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Old 04-16-2008, 01:31 AM   #1
Udolauch
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Default Fueling Problem

My 2003 wrx wagon is not taking fuel properly. Fuel backs up WAY to quickly in the filler spout and I have to sit there and baby it completely. I took about the vent lines as best I could without pulling the tank and blew them out just to make sure that they were not plugged, and the ones I could get to were not. Does anyone know if there is a solenoid, electronic switch, or valve that could be failing on me? It's a really big pain in my butt and I have been unable to find information anywhere about this problem. Not to mention that the dealer want's a bunch of money just to take the thing apart and see whats wrong with it. Any help would be great, thanks
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Old 04-16-2008, 12:42 PM   #2
Subie Gal
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vent valve is borked or your charcoal canister is no good....


you're going to either have to throw parts at it

or take it to the dealership for proper diagnosis.


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Old 04-17-2008, 01:12 AM   #3
Udolauch
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anybody other than the dealer able to diagnose this? I have very little faith in the subaru dealer here.
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Old 04-17-2008, 10:03 AM   #4
Subie Gal
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Udolauch View Post
anybody other than the dealer able to diagnose this? I have very little faith in the subaru dealer here.
honestly likely not

unless you have a Japanese vehicle specific or Subaru independent repair shop around?

???


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Old 12-18-2008, 08:53 PM   #5
Udolauch
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Alright I had everything from the middle of my car back completely off. I checked the three plastic vent canisters and all the lines. Everything appeared to be ok. When I start the gas pump on the lowest setting it only takes a couple seconds before it shuts off. and then I have to stand at the pump and fill it crazy slow. I'm thinking I may need to take everything back apart when the weather warms up and check it again. I unhooked the charcoal canister and varous other hoses while filling and could not get anything to work. Any ideas would be helpful at this point because I really don't have the money to take it to a dealer. Thanks
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Old 12-22-2008, 08:46 PM   #6
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I'm having the same issue with my 02.
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Old 12-26-2008, 02:18 AM   #7
Udolauch
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It's a huge PITA and nothing I have done has been helping at all.
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Old 01-16-2009, 02:18 PM   #8
dcarr1971
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FWIW...I'm having a roughly similar problem with my '98 OB Sport, have to keep restarting the pump every couple seconds, but I also have a CEL and an unknown code causing a CEL every winter during the same time periods. This fuling and CEL issue has come on each of the past 3 winters without any adverse effects, other than frayed nerves...

The weird thing in my case is that it only happens in the winter...late-March to late-October everything is OK fueling and no CEL...I've been telling myself the cold weather is causing the fueling problem and the CEL is probably a sensor that only likes the cleaner 'summer' fuel blends. Local shop says they spoke to a Subie Dealer about the code and they were stumped too...
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Old 01-17-2009, 08:14 AM   #9
Subie Gal
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what is your code? got a ##?
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Old 01-21-2009, 12:24 PM   #10
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I also have the same problem but the fix was a new vent valve along with it I decided to get new filler neck and gas cap due to the P0440 code as of right now I would safely state that it's fixed.

http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/show....php?t=1647228
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Old 01-21-2009, 03:39 PM   #11
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I had the same problem too, but it went away???
In its place now though is the thing (99OBS Turb'd) dumps fuel at startup, after filling, and misfires (P301/P303).
Let me know if this happens to you tooooo.
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Old 01-22-2009, 01:25 AM   #12
Udolauch
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I don't have any pump issues on my 03, but I guess I will just need to take everything out again and possibly replace my filler neck. Are you taking about the vent valve located near the opening of the filler neck? or the vent valve directly on the fuel tank?
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Old 01-22-2009, 09:22 AM   #13
hangman
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Udolauch View Post
I don't have any pump issues on my 03, but I guess I will just need to take everything out again and possibly replace my filler neck. Are you taking about the vent valve located near the opening of the filler neck? or the vent valve directly on the fuel tank?
You will have pump issues when the vent valve crap out.
1. Pumping gas at full speed will trigger the gas pump to close.
2. Slowly pumping gas in to solve it.

The vent valve is located on the filler neck itself on the sides you have to take out the plastic thingy and the rear right wheel to view it.

Its a small little black thing with 2 valve and is held by 2 nuts and spring action thing in the middle to actuate the valves sorry for the description.
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Old 02-28-2009, 12:16 PM   #14
Udolauch
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I have taken that 2 way valve off and checked it, it flows perfectly fine when open. There is a pressure control valve, when it fails supposedly it stays shut. There are two of these similar electronically controlled valves, and one I checked is good. Next step is to pull everything off again and clean and check all the valves. Oh, I found a few spiderwebs at the very end of the evap system where it vents into the atmosphere, but it didn't make any difference. Whatever this is I think it's something bigger rather than just a little clogged vent line.
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Old 02-28-2009, 02:39 PM   #15
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The valve by the filler neck is called a shut-off valve. It's described as supposed to close when the filler gun goes in and closes the evaporation line. Why would the evaporation line have to be closed when you put a filler gun in? I don't know the answer to that.

I have the same problem for 2 years now and here's my take on it. I'm not throwing ANY CELs.

I know the possibilities are either the vent valve in the gas tank is not opening, or the hose to the charcoal canister is clogged. I've read it could be the pressure control solenoid which regulates the pressure in the fuel tank (not the purge solenoid), but I don't think that solenoid serves any purpose when the car is not powered on.

Last night I removed all three hoses from the charcoal canister, and drove to the gas station.

1) I expected to get a CEL, and i didn't. I know the light works. Any ideas of this? I know sometimes the ECM needs to detect a fault on a couple of trips, i turned the car on and off two or three times before i got to the gas station.

2) I still couldn't fill up, which indicates that it's not a issue with the canister or anything beyond the "Fuel Tank" port of the canister since i was venting directly to the atmosphere

3) Therefore I deduce that the vent valve in the fuel tank is bad.

4) Would a bad solenoid affect the car while it's not on (and no CELs anyway)? Maybe stuck in a closed position?

Lastly, I found one of the hoses were broken that goes from the pressure control solenoid valve and Ts into the "Fuel Tank" hose. I tried putting a piece of fuel line tubing there but it didn't make any difference. The PCSV has three nozzles on it, one that goes towards the "Fuel Tank" hose, one that pulls air in from the atmosphere, and one that comes from the shut-off valve all the way at the top of the filler neck.

Last edited by mc2; 02-28-2009 at 02:45 PM.
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Old 02-28-2009, 02:40 PM   #16
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Which valve did you check, and how did you check it? Did you check the one by the charcoal canister?
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Old 03-02-2009, 03:19 PM   #17
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finally people with the same issue. i was tired of tryign to explain this to people and get looked at like i was a tard. I have narrowed mine down to a valve being closed 100% of the time. If you use something to hold the little flap of the fuel input hole open and shoot gas down there it has no problem. but if i just shove the nozzle in there is will click in 5 seconds. but 1/20 fill ups it will work perfect.

after seeing soem info above, i am replace the vent valve, if i cant find a way to test it.
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Old 03-02-2009, 08:37 PM   #18
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Wait, so you can get it to work by using something to hold the flap open?

I'm trying to figure out why that works, maybe it's because it's allowing air to escape through the extra gap you are creating?
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Old 03-04-2009, 01:41 PM   #19
Liquid_plasma
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^^^ exactly there is no vent open (because mine is bad)while fueling the car, and the fuel pump "knows" when to stop fueling based on a preset back-pressure.

so if i leave a big enough gap i can hold the triiger down 75% until i feel like stopping or gas shoots out and gets on my pants. . . .

anyone know the part number for this Vent valve on the fuelign neck?
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Old 03-04-2009, 01:44 PM   #20
Udolauch
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I currently have a zip tie holding the anti-siphon flap open, and it makes no difference. I have removed the hoses and tested everything that you can access without pulling the tank.

I have also read the subaru technician literature on the evap system.

When I had the tank out before I checked the vent valves directly on the tank and they all seemed to be working properly, there is a small chance that they weren't but I doubt it. Which tells me that the "pressure control duty solenoid" could be the problem. this is from the technician article:

"
Pressure control duty solenoid - Adjusts the
pressure inside the fuel tank from a signal
from the ECM. It also controls the flow of
evaporative gas from the fuel tank to the
canister."

I believe the way this works is that when the car is on, the solenoid is energized and the valve is shut ( this pressurizes the fuel system/tank the proper amount). When the car is off, the valve should be open ( I think ). So if it fails shut, then this would result in the tank not being able to vent to the canister properly.


This is just my best guess with having already taken apart much of the system and not having checked that yet. So I'm going to be pulling all of rear subframe/tank assembly out within the next two weeks to try to solve this problem for all of us. Good luck everyone.
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Old 03-04-2009, 05:40 PM   #21
mc2
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On the neck is what's called a shut-off valve, when you put the filler gun in it the valve closes the evaporation lines from the tank to the neck.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Liquid_plasma View Post
^^^ exactly there is no vent open (because mine is bad)while fueling the car, and the fuel pump "knows" when to stop fueling based on a preset back-pressure.

so if i leave a big enough gap i can hold the triiger down 75% until i feel like stopping or gas shoots out and gets on my pants. . . .

anyone know the part number for this Vent valve on the fuelign neck?
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Old 04-08-2009, 01:17 AM   #22
Udolauch
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Ok everybody!! I fixed the problem on my car. After finally seeing a diagram that made sense, I ordered a new vent valve, installed it and hooked everything back up making sure that no lines were pinched. I'm happy to say that after a few fill ups I can confidently say that the problem is solved.

Part was ordered from SubaruGenuineParts.com
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Old 04-08-2009, 08:10 AM   #23
hangman
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So you finally broke down huh
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Old 04-08-2009, 09:08 AM   #24
Udolauch
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Yeah! I just didn't want to order a part and have it not be the problem. So that's two of us that have fixed the problem with just the vent valve.
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Old 06-25-2010, 11:32 PM   #25
Forleist
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Default VENT VALVE Part Number

I know this is an old thread - but does anyone have the Part Number for the Vent Valve for a 02 wrx? I need to replace mine, it is doing exactly what is described in this thread.
Thanks!
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