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Old 07-26-2008, 02:49 PM   #1
wimprezawrx
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Default WRC inlet system..

Hi Guy's,

For my WRC S7 replica front, I also need a WRC style front mounted intercooler in the upper grill.
That won’t bee a problem, because I have the WRC hood with a special space under the bonnet!





Also I want my air box and filter under the bonnet scoop for cold air intake (like WRC)




To do so, I also need a reverse manifold system.
Every thing for that is taken care off… (I hope)
(Existing off: Alternator bracket, rolls for alt/drive belt and Alternator adjustment bracket.)

But here's my question :wonder: :

Where can I place the MAF or MAP sensor,

Option: A
In front of the Turbo??
Option: B
In front of the manifold / throttle position sensor??

Second question is,
Where is the best place for my HKS –BOV,

Option: 1
In front of the intercooler??
Option: 2
After the intercooler??

I’ve made a drawing of my plan, to make it simpler to see…what I am talking about!

Any idea’s and up-building comments are welcome, want to do it right the first time…




Click on the picture for bigger ...

If you didn't now but this is the car



Thanks guy’s …

Cheers, Willem.
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Old 08-09-2008, 11:55 AM   #2
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come on guy's , can anybody help me with some idears

I am not the first I recan?

Last edited by wimprezawrx; 08-10-2008 at 05:52 AM.
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Old 08-09-2008, 12:37 PM   #3
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from what i have read in the past, you need the maf to be in the intake unless you are running speed density. if your doing that you need it the the ic piping. as far as the bov you want it as closest to the tb as passable.
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Old 08-09-2008, 12:43 PM   #4
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Like this?
and what does this mean:
running speed density

Last edited by wimprezawrx; 08-10-2008 at 05:53 AM.
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Old 08-09-2008, 08:36 PM   #5
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I believe the airbox setup in this picture was just for show and never made it into production. I would scrap that idea.

http://www.mijnalbum.nl/GroteFoto-8SHXYLMS.jpg
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Old 08-10-2008, 05:44 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MJU1983 View Post
I believe the airbox setup in this picture was just for show and never made it into production. I would scrap that idea.


What do you mean?
This is a picture of the 2007 WRC car...


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Old 08-10-2008, 09:47 AM   #7
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I think you are looking at a different setup between pics 1, and pics 2&3.
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Old 08-10-2008, 11:47 AM   #8
wimprezawrx
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MartinSTi05 View Post
I think you are looking at a different setup between pics 1, and pics 2&3.
Talking about the same air filter set up, or not?

In this 2004 WRC S10:


Last edited by wimprezawrx; 08-10-2008 at 01:06 PM.
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Old 08-10-2008, 03:15 PM   #9
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Old 08-10-2008, 05:16 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wrx_driver_2002 View Post
Yes?????

Why do you give rodney's internet site???

Just what answer on my question......
Where can I place the MAF or MAP sensor,
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Old 08-10-2008, 06:23 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wimprezawrx View Post
Yes?????

Why do you give rodney's internet site???

Just what answer on my question......
Where can I place the MAF or MAP sensor,
Well, we really have no idea what you are looking for and can't really answer your question without A: Your current setup, B: Your goals

With the MAF sensor do you want (or need) to run a blow through setup or not? Do you want (or need) to run a MAP based system. The answer to those questions will answer your question.

With the by-pass valve you want it as close to the throttle body as is humanly possible.
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Old 08-11-2008, 12:23 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wimprezawrx View Post
Yes?????

Why do you give rodney's internet site???

Just what answer on my question......
Where can I place the MAF or MAP sensor,
i all ready told you . look at my last post? subaru uses a maf. if you are not running speed density then keep the maf in the intake with the same size tubing the stock intake is.
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Old 08-11-2008, 12:39 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fobiawrx View Post
i all ready told you . look at my last post? subaru uses a maf. if you are not running speed density then keep the maf in the intake with the same size tubing the stock intake is.
Yes i now, i allready asked you in nr4 post

But i am going for a Blow thru type of Maf...

What will be the best setup, look at the second drawing that i made...
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Old 08-11-2008, 02:13 PM   #14
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If you are going to run a MAF setup post turbo, the blow off valve needs to be before the MAF. Other wise you run rich anytime the valve opens to atmostphere because that air was already measured by the MAF and the ecu thinks that air will be burned in the combustion process. Does that make sense?
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Old 08-11-2008, 02:17 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wittmer25 View Post
If you are going to run a MAF setup post turbo, the blow off valve needs to be before the MAF. Other wise you run rich anytime the valve opens to atmostphere because that air was already measured by the MAF and the ecu thinks that air will be burned in the combustion process. Does that make sense?
That makes sense, like this...




Do i have to tune the engine again, or will the maf read the same data?
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Old 08-11-2008, 04:23 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wimprezawrx View Post
That makes sense, like this...




Do i have to tune the engine again, or will the maf read the same data?

Swap the BOV option 2 with the MAF so that the Maf is closer to the Throttle body. You will have to tweak the stock ecu intake temp. compensation tables and the MAF scaling will have to be rescaled unless the MAF sits in the same size tubing as the stock Intake diameter, but it will still need to be tweaked some. If you are going to this much trouble, you will probably want to tweak alot of the tables to make more power such as your fuel, timing, and boost maps. This is actually a really big change compared to just bolting on a bigger, stock location turbo.

Edit: lol, I am an idiot, the MAF is closer to the TB in option 2. Do it like that, haha.

Last edited by wittmer25; 08-12-2008 at 07:11 PM. Reason: I am an idiot.
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Old 08-13-2008, 03:59 PM   #17
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Also I want my air box and filter under the bonnet scoop for cold air intake (like WRC)




Did anyone else notce the angle on that turbo. How does that work?
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Old 08-13-2008, 04:01 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 2.5iSTI View Post
Also I want my air box and filter under the bonnet scoop for cold air intake (like WRC)




Did anyone else notce the angle on that turbo. How does that work?
Dry sump oiling system + frequent servicing / replacement of the unit.
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Old 08-13-2008, 05:47 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hondaslayer View Post
Dry sump oiling system + frequent servicing / replacement of the unit.
ding ding ding...when you have vacuum pulling the air from the turbo, you don't have to worry too much about it puddling in the chra...that and those turbo's don't live long anyway.
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Old 08-13-2008, 05:53 PM   #20
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It may have a vacuum pump on the crankcase and/or turbo drain line. A normal journal bearing turbo will not drain oil due to gravity very well at that angle. Its probably a ball bearing turbo so it doesnt need as much oil. In this case, it will probably have an oil restrictor fitting inline reducing the amount of oil it has to drain. I would bet on the dry sump system since its a race car and I think I see a pump in one of the pictures.
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Old 08-22-2008, 12:28 PM   #21
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do you like your car to LOOK like a WRC or do you like your car to PERFORM & DRIVE like a WRC ?

that's a very simple question; however, the answer makes a big difference...........

since I see TD04/05 in your sketch indicating you still drive yr std td04..........you really don't need any of this WRC lookalike mods for performance issues so why bother about the location of your MAF in the first place ?

to answer your question, option 2 (closes to your butterfly valve) is the most exact and precise location to measure MAF AND inlet temperature, and yes, you do have to tune again, and NO, as far as I know knobody has done this MAF-mod before (in the Neherlands), cause at the time these mods do make a difference, the most logic move would be to install a stand alone ECU an get rid of the f*cking MAF sensor and swap to a MAP sensor............

E
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Old 08-22-2008, 12:38 PM   #22
wimprezawrx
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dutch Devotion View Post
do you like your car to LOOK like a WRC or do you like your car to PERFORM & DRIVE like a WRC ?

that's a very simple question; however, the answer makes a big difference...........

since I see TD04/05 in your sketch indicating you still drive yr std td04..........you really don't need any of this WRC lookalike mods for performance issues so why bother about the location of your MAF in the first place ?

to answer your question, option 2 (closes to your butterfly valve) is the most exact and precise location to measure MAF AND inlet temperature, and yes, you do have to tune again, and NO, as far as I know knobody has done this MAF-mod before (in the Neherlands), cause at the time these mods do make a difference, the most logic move would be to install a stand alone ECU an get rid of the f*cking MAF sensor and swap to a MAP sensor............

E
Je kan gewoon in nederlands schrijven hoor... Eric.
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Old 08-23-2008, 07:10 AM   #23
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Sorry guys

[Nederlands]
Ja Wim maar dan begrijpen die lullo's hier er niets van en ik vindt de antwoorden nogal onder de maat, je komt weinig verder zo denk ik.........................

Denk wel dat het een hele essentiele vraag is die je je moet afstellen
Moet hij eruit zien als een WRC, of moet hij rijden/performen als een WRC

Wat zijn je plannen, ik ben best wel heel erg benieuwd, wat ik op de NL fora lees ben je *nogal* een pietje precies en dus in dat klader DE persoon om een wagen te bouwen die performed als een WRC !
[/Nederlands]

So what about that ?

E
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Old 08-23-2008, 09:43 PM   #24
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Need a WRC intake manifold? I have one for sale.
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Old 08-24-2008, 04:10 AM   #25
wimprezawrx
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dutch Devotion View Post
do you like your car to LOOK like a WRC or do you like your car to PERFORM & DRIVE like a WRC ?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dutch Devotion View Post

that's a very simple question; however, the answer makes a big difference...........

since I see TD04/05 in your sketch indicating you still drive yr std td04..........you really don't need any of this WRC lookalike mods for performance issues so why bother about the location of your MAF in the first place ?

to answer your question, option 2 (closes to your butterfly valve) is the most exact and precise location to measure MAF AND inlet temperature, and yes, you do have to tune again, and NO, as far as I know knobody has done this MAF-mod before (in the Neherlands), cause at the time these mods do make a difference, the most logic move would be to install a stand alone ECU an get rid of the f*cking MAF sensor and swap to a MAP sensor............

E
Je hebt gelijk...

Off course I want the performance of the WRC car, but come on, I now that if I do everything according to the book,
it still will be a street car , and never will it be a true WRC …

But because I have the WRC S7 replica nose on the car, I would like the WRC (style) intercooler in the top grille, I think that’s still missing…
To do that, I would like that idea to pull thru in to the engine bay, so I need to do the piping and keep it as short as possible and here again came up with the idea to keep it in the WRC “style” and reverse the inlet manifold, alternator re-place, air filter box.

Then I came up with the idea to put the MAF in to one of the intercooler pipes, because I want to keep the TD04/TD05? on the stock position, but then saw that I don’t have many space to connect the turbo to the air filter box on top of the engine (oem intercooler space)…

Also have many parts waiting for assembly to give some more power, Walbro 255ltr, 550(pink STI) injectors, Aeromotive FPR and Fuel rails, Tial 38mm External Wastegate, light weight pulleys, brackets to replace alternator, TD05?
etc etc…

And you now me , everything has to be perfect....

To answer you question:
I guess I will go for the looks and if (all) these mods will bring some gain of engine power,
performance and driveability that will be noticeable, I wont mind that at all…

Thanks,
W
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