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Old 10-30-2007, 09:34 PM   #1
Toolz
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Default MY02 OSECU Stage1.. I think I need WG arm adjustment ?

I loaded the stage 1 map on today and did a some logging, this log was the only one that produced anything above 14psi.. others with 13.6-13.9. I believe I should be hitting 15psi, or just over on this map?. My WGDC is in the mid 70s so I was thinking that I need to adjust the WG arm a turn or increase the WGDC?
From my limited experence so far I think the log looks ok, but would like some comments.

Edit: Can't upload attachments here

Here is my thread on Enginuity:
http://www.xpttuning.com/osecuroms/v...410eda3a6556a8

log file is attached there.



Thanks!
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Old 10-30-2007, 10:01 PM   #2
Broxma
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You can try to adjust the WG arm first if you want, and as I pointed out, be cautious and judicious with any increases in WGDC. Try and think of what will happen if things go wrong so you can be prepared for them.

Start small, stay small. Work your way to the target. Also be aware that hitting target boost in one gear may have you over target in the next.

/Brox
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Old 10-31-2007, 02:05 PM   #3
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Thanks for that info, and yes you are correct, I did some more loggin in 4th and 5th and I am hitting 15.0-15.3psi at WOT in 4th and 5th. So I just need to dial in a tad more boost in 3rd. I am only getting 14psi +/- .3
Interesting that some of the targets for this map are 16ish psi, although the map is not setup to achive those.?
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Old 11-03-2007, 12:13 AM   #4
controler
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The map is setup to hit 16.4 psi, and it will hit it if your wastegate is adjusted properly. My car stock was running only 12.5. I adjusted the arm so far it hit just past my target of 15.5, sometimes over, but the ECU would then pull WGDC and even it out.

I ran this map for a while, and just to let you know the timing is fairly agressive. My IAM was most of the time at 16, but I would get some knock around 5800-6800 rpms.
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Old 11-03-2007, 12:36 AM   #5
Broxma
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Another FYI. The Boost target map on the stage 1 from OSECU seems really high IMO. I don't have my car running that much boost on my stage 2 maps in most cases.

17+ PSI Stock/Stage 1 is too high for me to feel comfortable with. When I flashed the stage 1 map to an 03 it knocked like crazy.

And I ran your your CSV in DLL and came back with 188hp/199tq.

/Brox
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Old 11-03-2007, 11:45 AM   #6
Toolz
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Thanks, I have already adjusted the targets to 15.47 instead of the 16.4, I am not going to adjust my wgdc or arm as I am hitting high 14psi in 3rd and 15 to 15.5psi in 4th and 5th at WOT. I am happy with the difference over stock, and my IAM has never moved off 16 and knock is always positive 5 to 11 range. So I think it is running happy.
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Old 11-03-2007, 11:46 AM   #7
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What is this "DLL" you quoted?
Thx
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Old 11-03-2007, 12:04 PM   #8
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I couldn't use the timing maps on the OSECUroms stage 1 map when I was using it on the stock turbo, knocked like crazy... even clearly audible knock that I could hear with the windows rolled down, yikes. I reverted back to stock timing maps (the load scale is not changed on the stage one map, so it's an even copy/paste). Had to tweak the WG duty cycle map a little and play around with the WG gate arm adjustmenta bit to get boost to stay stable... not much change, but still had to tune it to my car. With those changes it ran nicely, but off the shelf I wasn't very happy with it at all.
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Old 11-03-2007, 02:23 PM   #9
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jhargis, you would have been able to use the timing maps if you lived in Canada like Toolz, look at his intake temps (52-55 *f) versus Cali intake temps probably around 90*+ that makes a big difference. Not only that Toolz may have better gas there as well....

Just my 2 cents

On another not, I've tunned by buddies 02' WRX 2.0L and I could only get about 11 degrees of total timing in mid range (at night no less) versus Toolz 13 (for a second). looking at his log, looks like the TD04 is maxed out around 200g/s on the mass air, cause that all I got on the 2.0L WRX as well.

Toolz, time to get a vf34 for more power...
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Old 11-03-2007, 03:36 PM   #10
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Haha, yeah southern California gasoline is not renowned for it's ability to resist knock with the special reduced-smog gasoline cocktail we get. And I was also tuning that at year+ ago in May when it was in the high 80s/90s F outside. I always have to keep crappy gas and 105-110 degree peak summer temperatures in mind when I do anything to my tuning. I'd rather just settle with a safe across-the-board tune than have to flash on new maps seasonally. And yeah, the stock turbo is very energetic in the midrange, but it runs out of breath fairly quickly compared to my vf-39. It's not too bad with the osecuroms vf series map, but even then I get some very occasional on throttle negative KC, so I'll probably just rescale the stock timing map to fit the load range and revert back to it so that I don't have to worry about knock when it's warm out.

Stupid crappy gasoline and semi-desert location.
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Old 11-03-2007, 06:40 PM   #11
Broxma
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DLL=Data Log Lab
Road Dyno software.

On the total timing issue that Icslow raised, I am able to get about 17-18 degrees in the middle RPM's with more on the top end, as much as 23-27 degrees. No idea why you can hit a max of 11.


/Brox

Last edited by Broxma; 11-03-2007 at 06:51 PM.
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Old 11-04-2007, 01:10 AM   #12
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Yea just looked at his tune again don't have his log, I believe I did get around
14-15 degrees in mid range taping up to around 22-23 degrees in top end. He's still on stock top mount and has high milage, so I didn't want to push it too much. Tunned it to clean up power and get a good base map for 2.0L WRX's.
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Old 11-04-2007, 05:59 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by icslowmo View Post
Yea just looked at his tune again don't have his log, I believe I did get around
14-15 degrees in mid range taping up to around 22-23 degrees in top end. He's still on stock top mount and has high milage, so I didn't want to push it too much. Tunned it to clean up power and get a good base map for 2.0L WRX's.
14-15 degrees at peak torque is a good amount of timing- that's what you typically see on 93 octane on the east coast (with a stock turbo). Are you running that on 91?
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Old 11-05-2007, 02:20 AM   #14
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On 93 octane, the lowest timing I have at WOT is 16.5 around 4500rpm and it climbs to 26 around 7K.

I'm still trying to figure out why my IAM and advance stay the same but my KC is dropping. No knock, IAM-16, advance is 9.14, but KC drops from 9 to 6 then down to 4.5. I'm so confused.

/Brox
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Old 11-05-2007, 10:06 AM   #15
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If your KC is dropping and you have it programmed for a higher number than you are getting, then you are knocking, or at the very least, your ECU is detecting engine noise which is making it unhappy.

IAM doesn't have to drop if you are knocking. It depends on how the knock learning ranges are set up. It may be that your car won't change the IAM based on knock at WOT.
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Old 11-05-2007, 02:51 PM   #16
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Agreed Mike, but no timing is being pulled either. My entire advance map is 9.14 above 1.00 EL and my timing continues to rise even with a drop in KC.

My Advance never drops below 9.14, IAM is always 16, Timing goes from 16.5 to 27 and the only thing that changes is the KC. Whats strange is how it does it. It first drops to 6 or 7 for a few ticks, then drops to 4.5 and stays there until redline. I have found a table that pulls timing about 2 degrees which would correspond with my KC mathematically, but I think it's based on coolant temp which makes no sense.

Sorry about the hijack. I'm going to continue to hunt the problem.

/Brox
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Old 11-05-2007, 03:06 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Broxma View Post
My Advance never drops below 9.14, IAM is always 16, Timing goes from 16.5 to 27 and the only thing that changes is the KC. Whats strange is how it does it. It first drops to 6 or 7 for a few ticks, then drops to 4.5 and stays there until redline.
KC is the advance map value corrected for perceived knock that is then added to base timing. It is corrected by rough (IAM), feedback, and fine correction. If you use Enginuity's logger with the latest defs, you can log feedback and fine correction (obviously IAM as well). There is NO other correction to KC except the above. Any other compensation to timing, such as IAT, ECT, per cylinder, etc. would be reflected when you log total timing ('ignition timing'), not KC.
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Old 11-05-2007, 07:28 PM   #18
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Great discussion guys, hijack away!...I am leaning lots here
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Old 11-05-2007, 07:31 PM   #19
Broxma
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I knew that but hadn't put it into practice yet. I am logging Rough correction while I tune my MAF tonight to see if I can find where things are going wrong.
I had figured that using the KC formula I would see a change in either IAM or timing if KC fell off knowing full well about the rough correction tables. I just never logged them.


/Brox
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Old 11-05-2007, 08:01 PM   #20
Toolz
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I am seeing -0.35 to -2.11 in my Fine learning knock correction but usually at 40-60% throttle, Engine loads around 1.5. I have some logs that show -1.05 fine correction at WOT but only brief around 3-3.5Krpmm.

I would think that some fine correction is ok?
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