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Old 01-26-2002, 09:41 AM   #1
Bagheera85
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Member#: 13365
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Okinawa, Japan
Vehicle:
1991 Legacy Wagon GT
Dark Red

Default 11 hours, new timing belt, still no start.

Ok.. I spent 11 hours today at the auto garage working on my car. First, I let the engine cool off while I changed the rear diff fluid. That was a challenge in itself to get the fluid into the diff. Then I went about tackling the timing belt. I think I took it off and put it on 5 times today. It cranks, but won't start. The last 2 times we took it off and put it back on, it sounded like it wanted to for a second, then just cranked. I was thinking maybe it's slipping or something. But please.. IDEAS. I have to work tomorrow, so monday I go back and work on it. I really don't want to spend 11 hours there again.

And oh yea, it's a '91 Legacy 2.0 turbo.. and after looking at Haynes manual pictures and my engine, it looks like the 2.5 DOHC.
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Old 01-26-2002, 10:36 AM   #2
HIHO
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Location: Hopefully on a nice single track.
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BD5; family sedan
that just wooped your ass

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Quote:
And oh yea, it's a '91 Legacy 2.0 turbo.. and after looking at Haynes manual pictures and my engine, it looks like the 2.5 DOHC.
I don't really understand this statement?

Are you sure you have the timing set correctly? If the belt is slipping you have a big problem. There is more to installing a timing belt than just replacing the old one and installing the new. I would check the timing first to see if your on center.
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Old 01-26-2002, 06:09 PM   #3
Apexboy
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Join Date: Sep 1999
Location: Bellevue, Wa. US
Vehicle:
1998 Legacy GT
Granite Pearl

Unhappy oooh, be careful on this one.

HIHO is right. You remember this one. There's ALOT more to changing Timing belts than just swapping it with the new one. You have to take into account the tension of the belt too. If it's too loose, then you risk of the teeth jumping. I watched my professional mechanic put it on, and I can see the reason why it costed me $300 for it. Unless you REALLY know what you're doing, I would suggest you take it to a knowledgeable place, or you'll end up spend ALOT more that you expect.
For me, the bolt that held the tensioner broke due to fatigue, and broke off the bolt which resulted in the belt coming forward, burning an imprint of the belt track on the plastic belt cover, and skipping the timing belt, and all hell broke loose. (no pun intended) I ended up with two bent valves, and a towing fee of about $300. Total damage was around $1300. Hell, you can buy a nice used engine for that kind of price tag.

So.... before you start incurring major damages to your engine, don't skimp on the $$$ for this. You'll be kicking yourself wondering why you didn't have it done professionally later.

My 2 cents.

Rich
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Old 01-26-2002, 06:17 PM   #4
hotrod
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Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: 13.239@102.85 @ 5800 ft on 13T
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2002 Impreza WRX

Default If it sounds like it is trying to start

I saw this once with my 1.8 L 88 GL.

Check to make sure you don't have one cam 180 degrees out of phase.

These engines don't like to run on only 2 cylinders.

Don't ask how I know


Larry
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Old 01-26-2002, 09:45 PM   #5
Bagheera85
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1991 Legacy Wagon GT
Dark Red

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Ok.. how do I make sure nothing is 180 degrees out? And the 2.0/2.5 statement, I meant that looking at the pictures, it looks like the stateside 2.5 instead of the 2.2. Has an intake and exhaust cam on each side.. 4 cams total. Also.. to verify, is the number one cylinder the left front while looking at the engine from the front of the car?
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Old 01-26-2002, 10:54 PM   #6
hotrod
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2002 Impreza WRX

Default have no manuals for your engine but ---

I don't have any manuals for your engine, but if it is the same as the wrx the cylinders on the "cars right side" left side of engine as you look at it from the front, should be odd numbered, ie front cylinder is #1, rear cylinder #3.

The cylinders on "the cars left side" right side of engine as you look at it from the front should be even numbered, so front cylinder is #2, and rear cylinder is #4.

Firing order on WRX is 1 -- 3 -- 2 -- 4

If your car has distributor ignition, just crank the engine so the rotor points at the plug wire for the cylinder you are checking, and then verify the cam postion.

What you have to do is verify that both valves are closed on each cylinder when it tries to fire the spark plug. (actually all you have to do is verify one cylinder on each bank) if the valves are closed you have the cams phased correctly.

If The exhaust valve is closing and the intake valve is opening when the rotor points at the ignition wire for the cylinder, you are 180 degrees out, the spark is arriving at the end of the exhaust stroke and beginning of the intake stroke.

Not sure of the easiest way to verify the valve postions on a subaru engine, in the car. On a V8 you just pop the valve cover and watch the valves move. Because of the flat layout of the subaru it will be more difficult.

If you understand the process you should be able to figure out a way with the help of your manual. Sorry I can't be more specific, I've done this on other engines, but when I had the cam problem on the 88 subaru, I had to get to work and just, got a ride from a friend, and towed it to a mechanic and he told me what he did when I came back for the car.

Then all you have to check is to be sure the belts are not off a tooth.

Hope this helps?
If someone else knows a quick and easy way to verify the valve position, without popping a valve cover, please jump in.

Larry
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Old 01-26-2002, 11:22 PM   #7
Bagheera85
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Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Okinawa, Japan
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1991 Legacy Wagon GT
Dark Red

Default

It's direct ignition.. no spark plug wires, no ditrubitor. The coil wires disappear under the intake manifold. And I used a compression tester to check for the compression stroke on the number one cylinder(engine's right side front) to get TDC. Which it is at. Ok.. so if I have it on the number one cylinder at TDC, and I lined everything up.. what's going on? Makes no sense. The LAST time I put the belt on, it cranked for a second, sounded like it wanted to start, the engine hesitated in it's rotation, then just kept on cranking with nothing.
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Old 01-26-2002, 11:30 PM   #8
hotrod
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Location: 13.239@102.85 @ 5800 ft on 13T
Vehicle:
2002 Impreza WRX

Default

If everything is right, every 180 deg of crankshaft rotation the next cylinder in the firing order should be on the compression stroke.

If you have it on TDC on cylinder #1, put the compression tester in cylinder #2 and verify that it is on compression stroke with a single 360 degree rotation of the crankshaft.

If that checks out your cams are in phase, so you can focus on other possible issues.

Larry
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