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Old 03-03-2008, 10:22 AM   #1
shnibop
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Default just want to make sure (brake bleeding)

Most how to's and install threads I've read only refer to driver and passenger sides as "left" and "right". So does it go like this:

Passenger rear
Driver front
Driver rear
Passenger front

04 sti btw although I think it's the same for all/most subarus

Thanks in advance
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Old 03-03-2008, 12:02 PM   #2
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i believe its

passenger front
driver rear
driver front
passenger rear.
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Old 03-03-2008, 12:33 PM   #3
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^^ That is correct according to the FSM.
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Old 03-03-2008, 12:37 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by STi-MAN View Post
i believe its

passenger front
driver rear
driver front
passenger rear.
YES this is the order. It's not like a "normal" car. Trust me. I wasted a can of ATE Super Blue not doing it in this order.
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Old 03-03-2008, 12:56 PM   #5
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Added this to the Walkthrough thread:
http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/show....php?t=1430598
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Old 03-03-2008, 01:08 PM   #6
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If you are just doing a basic bleed, it doesnt matter what order you bleed them in. Ive bled my car multiple times just going in the most convenient order with no issues. The FSM has specific requirements to make sure all techs use the same method for consistency, and for bleeding systems that have no fluid in them at all. If you want to follow the FSM for your own personal comfort, then by all means do it, but you wont screw anything up if you dont follow that method.
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Old 03-03-2008, 01:54 PM   #7
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Agreed. For a simple 4/5 squirts a caliper it's not even an issue.

However.... I said the same many month ago and was promptly told I was wrong. I tend to prefer doing one END of a car completely, then the other. Much easier.
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Old 03-03-2008, 03:28 PM   #8
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Thanks for the info guys, I'm actually installing SS brakelines and am due for a brake fluid flush anyway so I guess ill be following the correct order

Thanks again
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Old 03-03-2008, 06:20 PM   #9
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start from the farthest wheel from the mc and work ur way to the closest. I do it:

passenger rear
driver rear
passenger front
driver front

And i did ss lines before i bled the system. It was actually a flush and bleed. came out great.
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Old 03-03-2008, 08:38 PM   #10
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I'm gonna stick with the recommended way as opposed to the traditional way (furthest from mc) thanks tho
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Old 03-05-2008, 08:00 PM   #11
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Default brake bleeding sequence

shnibop.. may want to rethink that hardline...I just installed my S/S lines today.. bled the whole system 3X using that exact sequence: RR, LR, RF, LF.. seemingly got all the air out of the system.. as fluid is running clear from all four corners, but I still have a low pedal.. can pump it once, and it seems I have four brakes again.. will try the 'proper' sequence tomorrow. and let you know the results...
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Old 03-06-2008, 07:01 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wrxracer519 View Post
start from the farthest wheel from the mc and work ur way to the closest. I do it:

passenger rear
driver rear
passenger front
driver front

And i did ss lines before i bled the system. It was actually a flush and bleed. came out great.
This is NOT the correct order. Follow the recommended order PF -> DR -> DF -> PR

Oh, and make SURE you don't let the MC drain cmplelte of fluid when you change the lines.
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Old 03-06-2008, 08:35 PM   #13
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The most important thing you have to remember is to never, never let the reservior run dry. I recently upgraded to Stainless Steel lines and I did it the old fashioned way and it came out just fine. I've bleed brakes on many different cars and many different sequences and the end result was always the same. I don't understand why this topic seems to get alot of attention, if your brakes worked before your upgrade and now they don't then you probably did something wrong regardless of the order.
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Old 03-06-2008, 10:55 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mav1c View Post
This is NOT the correct order. Follow the recommended order PF -> DR -> DF -> PR

Oh, and make SURE you don't let the MC drain cmplelte of fluid when you change the lines.
Why are the lines run different on an STi ? Than a WRX

I have done brake bleeding on many cars & trucks in the below order & never had any problems. I always start with the farthest away from the ABS unit, in other words the longest hard line first.

Quote:
Originally Posted by wrxracer519 View Post
start from the farthest wheel from the mc and work ur way to the closest. I do it:

passenger rear
driver rear
passenger front
driver front

And i did ss lines before i bled the system. It was actually a flush and bleed. came out great.
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Old 03-06-2008, 11:14 PM   #15
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I'm in awe to how complicated some of you make a very simple process...you guys are making way too much of a 20min job.

Pick a caliper, change the hose and bleed it. So long as the mc does not run dry it doesn't matter.
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Old 03-07-2008, 12:49 AM   #16
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i just did a bleed and flush after swopping my ss lines in. However, i only used 1 bottle (500ml) of RBF 600. Am i doin this wrongly? i also didnt follow any exact sequence, stoptech mentioned that it was only a more systematic way of doing this procedure and does not affect performance. However, is 500ml too little? Any way i can rectify if there is a prob? i wan the brake to bite earlier...how can i do it
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Old 03-07-2008, 01:29 AM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Todd TCE View Post
I'm in awe to how complicated some of you make a very simple process...you guys are making way too much of a 20min job.

Pick a caliper, change the hose and bleed it. So long as the mc does not run dry it doesn't matter.
I don't mater if it does goes dry. Yes that sucks if it goes dry & can be a PITA but its not like your going to wreck any thing.


But still some one give me a technical reason to do it like
this PF -> DR -> DF -> PR
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Old 03-07-2008, 02:57 AM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jacky599r View Post
i just did a bleed and flush after swopping my ss lines in. However, i only used 1 bottle (500ml) of RBF 600. Am i doin this wrongly? i also didnt follow any exact sequence, stoptech mentioned that it was only a more systematic way of doing this procedure and does not affect performance. However, is 500ml too little? Any way i can rectify if there is a prob? i wan the brake to bite earlier...how can i do it
Just swaped in my ss lines as well and used blue fluid so I knew when the new and clean fluid was pushed through. Only used about 600ml. Bedded in my new pads and rotors and re-checked the reservoir and it was still good and full. Drove for 2 days now and everything is fine.. so 500ml is not out of the ordinary Enjoy the new lines man.

BTW.. bleeding is a very simple process as said above. It is made even easier if you swap you bleed screws with speed bleed screws! Speed Bleed FTW!
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Old 03-07-2008, 09:00 AM   #19
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It's even easier than that....replace the lines (perhaps one end of the car at a time) and open the bleeder screws. Let the fluid run down the caliper into a pan. From time to time pour new fluid in the reservoir. You don't need high pressure (i.e. a gorilla friend pounding on the brake pedal!) for this to purge air. After the fluid flows clear, a couple light pumps and squirts into a rag if you wish and you're done.
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Old 03-07-2008, 12:52 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Todd TCE View Post
It's even easier than that....replace the lines (perhaps one end of the car at a time) and open the bleeder screws. Let the fluid run down the caliper into a pan. From time to time pour new fluid in the reservoir. You don't need high pressure (i.e. a gorilla friend pounding on the brake pedal!) for this to purge air. After the fluid flows clear, a couple light pumps and squirts into a rag if you wish and you're done.

wow. are you serious? you'll never purge all the air doing that. if fluid isn't constantly coming out or in a steady state (ie by keeping the bleed hose in a jar of brake fluid, etc), air will re-enter the system. what you're describing will work with Speed Bleeder b/c they're one-way valves.
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Old 03-07-2008, 01:03 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dantastic View Post
wow. are you serious? you'll never purge all the air doing that. if fluid isn't constantly coming out or in a steady state (ie by keeping the bleed hose in a jar of brake fluid, etc), air will re-enter the system. what you're describing will work with Speed Bleeder b/c they're one-way valves.
He's describing what is called 'gravity bleeding', and it will usually work. FYI, you can not gravity bleed if you have Speed Bleeders because the Speed Bleeders have a one-way valve in them that requires pressure to open.
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Old 03-07-2008, 01:23 PM   #22
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I don't the exact reasons why, but I believe it has to do with the routing of the lines in the Subie. The opposite corners are on the same line. So the front right is on the same line as the left rear, and the left front is on the same line as the right rear. So when you follow the suggested order, you're bleeding air from the same lines in sequence. I used to use the farthest-from-the-mc method, but always seemed to have trouble getting all the air out. Since switching to the suggested order, I never have problems, and saves me the extra fluid. I'm sure there's a more technical reason Subaru suggests this ordr, but I'm not a Subaru engineer.

And it does matter if the MC goes dry if you don't want to waste a can of brake fluid.

Quote:
Originally Posted by zman519 View Post
I don't mater if it does goes dry. Yes that sucks if it goes dry & can be a PITA but its not like your going to wreck any thing.


But still some one give me a technical reason to do it like
this PF -> DR -> DF -> PR
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Old 03-07-2008, 04:21 PM   #23
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how hard is it to power bleed brakes? i will be doing that as soon at my bleeder comes in
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Old 03-07-2008, 05:48 PM   #24
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Oddly enough two brake industry experts here both advise against the use of any sort of power/suction systems. Gravity and simple old school wins hands down. I dare say that the vast majority of problems encountered with bleeding comes from the use of such equipment (mainly those who are new with it) and those who repeatedly bang the crap out of the pedal by pumping on it like stomping grapes.

Bleeding is only FLUID DISPLACEMENT, it has NOTHIING to do with pressure. Airation (sp?) and back suction-- "woops, I though you said CLOSED" are all to common.

As for gravity; if I put beer keg on the top of the stairs, and ran a hose to your mouth, do you think you be able to exhale up the hose? Yes, assming the reservoir does not run dry nor your friendly "I'm helllping" buddy does not pump the pedal while open all things flow one way.

*I cannot explain the sequence of the factory but I suspect it has to do with purging the ABS pump. All cars today are FOUR individual lines so there is no draw back of air from the LR to the RR for example on an old Volkswagon. (I'm dating myself here) So the reality is the entire systme- all the lines are all full of fluid all the time regardless of what one you open first. Or last.


** I need to add that if you work on open wheel race cars as I often do, this gravity thing doesn't work. My bad. The reservoir must be higher than the caliper!!

Last edited by Todd TCE; 03-07-2008 at 05:58 PM.
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Old 03-07-2008, 11:55 PM   #25
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Todd TCE... you sound very knowledgeable on the subject!

do you not recommend that i bleed the system on my own with a suction type pump? i know a lot of people have used the tool before with great success.

as far as the gravity bleeding technique, that also requires 2 people at some point right? like when the fluid starts to run clear and you want to give it an additional pump on the pedal to clear any possible air in the line.

i want to drain the system of the old brake fluid and replace with new (simultaneously sp? obviously), and switch to ss lines.

thanks
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