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Old 03-06-2008, 01:07 PM   #1
GreenLantern
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Default What should I do, keep coilovers or swap to strut/spring?

I just purchased Stance GR+ PRO coilovers from Calitri-Boost and just received them in the mail (thanks lance)
Short story shorter, Kaldar142 told me since i had the money for them that i should jump on it and either i would use them or he'd buyem from me.
So i got em and of course, as tends to be the habit with Kaldar (no effence joe), the fine print was read to me about my purchase a few days later.

He said that since i am still learning about taking a good line and such that these coilovers may not be my best move. He said that they will "coverup my mistakes" (I asked him to explain and he couldn't) and that when i plan to auto-cross i'll be in a hard class where i'll get my butt kicked.

So, now that i have the coilovers i am wondering what to do. Kaldar and i have worked out what seems to be a fair deal and i was wondering what
the community thought would be a better suspension for me (granted i know you all don't know how i drive so i;m looking for opinions with your reasoning)

Basicly, im asking:

What is Kaldar talking about when he says "the coilovers will cover up my mistakes" and ultimately inhibit my learning to become a good line taker

and if i decided to do this deal with kaldar i'd be putting on my car (instead of the GR+ pro's) his new Tanabe GF210's with his JDM sti pink struts.

(so i don't get flamed) i use my car as a dailydriver but for frequent spirited country-run drives, and i will hopefully be getting into auto-crossing soon.

what im thinking right now is that the trade would be a good idea for me now but i don't want to in the near future wish i just kept the coilovers. thats why i came here. i voiced this the kaldar and he said that later i can do koni inserts and be just as good. Also i plan on buying some 18x8 +35 RPF1's with 235/35/18s and want to make sure they will fit without to much trouble.

thanks for feedback, sorry for the long post, and thanks for helping the newbie
-GL
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Old 03-06-2008, 05:23 PM   #2
Butt Dyno
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How exactly are you "learning the line" if it's just a daily driver with "country run drives"?

There is nothing magical about coilovers that makes them "cover up mistakes" more than a strut/spring combo. The #1 hider of mistakes is sticky tires.

That said, you might not want/need coilovers if you aren't going to run lots of camber, autox, deal with potential rebuilds, want better ride quality (generalization) etc etc.

Check out the coilover FAQ in the stickies.

john
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Old 03-06-2008, 05:33 PM   #3
jamal
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By learning the line I've cut my time over the mountain significantly.

something something... tofu delivery.. something something.

Honestly they aren't going to do him any better than they are you. Since you already bought them, you might as well try them out. Then if you don't like them you can always just sell them to your friend.
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Old 03-06-2008, 06:14 PM   #4
GreenLantern
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"How exactly are you "learning the line" if it's just a daily driver with "country run drives"?"

What do you mean how am i learning? i drive with kaldar alot and follow his line and try and figure out what the fastest way around turns is. how am i supposto learn lines?

"That said, you might not want/need coilovers if you aren't going to run lots of camber, autox, deal with potential rebuilds, want better ride quality (generalization) etc etc."

i plan on getting into autox and who doesn't want the better ride?
how am i suppose to learn the line?

i appreciate the replies, still not sure what i want to do though
i know its hard but please help me decide

thanks thanks
-GL
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Old 03-06-2008, 06:27 PM   #5
QuikWgn
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That 35mm offset on those wheels will be an issue too. Scoobs come stock w/53-48mm offests and you can scrape by with 45mm depending on tire profile/fender rolling, 35mm is not enough and will cause a problem, unless you've done something like a wide body kit etc.
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Old 03-06-2008, 10:27 PM   #6
misterwaterfallin
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why are you going with a 18" rim?
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Old 03-06-2008, 11:01 PM   #7
AndyRoo
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GreenLantern View Post
"How exactly are you "learning the line" if it's just a daily driver with "country run drives"?"

What do you mean how am i learning? i drive with kaldar alot and follow his line and try and figure out what the fastest way around turns is. how am i supposto learn lines?

"That said, you might not want/need coilovers if you aren't going to run lots of camber, autox, deal with potential rebuilds, want better ride quality (generalization) etc etc."

i plan on getting into autox and who doesn't want the better ride?
how am i suppose to learn the line?

i appreciate the replies, still not sure what i want to do though
i know its hard but please help me decide

thanks thanks
-GL


You will learn far more by not following Kaldar and just going to a local auto-x.

The "line" is one small piece of the puzzle. For your own good, please don't say "learning the line." Just say "learning to drive." And don't have Kaldar "give lessons" on public roads.


My advice: sell Kaldar the coilovers for what you paid for them, go to an auto-x with your stock suspension and ask for someone with actual auto-x experience for a ride-a-long. There are a lot of good drivers in the Mid-Atlantic region that you can actually learn from.


- Andrew

Last edited by AndyRoo; 03-06-2008 at 11:08 PM.
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Old 03-07-2008, 12:33 AM   #8
QuikWgn
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Quote:
Originally Posted by misterwaterfallin View Post
why are you going with a 18" rim?
True...I didn't really go there but you will pick up unsprung weight with an 18" tire wheel combo. I picked up 9lb per wheel(from stock) with even my light(for 18" rim) 20lb wheel and 27lb 225/40/18's. I'd definitely be looking for a light but strong 17" combo if I was planning to AX a lot.
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Old 03-29-2008, 01:36 AM   #9
GreenLantern
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im looking into 18x8 rpf1's
-gl
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Old 03-29-2008, 12:14 PM   #10
flukewrx
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"Slow In, Fast Out" - Easy Concept, but very hard in practice.
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Old 03-29-2008, 12:37 PM   #11
MasterKwan
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Na Na...that's not the way to do it. Didn't you ever watch Initial D? The essence of AWD cornering is to come in fast enough to induce 4 wheel drift then, wide open throttle through the corner, controlling your line with the steering wheel. If you try to control it with the throttle, you'll just cause understeer.

It worked great in that cartoon.
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Old 03-29-2008, 01:21 PM   #12
GreenLantern
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woah what? i thought the fastest way round a turn was with grip?
-GL
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Old 03-29-2008, 01:48 PM   #13
AndyRoo
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Your sarcasm detector is broken.


- Andrew
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Old 03-29-2008, 02:37 PM   #14
flukewrx
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MasterKwan View Post
Na Na...that's not the way to do it. Didn't you ever watch Initial D? The essence of AWD cornering is to come in fast enough to induce 4 wheel power slide then, wide open throttle through the corner, controlling your line with the steering wheel. If you try to control it with the throttle, you'll just cause understeer.

It worked great in that cartoon.

Fixed for you.

I loved that cartoon/anime. The games at the arcades were pretty fun as well.
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Old 03-29-2008, 03:26 PM   #15
MasterKwan
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You know, I've been dying to try this on track but, the tracks I run don't have enough runoff room if I F it up.

Season 2, Episode 3, about 12:20 in they explain their take on AWD handling and he says drift in japanese.

Quote:
He has to enter the corner at the limit to drift a 4WD which doesn't turn sharply. Once the drift is begun (sic) fully depress the pedal and control the car only with the steering. If you try to control the car by releasing the pedal like in an FR, the understeer will get worse...
Mine's pretty close since I did it from memory. It seems to kind of discount that whole "Traction Circle" thing they teach here in the west.
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