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Old 12-20-2007, 02:43 PM   #1
skoobidoo
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Default Necessary to use locktight on clutch/flywheel bolts?

I was curious if anyone uses locktight on their flywheel/clutch pressure plate bolts? I installed a new clutch and flywheel a couple weeks ago and have been wondering if I should have used locktight on the pressure plate bolts since they only torque to 12-13 ft/lbs. I used a write up from here and also the Subaru shop manual and there was no mention of locktight in either one.

Also, Ive done clutch/flywheel changes on other cars and never had to use locktight on the bolts but I've read in a couple posts on here that it was mentioned.

Thoughts?
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Old 12-20-2007, 03:40 PM   #2
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I have always used red loctite sparingly. Some thing I like to do on bolts that I know I wont be able to get to once every thing is assembled.
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Old 12-20-2007, 04:05 PM   #3
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I didn't use locktite on my flywheel and had one of the bolts come loose and fall out. I would definitely recommend using locktite.
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Old 12-20-2007, 04:40 PM   #4
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You don't HAVE to. Make sure your bolts are in good shape and torque them to spec... Most stories probably involved people not paying attention and either not using a torque wrench or not tightening all of the bolts completely in the first place. That being said, it's never a bad idea to use a little locktite on bolts that will be a PITA to get to later. It's like $5.99, so why not?
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Old 12-20-2007, 04:57 PM   #5
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Ok, thanks guys. Hopefully everything holds up alright. Im not too worried about it but wanted to see what everyone else thinks.

Next time I'll use some for peace of mind.
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Old 12-21-2007, 12:32 AM   #6
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I've never used loctite on flywheel-> crankshaft bolts, or on pressure plate to flywheel bolts. Never had on back out. But I also tighten them in the proper sequence. But I guess I couldnt hurt, except maybe the next time you go to take them off it might be a little more difficult. But I'm on the fence anyway.

~Josh~
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Old 12-21-2007, 09:47 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ballitch View Post
I've never used loctite on flywheel-> crankshaft bolts, or on pressure plate to flywheel bolts. Never had on back out. But I also tighten them in the proper sequence. But I guess I couldnt hurt, except maybe the next time you go to take them off it might be a little more difficult. But I'm on the fence anyway.

~Josh~
Ya, I think the majority of the people that have them back out probably dont torque them properly in the criss-cross pattern.
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Old 04-11-2009, 09:32 PM   #8
1GR8WRX
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Exclamation Use new bolts? and locktite?

I ran into an issue a few weeks ago (where I was having two issues with my clutch:

1. Full clutch pedal press would not let me get into gear when idling (gears grinding, synchros spinning up)

2. When the pedal was released, there was a horrendous noise coming from the clutch/flywheel

Turns out it was the flywheel bolts. Many of them came loose within 1500 miles. One backed out enough to rub against the clutch plate:




Notice what the backed-out bolt did to the clutch plate - it wore some of the metal down next to the springs.

I followed the torque specs in the service manual to the tee, including the bolting order. However, I used the original bolts/washers (75k miles) and did not use locktite. I'm going to torque things down more (alot more...) and use locktite this time.

Anyone have any clue as to why this happened? Any thoughts if, say, doubling the torque will be a bad thing?

Thanks,
1GR8WRX
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Old 04-12-2009, 02:47 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 1GR8WRX View Post
I followed the torque specs in the service manual to the tee, including the bolting order. However, I used the original bolts/washers (75k miles) and did not use locktite. I'm going to torque things down more (alot more...) and use locktite this time.

Anyone have any clue as to why this happened? Any thoughts if, say, doubling the torque will be a bad thing?

Thanks,
1GR8WRX
The bold: If they were locking washers or crush washers, that's why they backed out. If they were regular old spacer washers that don't lock or crush, then it might be your torque wrench. Do you always set it to 0 when you're finished using it? Have you had it calibrated in the past 2 years? If it's brand new or has just been recalibrated, and you always reset it to 0, then I have no idea.

The red: If you overtorque those bolts, don't be surprised if/when some or all of the bolts break while you're driving, due to vibration, or you deform the flywheel, or plate it bolts to. Seriously, overtorquing things is a bad idea.
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Old 04-12-2009, 01:11 PM   #10
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Default Thanks

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chi_San View Post
The bold: If they were locking washers or crush washers, that's why they backed out. If they were regular old spacer washers that don't lock or crush, then it might be your torque wrench. Do you always set it to 0 when you're finished using it? Have you had it calibrated in the past 2 years? If it's brand new or has just been recalibrated, and you always reset it to 0, then I have no idea.
Thanks for the feedback. I was mistaken - those bolts don't actually have washers, just a flange that looked like a washer. As for the torque wrench, it was brand new when I built the engine a few months ago. For this torque range (~70Nm), I use a wrench that is of the bar-type (i.e., not ratcheting). If I recall, calibration involves bending the rod back to zero it out. Haven't had to do that yet.

Quote:
The red: If you overtorque those bolts, don't be surprised if/when some or all of the bolts break while you're driving, due to vibration, or you deform the flywheel, or plate it bolts to. Seriously, overtorquing things is a bad idea.
I agree - I don't want to overtorque them, but I also don't want them to fall out again . Perhaps the main issue was that the bolts were reused. I've already ordered new ones, and I'm probably going to use locktite - doesn't seem like it can hurt.
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Old 04-12-2009, 04:03 PM   #11
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Yeah, those bolts might have been weird or something, might be a good idea to get some OEM replacements from Subaru or something.
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Old 04-12-2009, 04:41 PM   #12
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do you guys recommend getting new bolts/hardware for the flywheel and pressure plate bolts? or the original ones are ok to re-use? 95k miles on mine.
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Old 04-12-2009, 05:04 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fastwrx25 View Post
do you guys recommend getting new bolts/hardware for the flywheel and pressure plate bolts? or the original ones are ok to re-use? 95k miles on mine.
For $10-$20 from the dealer for all 14 bolts, I'd get new ones. I'm chalking up part of my problems to using the original bolts, and it's such a mess to take everything apart again...

-1GR8WRX
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Old 04-12-2009, 06:47 PM   #14
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We have always reused the flywheel bolts and never locktite them (service manual makes no reference to its use) and have never had a problem with the bolts coming loose. If torqued correctly, they will be fine.
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Old 08-03-2013, 10:52 AM   #15
Ripper68
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Turn in Concepts View Post
We have always reused the flywheel bolts and never locktite them (service manual makes no reference to its use) and have never had a problem with the bolts coming loose. If torqued correctly, they will be fine.
All I know is that when you use a wet loctite it is like adding lubrication to the threads and increases your effective clamping force. So a 12 foot pound torque reading would create the same clamping force say of a 20 or more foot pound torque. Not sure of the exact multiplier here but I do know it will reduce the frictional forces that the threads see and therefore give you more clamping force for the same reading on your torque wrench. This could be very bad and cause the bolts to stretch/fail or strip out your threads. No one wants that to happen.

Best to use clean, dry, rust free, grease free, correct size and grade bolts and washers like the engineers designed and torque to the correct specs with a torque wrench.
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