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Old 02-20-2008, 06:30 PM   #1
bendavi17
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Default Problems after engine rebuild

I recently had the engine rebuilt in my 2004 WRX 5spd. Here's a list of parts that's on the car:

K&N Intake
GT-Spec Headers & Uppipe
Catless Turbo-back exhaust
Short Shifter
05 STi Injectors
255 fuel pump
Forged JE Pistons .020" bored over
JE Piston rings
Eagle rods
TGV delete
Greddy 1.1mm head gasket

Here are the CEL codes that I have thrown since the rebuild(I don't currently have any CEL's, i cleared them all):

P0301 (Cylinder 1 misfire detected)
P0303 (Cylinder 3 misfire detected)
P0139 (Rear O2 sensor circuit slow response)
P1312 (Exhaust gas temperature sensor malfunction)
P0172 (System too rich)

My problem is that whenever I am in low RPM's (~2,000k) the car stutters and jolts when I give it gas. This does not happen in higher RPM's, only from around 1,000 to 3,000.

The person who rebuilt my engine has replaced the spark plugs and coils to no avail. Now he says he doesn't know how to fix it. (This is the worst experience i've EVER had at any type of business, he basically screwed up the car and refuses to fix it or pay to have it fixed, but that's a story for a different thread.)

Now I'm stuck with a car that stutters at low RPM's and a tuner that refuses to fix it or pay for it.

Any suggestions on where I should start before I take it to another mechanic?

Thanks!
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Last edited by bendavi17; 02-21-2008 at 08:28 PM. Reason: New CEL P0172
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Old 02-20-2008, 06:50 PM   #2
Broxma
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What kind of tune do you have on it? Sounds like a tuning issue to me.

/Brox
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Old 02-20-2008, 07:20 PM   #3
bendavi17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Broxma View Post
What kind of tune do you have on it? Sounds like a tuning issue to me.

/Brox
The guy who rebuilt the engine also tuned it on his Mustang dyno, but I really think he doesn't know what he's doing. It seems like a tuning problem to me also, but he says since it's low RPM's he cant fix it with the dyno.
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Old 02-20-2008, 08:14 PM   #4
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Did the guy/shop that did the rebuild do the whole job? Engine removal, tear down and rebuild, install and tune. If they did and the car did not have a runability issue when you brought it to them then I would be on the shop like white on rice to make it right. Even if it means going to another shop to have them diagnose/repair and then give the repair bill to the offending shop in court, if need be.



How ever if the car had a runability issue prior and it was not agreed that any of this work would correct it. I would say you are s.o.l.

I would also say if you did any of the removal, tear down and install work. I can see how a shop may shy away from fixing it, as you have now had a opportunity to muck some thing up along the way.


Not trying to put you at fault but I have been in the auto repair service industry before (both as a customer and a service center). There is more to this then what has been mentioned here. When working in a shop I have had customers goof things up when they have done part of the work and try to blame me/the shop. I have also as a customer had a shop not stand behind their work, It can be frustrating. Just as frustrating for a shop being blamed for a customers mistake. Mistake are just that, mistakes.

With out knowing more of the particular details pertaining to the rebuild, order and how things happened. I would suspect that the miss on #1, 3. May be due to a improperly installed head gasket(flipped front to back), which would cause the engine to run rough in low rpm. If the gasket is indeed flipped it can cause coolant to leak into the cylinder which not only would cause the misfire codes on #1 and 3(same side) but it would pass that coolant into the exhaust possibly triggering the other 2 codes due to wet sensors. some thing to look at.
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Old 02-21-2008, 01:34 AM   #5
bendavi17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by flstffxe View Post
Did the guy/shop that did the rebuild do the whole job? Engine removal, tear down and rebuild, install and tune. If they did and the car did not have a runability issue when you brought it to them then I would be on the shop like white on rice to make it right. Even if it means going to another shop to have them diagnose/repair and then give the repair bill to the offending shop in court, if need be.



How ever if the car had a runability issue prior and it was not agreed that any of this work would correct it. I would say you are s.o.l.

I would also say if you did any of the removal, tear down and install work. I can see how a shop may shy away from fixing it, as you have now had a opportunity to muck some thing up along the way.


Not trying to put you at fault but I have been in the auto repair service industry before (both as a customer and a service center). There is more to this then what has been mentioned here. When working in a shop I have had customers goof things up when they have done part of the work and try to blame me/the shop. I have also as a customer had a shop not stand behind their work, It can be frustrating. Just as frustrating for a shop being blamed for a customers mistake. Mistake are just that, mistakes.

With out knowing more of the particular details pertaining to the rebuild, order and how things happened. I would suspect that the miss on #1, 3. May be due to a improperly installed head gasket(flipped front to back), which would cause the engine to run rough in low rpm. If the gasket is indeed flipped it can cause coolant to leak into the cylinder which not only would cause the misfire codes on #1 and 3(same side) but it would pass that coolant into the exhaust possibly triggering the other 2 codes due to wet sensors. some thing to look at.
Thanks for the reply. The P.O.S. shop did the ENITRE teardown/rebuild. I had the car towed there after it spun a rod bearing. They told me it would take about a month and a half to finish the job... 7 months later(yes, seven) I have the car back and it's running like crap.

The bastard doesn't know how to fix the problem and he refuses to pay another shop to fix it. He says that since I bought the pistons he can't warranty anything. (I bought BRAND NEW JE pistons + rods). He's basically trying to screw me over, looks like I'm going to have to take him to court to deal with this problem.

BTW, the shop is called EIP Racing in San Jose, CA.
STAY FAR AWAY FROM THIS PLACE!!!!
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Old 02-21-2008, 10:55 AM   #6
SilvirRex
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wow man sorry to hear that. i have been a prof wrench for a while and i have seen shops not take responsibilty for mistake they make. dont worry if they put out work like that they wont be there long. then you can laugh and wizz on the building with he is putting the out of biz sign up. O yeah and its sounds like acourt issue. get ahold of a lawyer and see how he says to go about it. once your lawyer contacts the guy he will be ****ting bricks.
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Old 02-21-2008, 04:06 PM   #7
bendavi17
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What should I do as far as getting the car fixed? Are there any possible simple solutions to the stuttering problem? I plan on taking the car to a real mechanic on saturday, but is there anything I can check myself before I take it in?

Thanks
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Old 02-21-2008, 05:02 PM   #8
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you arent telling us something..

how do you have 05 STi injectors on there when your car is an 04 WRX?? better yet WHY do you have those??

come on spill the beans, don't bash a shop just yet.

you guys kill me with lawyer threats lol.. The shop owner is just going to give your lawyer HIS lawyers number, and guess what?? He'll win
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Old 02-21-2008, 08:10 PM   #9
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^^^ the shop winning in court would depend on how the liability/warranty agreement is worded on the repair order and what was agreed to between the shop and the customer.

Doesn't matter who bought the pistons and rods, unless it is a bad piston/rod causing the issue. If it is due to a piston/rod then yes it may be a gray line on who would eat the labor but dealing with the piston/rod warranty would all be on you.

As far as what the proper way for this to have gone, would have been. Builder gets done, customer points out running issue. At that point there should have been an agreement that the builder will trouble shoot the issue and if the issue turns out to be related to the work done by them then the shop covers the charges. If the running issue is diagnosed to be unrelated then the costs would be the customers responsibility.

Seeing where you are at now I tend to think both parties may have gotten a little worked up, leading to the shop telling you you are on your own(they have a right to choose their customers). However You are most likely going to have to take the car to another shop to have it diagnosed/repaired(make this aware to the offending shop). If it turns out to be directly related to the 1st shops work, it is time for small claims court (some states do not allow lawyers in small claims court, evens the odds) and bring a representative from the 2nd shop who can testify as to the nature and fault of the problem. You will probably be stuck paying for it out of pocket until it goes to court. If it goes to court, research procedure(how to handle your self, proper steps) and keep every thing documented(conversations, dates, times, get every thing in writing)
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Old 02-21-2008, 08:26 PM   #10
bendavi17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sidewayz View Post
you arent telling us something..

how do you have 05 STi injectors on there when your car is an 04 WRX?? better yet WHY do you have those??

come on spill the beans, don't bash a shop just yet.

you guys kill me with lawyer threats lol.. The shop owner is just going to give your lawyer HIS lawyers number, and guess what?? He'll win
I have bigger injectors because the tuner recommended them, the stock ones get close to maxing out. Why would I be hiding something? The shop rebuilt my engine with the parts that they recommended, and never finished the job and/or messed something else up during the process.
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Old 02-21-2008, 08:35 PM   #11
bendavi17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by flstffxe View Post
^^^ the shop winning in court would depend on how the liability/warranty agreement is worded on the repair order and what was agreed to between the shop and the customer.

Doesn't matter who bought the pistons and rods, unless it is a bad piston/rod causing the issue. If it is due to a piston/rod then yes it may be a gray line on who would eat the labor but dealing with the piston/rod warranty would all be on you.

As far as what the proper way for this to have gone, would have been. Builder gets done, customer points out running issue. At that point there should have been an agreement that the builder will trouble shoot the issue and if the issue turns out to be related to the work done by them then the shop covers the charges. If the running issue is diagnosed to be unrelated then the costs would be the customers responsibility.

Seeing where you are at now I tend to think both parties may have gotten a little worked up, leading to the shop telling you you are on your own(they have a right to choose their customers). However You are most likely going to have to take the car to another shop to have it diagnosed/repaired(make this aware to the offending shop). If it turns out to be directly related to the 1st shops work, it is time for small claims court (some states do not allow lawyers in small claims court, evens the odds) and bring a representative from the 2nd shop who can testify as to the nature and fault of the problem. You will probably be stuck paying for it out of pocket until it goes to court. If it goes to court, research procedure(how to handle your self, proper steps) and keep every thing documented(conversations, dates, times, get every thing in writing)
I don't really see this as being a warranty issue, they simply never finished the job. It seems like they also caused other damages while rebuilding my engine. Since I've owned the car(2+ years) I have never seen a CEL, the first time a saw one was after I received the car back from this shop. Since then I keep getting different CEL's every day.

They did a very sloppy job, and I'm afraid that it's going to lead to more severe problems.
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Old 02-21-2008, 08:39 PM   #12
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File a complaint with the BAR, that will get his attention.
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Old 02-21-2008, 09:05 PM   #13
bendavi17
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File a complaint with the BAR, that will get his attention.
I just did that this morning, as well as the BBB.
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Old 02-22-2008, 01:38 PM   #14
sidewayz
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I asked about the injectors because you can't USE STi injectors on a WRX .
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Old 02-22-2008, 02:11 PM   #15
jeraljay
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how about all local subarus park outside his business and picket that MO FO. That might get his attention.

Probably wont happen but it sure would be fun.

I wish you the best man, from what i have read it looks like you got the royal shaft.

who recommended this shop to you anyways? whats the connection?
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Old 02-22-2008, 04:07 PM   #16
bendavi17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sidewayz View Post
I asked about the injectors because you can't USE STi injectors on a WRX .
Injectors from an 05 STi won't work in an 04 WRX? They are both top feed, from what I understand they should work just fine...

Can anyone verify this?
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Old 02-22-2008, 05:49 PM   #17
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Injectors from an 05 STi are side feed.
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Old 02-22-2008, 08:38 PM   #18
bendavi17
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Injectors from an 05 STi are side feed.
Would they even fit on my car then? I didn't mention this earlier but when I finally picked up my car from the shop, I popped the hood and saw that my stock headers & up-pipe were still on the car. I asked him why my GT-Spec headers and up-pipe that I had given him weren't installed on the car, and he said "you had headers?". I couldn't believe that they "forgot" that I had given them the headers/up-pipe to install.

He said he'll look for the parts and that he should have them laying around somewhere. I also told him that i'll need my stock injectors back.(I had given him the STi injectors to install like he recommended). He says "you had injectors?". Wow.

Anyways, he says to break in my car first and he'll find the parts and install them after the break in. He found the headers & up-pipe but I don't know for sure what injectors he put in, although I did get stock wrx injectors back from him.

Could the injectors be causing these CEL's and the rough stuttering below ~3,000RPM's?
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Old 02-22-2008, 09:11 PM   #19
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at the very least you need to get it to a shop that can tune it and have them check the tune. If it is a bad tune you could be doing unrepairable damage. If the shop doesn't want to work with you on getting things made right, I would bring it else where to get it figured out then get your money out of him later, in court if need be.
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Old 02-23-2008, 06:44 PM   #20
bendavi17
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I took the car to a mechanic today and they did a compression test. Cylinder #4 has 50psi. I went to the shop who rebuilt my motor and showed them the results of the test. They refuse to take any responsibility from the problem, whatsoever. Unfortunately it looks like this will have to be settled in court.

This really sucks, after not having my car for seven months I finally get it back and it has a blown motor. The shop won't even man up and admit they ****ed up.

Oh well, I heard GST Motorsports is a good shop/tuner in the Bay Area, hopefully they can do a swap & tune for me. Anyone been to this place?
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Old 02-23-2008, 09:58 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bendavi17 View Post
I took the car to a mechanic today and they did a compression test. Cylinder #4 has 50psi. I went to the shop who rebuilt my motor and showed them the results of the test. They refuse to take any responsibility from the problem, whatsoever. Unfortunately it looks like this will have to be settled in court.

This really sucks, after not having my car for seven months I finally get it back and it has a blown motor. The shop won't even man up and admit they ****ed up.

Oh well, I heard GST Motorsports is a good shop/tuner in the Bay Area, hopefully they can do a swap & tune for me. Anyone been to this place?
Firstly sorry to hear of your bad experience.

We would be more than happy to look over your car for you, drop us a line anytime during the week.

Mike
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