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Old 07-27-2008, 02:05 AM   #1
Jcrite8987
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Default Hella Supertones help.

I know i know... i have searched and alot came up but nothing that helped me.

I have my supertones relay all hooked up and all the connections are correct. I have the horns grounded off onto the body and the old stock horn wires merged into a y harness which then connects to the relay. Now when i go to use the horns nothing happens just the relay is clicking loudly.

Is that right?? should it be clicking??

is there something i overlooked?

Thanks guys.
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Old 07-27-2008, 09:32 AM   #2
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Yea it should be clicking but whether you hooked it up right i cant help you. Use paint and draw a wiring diagram of what you did.
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Old 07-27-2008, 09:42 AM   #3
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Ground them off the batt, or reground off the body and when you expose the metal surface make sure you scratch off the paint with a razor blade
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Old 07-27-2008, 12:01 PM   #4
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i didnt even use the relay when i hooked mine up. just used the stock horn wires then grounds to the body right by the grill. they work just fine
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Old 07-27-2008, 12:06 PM   #5
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I had this happen with mine after a year of perfect operation. Something went wrong at the circtuit board INSIDE the fuse block, so I found the incoming wire (Blue/red) and the outgoing wire to the horn (black/blue stripe) and tied the relay in, and added a small ATC inline fuse for good measure.
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Old 07-27-2008, 12:50 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pauli18c View Post
i didnt even use the relay when i hooked mine up. just used the stock horn wires then grounds to the body right by the grill. they work just fine

Finally.

Read the post above this one on the same topic.

Why add a relay to the most basic wiring system on the car to only further complicate it and add a failure point in the system?

The relay does what? Anyone want to show me the benefit of the relay that I can't shoot down immediately? Does anyone read the instructions or just see the pictures and think, "Hey, that looks overly complicated. Better do it that way."

You already have two horn wires, why not use those? They are 12v, just like....the relay.

FTLOFG people, it's a horn. A 12v horn. Just like the stock 12v horns but louder. Plug them into the stock wires, run a ground and stop this.

/Brox
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Old 07-27-2008, 12:55 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Broxma View Post
Finally.

Read the post above this one on the same topic.

Why add a relay to the most basic wiring system on the car to only further complicate it and add a failure point in the system?

The relay does what? Anyone want to show me the benefit of the relay that I can't shoot down immediately? Does anyone read the instructions or just see the pictures and think, "Hey, that looks overly complicated. Better do it that way."

You already have two horn wires, why not use those? They are 12v, just like....the relay.

FTLOFG people, it's a horn. A 12v horn. Just like the stock 12v horns but louder. Plug them into the stock wires, run a ground and stop this.

/Brox

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Old 07-27-2008, 12:56 PM   #8
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Brox you need a drink, relax homie



I agree with you completely, but at the same time you can never be TOO thorough, of course that's assuming that you know what you're doing. I added a relay to mine, but only because I was entirely bypassing the factory relay and fuse. Then again, that's what I do for a living, it's not anything foreign or complicated.
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Old 07-27-2008, 03:10 PM   #9
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ok here is the circut.



imma go try and ground them off to the battery now and see how that works.
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Old 07-27-2008, 03:13 PM   #10
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Make sure you have a fuse in your inline fuse cable, I had the same issue, then realized I forgot to put a fuse in. Goodluck
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Old 07-27-2008, 03:23 PM   #11
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YOU DO NOT NEED TO GROUND TO THE BATTERY!!!!

That's way overkill, you're making this more complicated than it needs to be.
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Old 07-27-2008, 03:47 PM   #12
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well it still didnt work. I have a fuse in the fuse holder.

Im not sure where to look next. I wanna run the relay so stop trying to tell me i dont have to. I would like to have it wired up with the relay so i can tap another set of hellas into it later on.
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Old 07-27-2008, 04:22 PM   #13
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Post #5 has your solution
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Old 07-27-2008, 04:25 PM   #14
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I thought you were supposed to run the relay because the Hella's draw more power than the stock horns.
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Old 07-27-2008, 04:28 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Audiosavvy View Post
I had this happen with mine after a year of perfect operation. Something went wrong at the circtuit board INSIDE the fuse block, so I found the incoming wire (Blue/red) and the outgoing wire to the horn (black/blue stripe) and tied the relay in, and added a small ATC inline fuse for good measure.
so what exactly are you saying then? lol
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Old 07-27-2008, 05:09 PM   #16
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I'm saying that your problem MAY be with the board in the fuse block, not something you want to f with. The wire coming from the interior to the fuse block under the hood is red/blue stripe (your trigger wire). The outgoing wire to the horns from the fuse block is black/blue stripe. All you need is a constant 12v to tie into for a new relay, add an inline-fuse between the constant and the relay, and your problem will be solved.

If the relay is clicking, that means it's receiving a trigger to that point, and the problem is either A. The relay itself (pretty unlikely) or B. Something after that point, and in my case it was the circuit board itself. So if you bypass both of those, you'll be golden.
Does that make more sense?

You could also use a test-light to see if you're getting anything past the fuse block, but I'm willing to bet you're not.
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Old 07-28-2008, 11:58 PM   #17
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Audiosavy,

i sent you a pm btw
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Old 07-29-2008, 12:41 AM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Broxma View Post
The relay does what? Anyone want to show me the benefit of the relay that I can't shoot down immediately? Does anyone read the instructions or just see the pictures and think, "Hey, that looks overly complicated. Better do it that way."
The stock wiring is insufficient to supply the 18 amps that the Supertones draw without significant voltage drop. Reduced voltage makes the horns quieter. By using a relay, and large-gauge wire for both the power and ground sides, you ensure that the horns see the full voltage the alternator is producing at the maximum current draw.

I've had the opportunity to hear two cars with Supertones side by side. One car had them on the stock wiring. One car had them fed by a relay triggered by the stock wiring with ground wires run from the Supertones back to the battery. The car with the "needlessly complicated" wiring was significantly louder than the car using only the stock wiring.

So, the reason to use the extra wiring and relay is to get what you paid for. The Supertones on stock wiring are barely louder than stock. The Supertones on correct wiring are really damned loud.
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Old 07-29-2008, 12:59 AM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jcrite8987 View Post
Audiosavy,

i sent you a pm btw


You has repliez
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Old 07-29-2008, 01:06 AM   #20
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Originally Posted by williaty View Post
The stock wiring is insufficient to supply the 18 amps that the Supertones draw without significant voltage drop. Reduced voltage makes the horns quieter. By using a relay, and large-gauge wire for both the power and ground sides, you ensure that the horns see the full voltage the alternator is producing at the maximum current draw.

I've had the opportunity to hear two cars with Supertones side by side. One car had them on the stock wiring. One car had them fed by a relay triggered by the stock wiring with ground wires run from the Supertones back to the battery. The car with the "needlessly complicated" wiring was significantly louder than the car using only the stock wiring.

So, the reason to use the extra wiring and relay is to get what you paid for. The Supertones on stock wiring are barely louder than stock. The Supertones on correct wiring are really damned loud.
Yesssss * Fist pump*
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Old 07-29-2008, 01:11 AM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by williaty View Post

I've had the opportunity to hear two cars with Supertones side by side. One car had them on the stock wiring. One car had them fed by a relay triggered by the stock wiring with ground wires run from the Supertones back to the battery. The car with the "needlessly complicated" wiring was significantly louder than the car using only the stock wiring.

So, the reason to use the extra wiring and relay is to get what you paid for. The Supertones on stock wiring are barely louder than stock. The Supertones on correct wiring are really damned loud.

I declare shenanigans.

I had them on STOCK wiring. I now have them with their own relay and wiring, as described in one of my posts (this thread or the other one about Hellas).

The Hellas on stock wiring are much much louder than stock, comically loud really. The Hellas on the NEW wiring are not at all noticeably louder than with the stock wiring, and if there's anything I trust it's my ears, it's how I make my living . Where have you seen that they draw 18amps? At what voltage? A car does NOT run at 12v contrary to popular belief, it's more like 13.4-13.7. And a wire's ability to carry a certain amount of amperage is dependent on the length of said wire, in this case less than 4 feet, and the higher the voltage, the wire can be even smaller.

So either you're completely full of it, or the car you heard had some poor connections when using stock wiring (good indication of a poor install), or my car has an abnormally sweet stock electrical system.

Last edited by Audiosavvy; 07-29-2008 at 01:16 AM.
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Old 07-29-2008, 01:20 AM   #22
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Originally Posted by Audiosavvy View Post
The Hellas on stock wiring are much much louder than stock, comically loud really. The Hellas on the NEW wiring are not at all noticeably louder than with the stock wiring, and if there's anything I trust it's my ears, it's how I make my living .
No idea what to tell you other than this was my experience. Additionally, 2 people how have Supertones on stock wiring have commented about mine being louder.

What gauge are you running the horns off of? Individual power and ground wires for each horn?


[quuote]Where have you seen that they draw 18amps?[/quote]
Hella states they draw 18A@13.8V.

Quote:
the car you heard had some poor connections when using stock wiring
A decent possibility given the fact that I trust no one's wiring other than my own. However, that doesnt explain the other two guys who commented (though I never heard those cars myself).
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Old 07-29-2008, 02:24 AM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by williaty View Post
Hella states they draw 18A@13.8V.


A decent possibility given the fact that I trust no one's wiring other than my own. However, that doesnt explain the other two guys who commented (though I never heard those cars myself).

Thanks, my lazy ass didn't bother to check. I will say, that's a stout amount of amperage going through the haggard 18/20ga wire, even if for such a short distance.

I know how you feel about the wiring, I'm the same way. Even when it looks good on the outside, every day at work I see what the customer never GETS to see, and there's a lot of scary stuff often behind the scenes. It's sad, but true.

Oh you asked what size wire I run. I have 14/16awg. It's good multi-strand wire, not some of that cheap 4-strand stuff that's more like chicken wire , but nothing special. Both grounds combined are less than 10", from each horn to a central grounding point behind the grilll. The paint is brushed away to make solid contact. The relay is directly beneath the factory fuse block under the hood. I used the existing trigger, and it is just that, a trigger.
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Old 07-29-2008, 02:29 AM   #24
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Slightly different than what I did. 10GA from the alt to my (self-created) auxiliary electrical panel. 30A, dual-87 diode-protected relay. Individual run of 12GA stranded from each 87 pin to the respective horn. 12GA individual run from each horn back to the ground collection on my aux panel. 10GA back from the aux ground connection to the case of the alt. Obviously, fused where necessary.
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