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Old 11-06-2007, 09:42 PM   #1
BIGSKYWRX
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Default Is there a reason Subaru specifies a non-cross tire rotation?

Both my 02 and 04 WRX show a same side front/rear tire rotation. Most sites (including tirerack) recommend a cross or cross variation for AWD.

Thoughts?
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Old 11-06-2007, 11:19 PM   #2
Patrick Olsen
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I hate you.

Oh, wait... You probably meant thoughts about tire rotation, huh?
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Old 11-06-2007, 11:29 PM   #3
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this has been one of those unanswered questions (at least for me )
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Old 11-06-2007, 11:43 PM   #4
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You mean other than it not working for directional tread?
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Old 11-07-2007, 12:34 AM   #5
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...it likely has something to do with altering the direction of rotation of the tires
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Old 11-07-2007, 01:06 AM   #6
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I cross-rotated mine when I first got the car and caused a wicked vibration. No idea why though.
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Old 11-07-2007, 05:22 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 1320Fastback View Post
I cross-rotated mine when I first got the car and caused a wicked vibration. No idea why though.

As your tires wear down you need to get them rebalanced. It is possible that they had worn down enough for you to notice or possibly threw a wheel weight. It sounds like it is taken care of now though.
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Old 11-07-2007, 05:31 AM   #8
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It really would depend on the tire as to how they can be rotated.

1) Non-Directional Tires can be moved to any corner of the vehicle, so you could do a X-Pattern or Swap Front & Rear. - Example Bridgestone RE92's

2) Directional Tires can only (well...I guess technically SHOULD only) be moved along the same side of the vehicle to keep the directional pattern rotating correctly. - Example Bridgestone RE-01R's, Goodyear Eagle F1 GS-D3, Michelin Pilot Sports, etc.

3) Then there are tires that are marked Inside/Outside only. As long as these tires are setup properly you can move these around the same as the Non-Directional Tires. - Example - Falken RT-615's
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Old 11-07-2007, 10:34 AM   #9
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I guess I'm curious why they advise the RE92 to be rotated on the same side- clearly a non-directional tire
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Old 11-07-2007, 12:46 PM   #10
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I think they wanted to play safe and recommend rotation that works for all kinds of tires (symmetric, assymetric, directional and non-directional).

Krzys
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Old 11-07-2007, 02:18 PM   #11
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I thought there was some phenomenon that a tire broken in rotating in a specific direction aligns the rubber bonds for that direction. If you flip it around, then you go "against the grain" which can lead to things like feathering.

Mind you this was just what a mechanic told me, and although mechanics have good practical experience, they are NOT engineers and rarely ever understand the science behind it.

Last edited by chimchimm5; 11-07-2007 at 02:24 PM.
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Old 11-07-2007, 03:50 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by krzyss View Post
I think they wanted to play safe and recommend rotation that works for all kinds of tires (symmetric, assymetric, directional and non-directional).

Krzys
that certainly would make sense

^ interesting, never had heard that before- I guess it's in the realm of possibilities, although you would think someone like tirerack would speak to that phenomenon?????
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Old 11-07-2007, 04:00 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chimchimm5 View Post
I thought there was some phenomenon that a tire broken in rotating in a specific direction aligns the rubber bonds for that direction. If you flip it around, then you go "against the grain" which can lead to things like feathering.

Mind you this was just what a mechanic told me, and although mechanics have good practical experience, they are NOT engineers and rarely ever understand the science behind it.
This doesn't make much sense if you consider that the forces in tires act both ways (braking and acceleration).

My guess as to why they don't mention cross-rotation is to simplify the manual (one rotation pattern for ALL tire types).
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Old 11-07-2007, 06:53 PM   #14
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i have asked subaru experts and high-performance tire experts-there is no good reason-no safety issue-rotate LF/RR and RF/LR for max tire life and least stress on diffs
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Old 11-07-2007, 07:50 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chimchimm5 View Post
a tire broken in rotating in a specific direction aligns the rubber bonds for that direction
pretty much not going to happen for a crosslinked polymer...
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Old 11-07-2007, 08:59 PM   #16
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My guess is that because cross rotation should be done with directional tires, Subaru chose to go with one method in the owner's manual that can work for all cases. It's safer than giving different procedures based on tire type and taking the risk that someone will do it wrong.

I cross rotate my nondirectional PZero's and everything is peachy.
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Old 11-07-2007, 10:00 PM   #17
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If you have a directional tire like F1gsd3 wet/dry max performance tires rotating the wrong way, you will know it during your first drive, and even faster in a heavy rain. Probably every one on Nasioc knows to look for the directional arrow on the tire, if there is one. If it is there, don't cross rotate the wheels. The worst possible case is to have all the arrows pointing in the wrong direction.
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Old 11-07-2007, 10:14 PM   #18
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....i worked for Goodyear in the mid 80's......when the Gatorbacks came out.....we intentionally mounted some 'backwards' just to see wassupwidat......

dry was just a bit less responsive than when in correct rotation...

wet was
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Old 12-24-2007, 10:35 PM   #19
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I could swear I read somewhere that the final curing that happens when you first use a tire sets an alignment/layering of the steel belts and rubber bonding - and that later running the tire in reverse would disrupt that. I can't find that information anywhere

From Tire Rack:
http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tirete...&currentpage=5
"
Four (4) Tire Rotation

What tire rotation pattern should be followed? The Tire & Rim Association has identified three traditional rotation patterns covering most vehicles (equipped with non-directional tires and wheels which are the same size and offset).
  • On front-wheel drive cars, rotate the tires in a forward cross pattern (Figure A) or the alternative X pattern (Figure B)
  • On rear-wheel or four-wheel drive vehicles, rotate the tires in a rearward cross pattern (Figure C) or the alternative X pattern (Figure B)
Today’s performance tire and wheel trends have provided the need for two additional tire rotation patterns.
  • The "Front-to-Rear" (Figure D) pattern may be used for vehicles equipped with the same size directional wheels and/or directional tires.
  • A "Side-to-Side" (Figure E) pattern may be used for vehicles equipped with different sized non-directional tires and wheels on the front axle compared to the rear axle.
If the last two rotation patterns do not provide even wear, dismounting, mounting and rebalancing will be necessary to rotate the tires.
Vehicles that use different sized directional wheels and tires, and/or wheels with different front and rear offsets with directional tires will require dismounting, mounting, and rebalancing to rotate tires.
"

So, it's obviously not the tire that would keep us from cross-rotation, unless it was directional.
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Old 12-25-2007, 10:02 AM   #20
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I've always cross rotated the RE070's. Driver-front always gets worn faster from on/off ramps. Every weekend after auto-x, I'd clean/inspect every tire and rotate based on wear trends.

Seemed to work fine for me.

also. I remember that only the 2 front tires were dynamically ballanced. They had weights inside and out. The rears only had weights on the inside. I do remember seing this on other new STI's.

makes me wonder, although I don't know 100%

E
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Old 12-26-2007, 02:54 PM   #21
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I had this explained to me long ago. Bias ply tires have the cords wrapped around the circumference of the tire. If you flip the tire around it has no effect on the cords. However, radial tires wrap around the sides of the tires. Early/crappy radial tires can have the cords "bunch up" over time (can create bulges). Flipping the tire around wreaks all kinds of havok and can even cause a blowout. Newer radial tires are probably better, but as far as I know, that's where the original idea of just rotating radials front-rear came about. You can always dismount and remount the tires to switch sides. I used to stress out about this until I realized that proper alignment and inflation (adjusted for my driving style and environment) gave me even tire wear and there was no point in cross rotations...
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