as I had over 100 k miles on my car, Subaru cannot do anything. So I am screwed out of $600 to get it fixed at the dealer. To make matters worse, the service manager at the dealer tells me that the loaner they gave me (due to delay on their part in getting the replacement parts in time) was a big favor to me & I should be thankful! Talk about customer service, especially since I am paying $600.

I think I am done with Subaru...my next car is definitely not going to be a Subie.
After a lot of hassle, SOA finally agreed to pay 100%.

I purchased my car in April of 2001, and it has over 119,000 miles on it.

IMO, you should keep on SOA. Unless you've already had the work done, or _must_ have it done right away, you should be able to get themm to pay.

I will post more on this later.
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Old 02-12-2007, 11:56 PM   #1277
sajohnson
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Default When is a Recall Necessary?

Check the following NHTSA link:

http://www-odi.nhtsa.dot.gov/cars/pr...ated%20Defect?

***When Is a Recall Necessary?

1. When a motor vehicle or item of motor vehicle equipment (including tires) does not comply with a Federal Motor Vehicle Safety Standard.
2. When there is a safety-related defect in the vehicle or equipment.

***What Is a Safety-Related Defect?

Generally, a safety-related defect is a problem that exists in a motor vehicle or item of motor vehicle equipment that:

1. poses an risk to motor vehicle safety, and
2. may exist in a group of vehicles of the same design or manufacture, or items of equipment of the same type and manufacture.

***Safety Defects Are Usually the Result of Inadequate Design or Manufacturing Error

Examples Include:

Steering components that break suddenly causing partial or complete loss of vehicle control.

Problems with fuel system components, particularly in their susceptibility to crash damage, that result in leakage of fuel and possibly cause vehicle fires.

Seems to me that this problem should have resulted in an immediate recall.

Last edited by sajohnson; 02-12-2007 at 11:59 PM. Reason: To add last line.
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Old 02-13-2007, 12:31 AM   #1278
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I have an 02 WRX Sedan that I purchased in April 2002, it has around 73,000 miles on it and I have noticed this problem since the first winter I had the car. Seeing as how I live in Chicago and we get cold weather every winter, it's a pretty big problem. It seems to be happening more and more as the car continues to age. I only had the standard warranty so I'm assuming the dealership will try and charge me for it. Right now the car is in the dealership having a new transmission mount put on it due to an accident I had and it wasn't repaired correctly (another place did the work, the Subaru dealership it's at is doing this under a supplemental damage claim through my insurance). I've got to go in to pick the car up tomorrow or Wednesday and I'm going to let them know about this issue. My gf has gotten into the car quite a few times and been really sickened by the strong smell as have I, I just didn't know it was this big of an issue as it used to only happen sporadically. I'm going to do whatever it takes to have this repaired for free. Thanks to everyone for posting their stories in here, this community is largely what makes owning a Subaru so much fun!
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Old 02-13-2007, 01:17 AM   #1279
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i went to subaru of gwinnett about a year ago with my high mileage 02 wagon, and they said since the warranty was up, they would charge me $600 to fix it. even after i printed this whole thread basically and showed it to them. so i just told them to shove it and left. so saturday i bought the parts myself for $56 and i just finished changing them out. it took like 4 hours and was t3h major sukc. the 2 of us working on it were jamming pretty good but its no fun but at least i saved my $540 worth and i'm selling the car to my bro in law so i don't want him to have to smell the fumes.

it had been getting alot worse each year until i couldn't stand it anymore, but now i gots a saabaru and selling the bugeye... i'll be sad to see it go, but glad it won't explode on him. !!!

i'll let you guys know how well it worked as soon as the temp drops some more

crisco
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Old 02-15-2007, 01:41 PM   #1280
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I have an 02 WRX wagon, bought in late 2002. I've got about 75K miles on it.
I have had the raw fuel smell intermittently during the last 2 or 3 winters.
Today is was REALLY bad, so I made an appointment at Madison Square Subaru (here in Huntsville, AL) for tomorrow morning.
I'll report back on what transpires.

They were very helpful with my 'clutch judder' issue a few years ago. I brought them a copy of the tsb and they replaced the parts at no charge. Hopefully they will do the same with this one.

I still am amazed that this has not been turned into a recall. I am even more amazed that this issue has not resulted in someone's subaru going up in flames.
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Old 02-15-2007, 08:09 PM   #1281
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Took mine in for the fuel smell/leak, dealer had it leak on them quoted me just over $400.00 for the repair.

I reminded them that I have the Gold Subaru Extended warranty that is still good for 25,000 more miles....they called SOA and I got DENIED!! "they don't cover those parts" was the answer I got so much for my wonderful $1250.00 extended warranty.

I'll be calling SOA for an explination of what my warranty covers.

That G35 is looking more and more appealing.

Last edited by blokespeed; 02-15-2007 at 08:51 PM.
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Old 02-15-2007, 08:37 PM   #1282
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blokespeed View Post
Took mine in for the fuel smell/leak, dealer had it leak on them quoted me just over $400.00 for the repair.

I reminded them that I have the Gold Subaru Extended warranty that is still go for 25,000 more miles....they called SOA and I got DENIED!! "they don't cover those parts" was the answer I got so much for my wonderful $1250.00 extended warranty.

I'll be calling SOA for an explination of what my warranty covers.

That G35 is looking more and more appealing.
That is one of the most outrageous stories I've heard about SOA screwing a customer.

Personally, I am going to do everything in my power to see that this problem becomes the subject of a recall.

I strongly suggest that everyone who owns a WRX with this problem contact the NHTSA. It is very easy to file a complaint. You can do it online or over the phone.

In this particular case, and any others where SOA has refused to pay 100% (and provide a free loaner car if requested) I would contact your local Attorney General's Office and/or take SOA to small claims court.

SOA's treatment of their customers and failure to do the right thing and pay to have this problem corrected amount to gross negligence and completely irresponsible corporate behavior.

SOA needs to be reigned in. I'll bet a small claims court judge would rip them a new one.

Don't let them jerk you around.
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Old 02-15-2007, 08:42 PM   #1283
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That's odd. We warrantied a repair under the SAS Gold coverage.
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Old 02-15-2007, 08:53 PM   #1284
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Im' not making this stuff up, I was clearly denied, tomorrow's conversation with SOA should be interesting especially as this is my first Subaru ever.
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Old 02-15-2007, 09:29 PM   #1285
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Did you physically talk to them, or did the dealer talk them in front of you?

Were you present for the convo?
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Old 02-15-2007, 10:30 PM   #1286
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No i was not present, I was at work, they had the car for 3 days.
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Old 02-15-2007, 10:32 PM   #1287
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My leak happened on a ski trip last winter in VT. The dealer told me it wasn't a recall so it wouldn't be fixed. My car was still in the 5/60 powertrain and they still denied me. I did it myself and one of the upper intake bolts broke on the way out. It was an experience.
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Old 02-15-2007, 10:48 PM   #1288
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blokespeed View Post
No i was not present, I was at work, they had the car for 3 days.
Youy might find that SOA might have a different answer. I wouldnt be suprised that the dealer is blowing smoke up your ass. I called SOA to find out where I can get this warrantied for a customer and they told me exactly what op code to use and everything.
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Old 02-15-2007, 10:52 PM   #1289
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I think your right, its a shame because the other dealer is on the other side of the city...but if thats what it takes to get it done... then so be it.
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Old 02-15-2007, 11:28 PM   #1290
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blackfang View Post
Youy might find that SOA might have a different answer. I wouldnt be suprised that the dealer is blowing smoke up your ass. I called SOA to find out where I can get this warrantied for a customer and they told me exactly what op code to use and everything.
The range of treatment people are getting from SOA is just amazing to me.

Some have cars that are under warranty and are denied.

Others, like myself, have cars that have over 100,000 miles and are being reimbursed 100% (of course I had to make several phone calls, but still...).

What's up with this?
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Old 02-16-2007, 03:03 AM   #1291
sajohnson
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Angry Bad News

I dropped my WRX off at Sharrett Sunday night.

Monday morning, they called us to say that SOA would only pay 50%.

As I posted above, SOA finally agreed to pay 100%, but only after my wife and I had driven back to Sharrett Monday afternoon to pick up the car (I wasn't going to pay a dime, let alone over $200).

Then, after we got back home, the service rep at Sharrett called me to say that they had ordered the wrong intake manifold gaskets. By then (about 4:30 pm) it was too late to get the gaskets by Tuesday. Whoops.

The order went in Tuesday and the gaskets were supposed to arrive Wednesday, but then we had a snow/ice storm Tuesday night into Wednesday morning. When I called Sharrett on Wednesday afternoon I kept getting voice mail -- apparently very few if any employees made it into work, even though even our little road was cleared before the storm even left the area . We're only 13 miles away and up on a mountain, so I'm not sure why they couldn't get to work (I did, with no trouble -- and I drive almost 50 miles one way).

Anyway, this morning (2-15-07) they called and said the gaskets were in, but they hadn't been unpacked yet. At 12:45 pm I called back and was told that the tech was working on my WRX (finally). This is supposed to be a 3.5 hour job, so I figured he could easily finish by COB at 5 or 5:30 pm. Nope. I get a call around 4:30 and the rep says that the tech has been working on my car all day (he claimed he even worked through lunch) and wasn't going to be able to get it done. This is a tech with 27 years' experience who only works on Subarus!

So, either a) I'm being lied to, or b) the book time for this job is _way_ off.

Because SOA jerked me around (instead of simply agreeing to pay 100% up front), the estimated completion time for this job went from Monday at noon, to Monday COB, to Tuesday morning, to Wednesday, to Thursday, and now I'm being told the tech will finish up tomorrow (Friday) morning. Had SOA agreed to pay 100% when the dealer first called, they would have discovered that they had the wrong gaskets in time to order them for Tuesday and with any luck, the repair would have been done by Tuesday evening. But noooo...

I can't help wondering how much of this is because I didn't just roll over and accept the 50% up front. It may not have anything to do with it, I don't know, but it just seems strange. For example, initially, on 2-6-07, when I set up the appointment to have the work done on Monday the 12th, the service rep asked if I wanted a loaner car. I told him that since we would be doing a night drop that wouldn't be possible and since the work was supposed to be done by noon, and I have Sunday and Monday off, it wasn't really necessary. Later, when we went back there on Monday thinking we were going to pick up the WRX, I said I'd like to go ahead and take them up on their offer of a loaner (since at that point the car was not going to be done until late morning the next day at the earliest, and I work on Tuesdays). I was told that, darn the luck, all of their loaner cars were being used. Sorry. Have a nice day.

Again, everything I've been told may be true, but it just seems funny that things began to go downhill as soon as I started giving SOA a hard time.

Anyone else have a similar experience?

Last edited by sajohnson; 02-16-2007 at 04:45 PM. Reason: add dates, clarification
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Old 02-16-2007, 03:51 PM   #1292
OFFdutyHERO
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that sucks ^ but that is the car buisness

anyway, I need to know what the diameter of the fuel line is from the factory. I am going to go to napa and just get a few feet of goodyear fuel line, and a few extra fuel line clamps. Then off with the manifold, and Im gona give plenty of extra fuel line where it is needed and double up on the clamps. Anyone know how much the factory gaskets for the mani will cost??

I was just told about a stainless steel coated rubber fuel line that attaches with normal fuel line clamps that is meant to resist streching and SHRINKING...the main cause for this issue. anyone use this before??

Edit, I know a REALLY good fix for this problem!!! perrin fuel line/rail kit!

Last edited by OFFdutyHERO; 02-16-2007 at 04:16 PM.
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Old 02-16-2007, 04:58 PM   #1293
sajohnson
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Originally Posted by OFFdutyHERO View Post
that sucks ^ but that is the car buisness

anyway, I need to know what the diameter of the fuel line is from the factory. I am going to go to napa and just get a few feet of goodyear fuel line, and a few extra fuel line clamps. Then off with the manifold, and Im gona give plenty of extra fuel line where it is needed and double up on the clamps. Anyone know how much the factory gaskets for the mani will cost??

I was just told about a stainless steel coated rubber fuel line that attaches with normal fuel line clamps that is meant to resist streching and SHRINKING...the main cause for this issue. anyone use this before??

Edit, I know a REALLY good fix for this problem!!! perrin fuel line/rail kit!
I picked up my WRX today -- four (4) days _after_ they promised it would be done.

To answer your question -- the "list" price for the gaskets is:

2 each #14075AA161 "Gasket Intake Collector" @$18.32 = $36.64
2 each #14035AA421 "Gasket Intake Manifold" @$10.69 = $21.38

They had to remove both the upper and lower manifolds.

(It turned out that they didn't have the _wrong_ gaskets, just not both sets).

The fuel line was #807707140 -- no mention of the size.

Maybe wherever you go to buy the hose will be able to look it up -- or if you give the number above to a Subaru parts dept. they might be able to get more info. Can you believe that this little section of hose is $25.86?!!

This job ended up taking a Subaru mechanic with 27 years' experience _far_ longer than the 3.5 hour book time. You might want to think twice about doing this yourself, especially since it seems SOA will pay for the repair if you press the issue.

If you do decide to do it, there was a post earlier in this thread by someone who did a repair similar to what you are describing -- you might look for that.
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Old 02-16-2007, 07:51 PM   #1294
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I called SOA today and they said there is NO reason why my warranty plan would not cover the fuel leak problem, he then called the dealership to confirm this and was straight to the point on every question.

Dealer has ordered the parts and I am waiting to reschedule.

I am worried that they will not do the job thoroughly as they seemed as if they didn't want to handle the issue in the first place.

I can only hope that this goes right.
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Old 02-16-2007, 08:31 PM   #1295
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blokespeed View Post
I called SOA today and they said there is NO reason why my warranty plan would not cover the fuel leak problem, he then called the dealership to confirm this and was straight to the point on every question.

Dealer has ordered the parts and I am waiting to reschedule.

I am worried that they will not do the job thoroughly as they seemed as if they didn't want to handle the issue in the first place.

I can only hope that this goes right.
You don't say. Now I would be asking ther writer why he lied to you.
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Old 02-16-2007, 08:40 PM   #1296
sajohnson
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blokespeed View Post
I called SOA today and they said there is NO reason why my warranty plan would not cover the fuel leak problem, he then called the dealership to confirm this and was straight to the point on every question.

Dealer has ordered the parts and I am waiting to reschedule.

I am worried that they will not do the job thoroughly as they seemed as if they didn't want to handle the issue in the first place.

I can only hope that this goes right.
Glad to hear it!

What I found out about the 'book time' on the repair is very interesting, and might help explain some dealers' reluctance to do warranty repairs:

When I picked up my car today, one of the guys at Sharrett told me that there are actually at least two (2) different labor time estimates for a repair -- the first (and most common) is the "Mitchell" book time. That is the standard amount of labor time that they charge for repairs when the customer is paying the tab.

Then there is a "special" book that lists how many hours SOA will pay for. As you might imagine, this amount of time is much less than what is listed in the Mitchell book.

So -- this would explain a dealer's reluctance to do warranty repairs, and helps to explain the difference in the quotes NASIOC members have received.

If I was told the truth, it took a Subie tech who has 27 years of experience at least double the SOA estimated time to do this repair. So not only does the service department make less, the tech gets screwed also because ordinarily a job that Mitchell says takes 3.5 hours might really take only 2 or 2.5 hours. So a tech might work for 8 hours but get paid for 12 or even 16.

This is starting to make more sense...
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Old 02-16-2007, 10:04 PM   #1297
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Wow, my tech that has less than 20 years did it in 4 hours today.
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Old 02-16-2007, 10:35 PM   #1298
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blackfang View Post
Wow, my tech that has less than 20 years did it in 4 hours today.
Like I said, _if_ I was told the truth.

Who knows if anything I was told was true?

Maybe they had the gaskets all along.

They might have had a loaner car available.

It's possible that my car wasn't really in the shop at 12:45 pm Thursday like I was told. Or maybe it was, but nobody was working on it. Or the tech was working on other jobs also -- kind of like contractors who juggle several construction projects.

I'm really not sure. I'm inclined to believe them, but you never know. Perhaps there were other ("Mitchell" time) jobs that they gave priority to.

As I said in a post above, it seemed like when I didn't roll over and accept SOA's first offer of 50% things started to go sour (although that really shouldn't concern the dealership much at all).

The tech who did the work wasn't there when I picked up the WRX. He is supposed to call me at home on Monday. I'm planning to ask him why the job took so long. One reason may be that -- according to the service advisor -- this is the first one of these jobs they've done (hard to believe since Hagerstown gets pretty darn cold).
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Old 02-16-2007, 10:46 PM   #1299
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blackfang View Post
You don't say. Now I would be asking ther writer why he lied to you.
I forgot to mention that the confusion was the writer looked up the rubber hose and not the fuel line to be covered.

The guy from SOA was great...he wasn't playing around ,he knew all the facts about this situation, he was a straight shooter!
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Old 02-16-2007, 11:21 PM   #1300
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Default Another "me too"

I have a 2002 WRX. Only 47k miles but past warranty. I bought it new (in fact, I ordered it with my choice of options and waited a couple months for delivery). I'm in Kentucky and the weather has been in the 10-30 degree F range for at least a couple weeks. I'm getting the gas smell like what has been described in hundreds of posts here and other forums. I'm joining the crowd. Ya-hoo. Big fun. Shoot me now please.

I already ordered the replacement pipe and rubber hose from an out of state Subaru dealer that is (even with shipping) about $20 cheaper than my local dealer's quote (about $65 shipped to the door). I plan on doing the fix myself mostly because I don't trust too many other folks with my car, but also because I don't want to shell out the cash. I have not contacted SOA yet, but I will before I get started on fixing it myself. If I am one of the apparently random ones to get cooperation from SOA on funding the fix at my dealer, I will probably just let them do it anyway.

I'll post back after I talk to SOA. Fully expect disappointment.
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