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Old 03-07-2002, 09:27 AM   #1
Fred
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Thumbs up ProECM chip

I have read many posts on this subject, and found no concrete evidence of what the chip has done (10 hp gain with dyno charts, for example). I was still intrigued enough to order one and install it, based on user recommendations, though. My impressions and test results after a half day with it:

Last night: actually slower at first, then as fast as normal after a few miles. Went home and parked it, and decided to give it another chance this morning.

Today on the way to work:

Holy shi-ite! Pardon my language, but this is the bomb, baby! Here's what the chip did with MY car - yes, the added power down low is noticeable. The car pulls through the lower rpms a little smoother, and will instantly take off in 1st gear from my yard (I live down a 1/4 mile of dirt/gravel private path), spinning the tires, without the usual bog/then coming alive - I'm talking about when I'm already moving at around 5 mph with the clutch not a factor.

the numbers so far (done with stopwatch and VERY consistent):

stock: 2k to 6k in 2nd gear = 4.9sec
2k to 5k in 3rd gear = 7.7sec
0-60 = 8.2sec
1/4 mile (a bridge to guardrail on I40) = 86-87mph

with Cobb CAI and Stromung muffler:
2k to 6k in 2nd gear = 4.5-4.6sec
2k to 5k in 3rd gear = 7.2sec
0-60 = 7.9sec
1/4 mile = 89mph

add the chip: 2k to 6k in 2nd gear = 4.4sec
2k to 5k in 3rd gear = 7.0sec
(was 8.0sec first time I did it last night)
0-60 = 7.3 sec!!!!!!!
1/4 mile last night = 89mph - haven't tried it today but I'm looking forward to breaking 90mph - of course the Prelude I had before this car was hitting 94-95 in the same distance, with front wheel drive, so there's definitely still some work to do...

Summary:
So what happened with my car is that it's only slightly quicker once I'm moving, but from a standstill, it takes off like a scalded cat! Before I put in the chip, a launch would go like this: launch at 3krpm, chirp front tires, snap head back... bog... start picking up again... okay, now I'm on my way. Now, it's launch at 3krpm, burn front tires and chirp rears and hold on for the shift because hey!!! there's no bog anymore!!!!

This is for all those people on the fence, waiting for numbers/proof/ whatever... if you have the launch bog, or low end weakness, get the damn chip. You won't be disappointed.

Later,
Fred
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Old 03-07-2002, 10:01 AM   #2
jhayzhon
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Groovy baby! Its about time someone took down some actual numbers with this thing(even though I havent heard a single negative review on it). Guess I'll be looking to buy one in the near future.
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Old 03-07-2002, 11:23 AM   #3
Kevin Thomas
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Default Wow!

Fred,

The more I read about this chip, the more I HAVE to have my hands on it for my XT6. I haven't read any bad posts about it, all positive. I just wish I had a damn dyno shop near me that I could test it out at. Sheesh!
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Old 03-07-2002, 12:27 PM   #4
Fred
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Default fyi

Just to let you guys know, I had a 94 Prelude that I put a Dinan performance chip in. It was around $650 I think including shipping for a Stage II chip (had to send the Stage I back, so the shipping added up). Was promised to increase torque by 20 and hp by about 15. Raised the rev limiter to 7500 (this was an Si, non-VTEC). The only thing I noticed was the rev limit being raised. It SEEEEMED to pull a little harder starting around 4-5k, but the before and after numbers were no different at all. The big differences numbers-wise on that car were the DC header and the RPS Turbo Clutch (ow, my left foot used to say...). 0-100 mph in 18 seconds flat... and enough torque to make launching a balancing act. That's what I'm aiming for with this car; I'm guessing cams will get me there.

So anyway, I was skeptical due to the money I wasted on the Dinan chip. But I just got back from lunch, and yes - the power is still there. It's hard to believe that much power down low can be gained with this thing, but there's a definite difference.

Fred
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Old 03-09-2002, 03:54 AM   #5
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OK I have been gone awhile..... Is this chip for the Ugly Bodied Impreza's or the nice 99-00 RS's? Thanks for the help!

Old School

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Old 03-09-2002, 08:20 PM   #6
Fred
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The instructions I got included different sections for 1) 99-01 Impreza, Legacy, Forester, Outback, 2) 96-98 Legacy, Impreza, Forester, Outback, 3) 95 Impreza 2.2 and Legacy, 4) 95 Impreza 1.8 and 93-94 Impreza, 5) 90 Legacy. Don't know if it's the same chip for all, or the same instruction manual with different chips. No instructions included for the restyled Imprezas.

Fred
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Old 03-10-2002, 01:48 PM   #7
Subi Ru
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Yay! It can be used on the 2.2L 95 L !!!!!!!

I am sooooo getting one ASAP! This is not the first good review I've read on this chip...
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Old 03-13-2002, 07:22 AM   #8
Fred
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Default mpg

Just wanted to post mpg since I've seen a few questions about that -- I got on it pretty hard the first tank, and averaged 20. I'm on the second tank (I switched to 89 octane), and taking it very easy with this one. Shifting below 3krpm, and only accelerated hard twice, out of necessity. I transit to work and back through country roads, and drive a little on divided highways - I'm keeping it below 3krpm except on I-40. Also, I'll be travelling to the Cherokee Trails rally tomorrow, so I'll have some more I-40 mileage to report on Sunday.

Fred
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Old 03-16-2002, 05:20 AM   #9
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Question whats the price?

and whose the vendor? sorry I'm to lazy to research
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Old 03-20-2002, 12:52 PM   #10
Fred
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Default mpg

Okay, I'm back from Tennessee, and here are the numbers using 89 octane and filling it ALL the way up every time:

my second tank of gas after installing the chip: avg of 25.5mpg, not getting on it more than a few times, shifting under 3krpm as much as possible.

cruising from home to Hickory, NC (via I-40, 80mph) -- 29mpg

cruising from Hickory, NC to Ducktown, TN (1/3 via I-40 @ 80mph and 2/3 via Hwy 74 @ 60mph) -- 31mpg!!!!!!!!!!

driving around on Hwy 64, I-75, gravel roads and curvy mtn roads in Tennessee (getting on the go pedal a LOT) -- avg of 26mpg!!!!!!!

cruising from Asheville, NC to home (I-40, 80mph) -- 27mpg

The best mileage I had ever gotten was around 27, and that was driving in conditions similar to those of the second trip above, where I got 31mpg.

When I was there, I drove around a lot on the roads that the rally cars were taking to get where the stages were, including paved and gravel, uphill, downhill, lots of upshift/downshift and acceleration, and I was very satisfied with the power delivery up to around 5krpm. I could get on the power in a turn and get the car to rotate by spinning the tires in second gear from around 2.5krpm (gravel, duh.), which was not possible any other time I've been to the mtns (I go a lot, so it's been annoying). Before, it would bog until about 3.5krpm or so, then the power would come on kindof strong, but I had to push it up into the higher revs to get decent power. Now it's pretty effortless. The torque comes on STRONG around 2.5krpm through 5krpm; it finally feels like my Prelude, until the power starts flatlining above 5k (that's where the Prelude had an additional surge up to the high 6k's).

Well, I better shut up and get back to work; lunchtime's over...

Fred
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Old 03-23-2002, 08:41 AM   #11
allwheeldrive
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Hey Fred where did you buy the chip and how much did it cost you ??
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Old 03-23-2002, 12:20 PM   #12
Fred
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Got mine from Larry Ganz at www.impreza-rs.com - $259.90 including shipping to my home.

Just wanted to add that the acceleration time through 3rd gear as listed above has dropped again to 6.8sec now that the chip has been in awhile. So with the intake, chip and muffler, I have taken 0.9 sec off the 0-60 time, and the same off the time it takes to accelerate from 2krpm to 5krpm in 3rd gear.

Fred
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Old 03-23-2002, 05:15 PM   #13
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i love mine. no problems whatsoever in the month i've had it in. the car pulls hard all the way to redline, instead of hanging up at a hair over 4500, and the car runs MUCH smoother. and my gas mileage is WAY better, probably the combined product of the effect of the chip plus not having to wind the engine out as much around town.

Fred -- how long have you had the chip in? i didn't notice that much of a difference other than smoothness when i first installed it, but once it settled in after a week and a half, the difference was very noticeable. also, i made sure i ran all the 87 octane out of the car prior to installation, so it was running on 93 from day one. the increase in power, plus the improved gas mileage (about 29-30 mpg around town, up from 22-23) is enough to offset the extra 10-20 cents a gallon. try running it on premium, otherwise you won't get the full effect of the chip (confirmed by both larry ganz and david @ proecm)...it is nice that it will run on the cheap stuff if you're in a pinch though, unlike some other chips where you have to keep your fingers crossed if you need gas in an area where you can't get 91 or better.

-adam-
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Old 03-23-2002, 06:04 PM   #14
Fred
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My maintenance log says I installed the chip on 3/6/02 at 34,900 miles. I'm now at 36,900. My car has gotten stronger over time too -- not just a sudden change right after the install. I haven't run any 93 octane in it yet, I wanted to get some feel and numbers with 89 first, then switch and see if there was a verifiable difference. I just refueled yesterday and got around 25 mpg (some hard driving mixed with "normal person" driving). My numbers before the chip ranged from a LOW of 17(!) a while back, to a high of 27. Usually I would get about 22-23mpg if I was driving to work through country roads, and a little on the interstate.

We also have a 2001 Civic LX sedan that gets average 35mpg and 45 highway... Guess what we drive on long trips where there are no curvy roads or possible need for AWD/ more clearance?

Fred
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Old 03-28-2002, 10:18 AM   #15
Fred
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Default update

Wanted to add this update for anybody interested:

I put in some premium at Texaco a few days ago (92 or 93 octane, can't remember), and power dropped the next morning. I could feel that it was a little sluggish, so I timed it and it was back to where it had been with just intake/ muffler. So I reset the ECM during lunch. On the drive home, it was no better. At home, I checked the spark plugs and they looked fine, and then I made sure a bird or squirrel or something hadn't been sucked up into the filter housing (nothing). So I just waited until the next morning to check it out on the road again. Next morning, the pep was back just as strong as when I installed the chip the first time. Times were back to where they were before the high octane gas. Strange; I didn't realize it would react so poorly when going to HIGHER octane fuel...

Today, I refueled again, after about 130 miles of driving, with Texaco high octane (forgot to notice rating again). Got 19mpg on the "reset" tank. Daaaamn... The mpg should go back up like it did before, though. Hopefully even higher, since I'm paying a little more for the premium stuff.

Later,

Fred
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Old 03-28-2002, 10:09 PM   #16
mart
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Damn, tell me if i'm wrong, but it seems that this chip is not really a great buy! It's so unpredictable that it seem ridiculous to me to buy one!
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Old 03-29-2002, 01:40 PM   #17
Fred
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Yeah, even though it ran great since I put the chip in and it's running great now, after the reset, you're probably right. I should pull it out and toss it in the garbage. I mean, it's not like the car ever ran strong some days and weak on others with just the stock ECM running things (bullshi*, by the way).

And while I'm at it, I guess I should divorce my wife -- she's great most of the time, but some days...

Yeah.

Fred
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Old 04-02-2002, 10:38 AM   #18
DanzBorin
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Thumbs up

I know everybody is skeptical, but the only other mods that will make you grin as much for the money is an intake or pulleys. After that, any other NA mod you do has diminishing returns. I have had mine in for about a month and never cease to be amazed on a daily basis. Throttle response is awesome, and so is the midrange pull.

Highly recommended, ****(of a possible ****), Two thumbs up, etc., etc...
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Old 06-03-2002, 10:43 AM   #19
Fred
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Default update

Because of all of the discussion going on about it, and my own need to experiment with EVERYTHING, I removed my ProECM device on Sunday, 6.02.02. I then drove around for about 10 minutes and parked my car at home. After a few hours, I drove it again and ran some tests. I had been running tests with the chip in for the past couple of days to get some good numbers to compare to. Here are the results (other mods are Cobb intake and Stromung muffler):


40-70 mph in 3rd gear with the chip = 6.5 sec
40-70 mph in 3rd gear without the chip = 7.5 sec

2000 rpm - 6000 rpm in 2nd gear with the chip = 4.6 sec
2000 rpm - 6000 rpm in 2nd gear without the chip = 5.0 sec

5 to 60 mph (eliminates launch inconsistencies) with the chip = 8.4 sec
didn't run this one on Sunday.

throttle response with the chip = jump up and go
throttle response without the chip = bog... okay, go (0.5-1 sec hesitation)


Now for the results THIS MORNING...

40-70 mph in 3rd gear without the chip = 6.3 sec
2000-6000 rpm in 2nd gear without the chip = 4.5 sec

5 to 60 mph without the chip = 7.9 sec

Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm........... I knew the numbers the couple of days before taking it out were a little longer than when I first put it in, but I attributed that to the weather being warmer now (+20-30F). Maybe the computer has just backed the power down over time, and the reset caused the power to come back this morning even without the chip there. I have no friggin' idea.

I'm going to get more numbers after putting the OE intake back on, then reinstall the Cobb intake and get more numbers. Then I'll reinstall the chip and run some more numbers. If the freshly reset computer with ProECM doesn't get the best numbers out of the bunch, I'll post and admit it.

I'll leave it in regardless, because it does have consistent low end (NEVER bogs) and it eliminated a problem I had with "bucking" after running hard and then cruising. --Explanation - the car would take VERY little pedal (barely touching it) to maintain speed after running hard and switching to cruising mode. This would cause me (or the cruise control) to let off the gas periodically. When I did that, the car would suddenly decelerate like the engine had cut off, then when I gave it gas again, would buck a couple of times and go. This would happen for a couple of minutes after I had simply run the car up to redline in 2nd and 3rd coming out of a turn and slowed down to drive the speed limit. It was very annoying, obviously. Never happened with the chip installed, and it happened at least once a week without it.

Later,

Fred
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Old 06-06-2002, 03:07 PM   #20
Fred
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Default latest update

I took off the Cobb intake and went back to the OE intake system yesterday. Now the only power mod is the Stromung muffler. More acceleration tests this morning - results:

5 - 60 mph = 7.8 sec. (7.9 sec. midday)
2k - 6k in 2nd = 4.7 sec.
40 - 60 mph in 3rd = 6.4 - 6.5 sec.

These times are practically identical to the results with the Cobb intake, and are better than with the ProECM + intake.

There is plenty of torque to just jump up and go - feels as strong from idle to 3000 rpm as with the ProECM + Cobb intake. No hesitation at all. I guess all the Cobb intake did was take a little low end power and move it up to the top of the curve, which makes you faster when you're up there and slower when you're starting from low rpm.

It doesn't FEEL as fast now as with the ProECM/ Cobb stuff on the car. Before, there was a strong surge in the power starting at around 3500 rpm - could feel it push me back in the seat a little harder. Now, it just revs at an even pace all the way to 5500 rpm, where it starts falling off (just like before) - no surge anywhere. The difference is noticeable to passengers, too. I guess maybe there is now more power down low and less up high, so it feels constant.

I was never able to get a 0-60 time under 8 seconds before I installed the ProECM. I have no idea how I'm doing this now. Maybe after I reinstall the intake and chip, I'll be running under 7 sec...

Wednesday: The car is getting slower now, especially when it's really hot outside (and under the hood). 5-60 mph is up to 8.4 now. It feels really weak, like it's struggling to suck in enough air to breathe, and it's bogged a couple of times when I hit it at low rpm. Also did the bucking thing once, when creeping along in traffic (jerks hard like you're tapping the gas on/off; had forgotten how annoying this was). Going to reinstall the Cobb intake tonight and check it out tomorrow.

Thursday: Okay, the intake is back on now, and it feels stronger in the whole rev range. The acceleration times are pretty much the same as at the top of this post, before the car got sluggish. Planning to reinstall the ProECM tonight or tomorrow; more times will be run on the way home.

More to come,

Fred
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Old 06-06-2002, 03:09 PM   #21
Fred
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just wanted to add for those who might wonder - I'm resetting the ECM each time I change something here... and that's why it sucks at first, then gets much quicker the next morning.

Fred
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Old 06-07-2002, 06:56 PM   #22
Fred
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Okay, yesterday afternoon I reinstalled the ProECM, so I have Cobb intake, ProECM and Stromung muffler on the car. Drove around last night a little, but didn't bother timing it; saved that for today. Well, here are the results:

5-60 = same as with just the muffler
2k-6k in 2nd = 4.5 sec ( which is 0.2 sec quicker than with just muffler)
40-70 in 3rd = same as with just the muffler

Well, there they are. I don't like 'em any better than anybody else, but I do believe that the setup now is better than stock, and here are my reasons. Runs a lot smoother - I don't get the bucking (mentioned above), it doesn't get slow as Hell when the engine bay gets hot as Hell, and it sounds great (which may contribute some to the feeling that it's pulling harder ).

I must also point out that I felt the sluggishness with the current setup that I felt this week with the stock intake and no ProECM, when it first started getting hot this year. But I wrapped the intake from the TB to the fender with some RV insulation I got at Lowe's, and the hesitation went away.

This car is a big change power-wise from the Prelude I had; about a 20% drop in horsepower and torque, and the Prelude's power was the same from day-to-day. With this car, I can cruise on the Interstate for a couple hundred miles, and it enters gas-saving mode or something, so that when I try to pull out of the gas station after a fill-up, it feels like my wife's Honda Civic LX (11.5 sec 0-60 ). In other words, 1st gear feels like 2nd.

Well, I hope this post helps somebody, because all it did for me was confuse me and take up a lot of my time...

Fred
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Old 08-11-2003, 09:34 PM   #23
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Thumbs up Chip...

Okay, I just have to weigh in on the whole chip debate. I have the Scoobyracing TQ chip, which is more or less the same thing as the PROECM. Now, I've heard a lot from people who have said that the chip does nothing. First and foremost, I think it very HIGHLY likely that they installed it wrong, because it is REALLY easy to do (trust me on this... EVIL instructions). Also, to all the MAP boys, the bad news is this.. You wont see as much of a diff as those of us running MAF. This is because the knock sensor on the older motors was more aggressive as a consequence the timing was retarded (hehe) further. On my car, once I actually wired the chip in right and it had learned the car, it was a whole new ballgame. Every mod I had ever done came alive. However, the good news to everybody as I understand it is this... The stock subaru motor tends to run rich high into the rpms, which hampers performance (and mileage). These puppies sort that out for us in a very nice way. Above 4k, the car pulls like crazy . Granted, as has been said before, your first take wont be that much better, or maybe worse due to relearning and the fact that you cant keep your foot out of it, but after that the mileage is surprisingly better, as the engine isn't wasting fuel like it used to. Withoust a doubt in my mind, this mod has made more difference than ANY other mod I have done, and is an absolute must unless you are getting a programable unit or SAFC.
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Old 08-11-2003, 09:40 PM   #24
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Default One more thing...

One note.. on the later cars with the more picky ECU's (this might be your prob, Fred..) the ECU will eventually learn its way around the chip, and a reset will be required. I know the '02 RS has an ECU that can learn its way around SAFC's and chips and what-not. I believe this may also be a factor on the '01 cars as well. I vaguely recall this from somebody, but as I have a '98, I pay little attention beyond my own problems
Cheers..
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Old 08-11-2003, 09:48 PM   #25
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Lightbulb ATTN: Fred

And while I'm at it.. the ECU collects engine data on the 1st 5 starts and drives after a reset. While the chip does help it to relearn faster, it does take time for it to take effect. You will be unlikely to feel the car get back to normal until several days after a reset. Also, temp is a HUGE power factor. My car has been feeling rather gutless in afternoon heat after being a monster in the early morning. Popping the hood vents does help some, though with a COBB intake, you wont be sucking anywhere NEAR as much engine compartment air as other intakes, but the piping itself will still heat unless you insulate it. You can go Maguyver on it and wrap the piping like on the Ganzflow and it should be quite helpfull with the COBB back in place and vents open. Just a thought...
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