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Old 08-18-2008, 04:43 PM   #26
master c
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awesome - i assume sb1 is the sensor you tried for coolant?? let us know what sensor is best matched
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Old 08-18-2008, 08:06 PM   #27
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You are correct sir. I will post my findings.
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Old 08-18-2008, 09:49 PM   #28
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OK, problem. I got in my car to head home today and loaded the slightly edited file to the EMU and now my fans don't come on and the map trace didn't move on my IJ map at all. the other maps trace but IJ does nothing. When I had the AFR target map activated all it did was put 100 in the first cell. WTF. I hope this is just some stupid setting I inadvertently changed, Any thoughts?
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Old 08-18-2008, 11:52 PM   #29
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This is awesome guys, iv been lookin for somthin from other cars like us to use this set up. I have an 03 with FAT system, an i actually work for Robert, an have tryin to figure out how to tune the car without the VC2 and the boost/retard box.
I see you guys usin the EMU and wonder why you still need the vc2, shouldnt the EMU be able to alter the signal to just about anything you want, also there should be no use of an FMU in the car if your able to tune the injectors.
You guys need to give me some reasoning for the use of the fmu and vc2.
Also the EMU is a piggyback/standalone, ive read a little bit about it but didnt really give me a clear answer on what it wants to be when it grows up.
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Old 08-19-2008, 12:17 AM   #30
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Hey, what's going on? This is Ron, I have the Dark blue 01 RS and do the decals for Robert.

I have eliminated the FMU and VC2, I just did things in stages as a precaution to make sure things would work, and if not the car was still drivable. Now that I have Sti injectors, there is no way the FMU would work. As you can see by our posts, this is still a work in progress, and I'd be happy to share anything I learn along the way. When it's dialed in, I plan to swing by the shop so you guys can check it out.
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Old 08-19-2008, 12:26 PM   #31
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OK, well it seems my water temp voltage was getting skewed going to my ecu. I looked with my scan tool last night and the car was showing 75C and I looked at the temp gauge on the dash and the needle was 3/4 instead of just below half. So I turned on heater and AC to get the fans to come on. THis morning, I cut the water temp wire and the readings returned to normal on my scan tool and the fans kicked on just above 95C like they always do.

I would like to hook it back up and see if the different sensors produce better results, but I had to make the car drivable to get to work.

As for the IJ map not working, in all my messing around with maps from different sources, I think the dip switch settings got altered so I was running 2 IGN maps. Awesome. This clicked in my head when I got in to work, so I will go out and verify this later. I hope that is the problem, but I will feel like an idiot if it is.
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Old 08-19-2008, 02:40 PM   #32
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so yeah, I'm an idiot. I switched my dip switches around and what do you know, IJ map works now... I look forward to more than 30% throttle at -10inhg on my drive home.

I updated my wiring notes post and the the pinout images I linked to. real photos coming soon.
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Old 08-19-2008, 04:14 PM   #33
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haha yeah the dip switches 1 and 2 should be ij and timing - i used to run the vc2 and timing controller from split second with a fmu and then sold it on rs25.com after i got the emu in. there is no need for anything else but the emu. as long as you have a few sources to monitor engine temps it should be easy to find what sensor settings work in the emu parameters. im wondering what morrocco used for his water temp parameter setting????
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Old 08-19-2008, 04:15 PM   #34
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i checked the map that morrocco sent me and he used SB_WT-1 just as you tried already. wonder why its not working??
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Old 08-19-2008, 05:47 PM   #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by #522 View Post
OK, well it seems my water temp voltage was getting skewed going to my ecu. I looked with my scan tool last night and the car was showing 75C and I looked at the temp gauge on the dash and the needle was 3/4 instead of just below half. So I turned on heater and AC to get the fans to come on. THis morning, I cut the water temp wire and the readings returned to normal on my scan tool and the fans kicked on just above 95C like they always do.

I would like to hook it back up and see if the different sensors produce better results, but I had to make the car drivable to get to work.

As for the IJ map not working, in all my messing around with maps from different sources, I think the dip switch settings got altered so I was running 2 IGN maps. Awesome. This clicked in my head when I got in to work, so I will go out and verify this later. I hope that is the problem, but I will feel like an idiot if it is.
no surprise there on it skewing voltages..greddy really needs to address this because i had a similar problem w/ my TPS sensor.
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Old 08-19-2008, 07:14 PM   #36
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Yes. When setting the jumpers on the EMU, JP13 can be OPEN or 1-2 (Pull-up). I looked up some info of what a "pull up" connection is:

Some disadvantages of pull-up resistors are the extra power consumed when current is drawn through the resistor, and the reduced speed of a pull-up compared to an active current source.

So it seems like it can have the tendency to bleed off power, which is why my ecu thought my car was running at 73C not 95C. The other option is OPEN, but I don't know if the EMU will see anything at all with the open connection. Bummer. I wonder if switching the sensor type in the parameters would even matter?
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Old 08-19-2008, 09:24 PM   #37
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i havent been really keeping too up to date with the EMU stuff but IIRC isnt the water temp sensor only for auto tune?

when i get my EMU I will probably just hook up the ignition and fueling harness. if only the blue could just dial back injectors (via idc) id be made in the shade..
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Old 08-19-2008, 10:31 PM   #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mxpunk View Post
i havent been really keeping too up to date with the EMU stuff but IIRC isnt the water temp sensor only for auto tune?

when i get my EMU I will probably just hook up the ignition and fueling harness. if only the blue could just dial back injectors (via idc) id be made in the shade..
The water temp is to comp warm up injection for larger injectors. I never had it work correctly the EMU doesn't have enough input impedance so it changes the ecu's readings. I noted that on something I sent out and it ended up floating around the net.
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Old 08-19-2008, 11:45 PM   #39
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Hey ron, i thought i noticed the car but you know we get quite a few around the shop. But yes please stop by the shop, i would love to see what your doing with the EMU, i would also like to get know the software. Like i see you guys tryin to get the ECT sensor reading correctly, i dont know what the problem is so i really cant help. But i am glad you guys got rid of the VC2 and blackbox, its only more things that can break.
I will keep up on this thread and try to help you out if you guys have any problems but it seems you guys have a pretty good handle on things.
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Old 08-20-2008, 12:49 PM   #40
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Cool, once I get things dialed in and I get some time, I will stop by, tell Robert I said hi.

Brydon, I remember reading some info from you about that, but thought maybe they fixed it with newer units since some others have gotten it to work right. But now I know, not so much. My unit is Rev C. I will note that on my posts near the beginning of this thread.
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Old 08-22-2008, 07:42 PM   #41
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A few pics:
Engine bay showing my Stock Map sensor and throttle body in place on the EJ20G Motor.



Yellow tops hiding in there amongst all the dirt and grime...



Where I put my Greddy Map sensor on the firewall. The wire runs down by the brake booster and through a grommet that enters the cabin just above the pedals.

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Old 08-28-2008, 11:28 AM   #42
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your setup looks clean!! lookin good! i just got back to my car so now i can get workin on it - ej257 internals are going in when my extemepsi order comes in!
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Old 08-28-2008, 07:08 PM   #43
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Cool, thanks. I can only take credit for a little under the hood and the wiring, FAT did all the hard stuff. I look forward to more posts from your perspective on tuning etc.

A little update on my actual tuning.
I originally used the injector scaling to pull the injectors back. I used 280 and 520.
Then, I thought I would try the other way and pull them back on the I/J map. So I have -41 (+/- wherever needed to keep fuel trims close to zero) in the closed loop area then it transitions into more fuel as I go into boost. The car is running 15 psi right now and I am still fine tuning things. I have a few rich spots in the higher boost areas in the 4-6k rpm range, and a few lean spots in the lower rpm/higher boost areas.

Both of these methods work quite well. The car starts up fine, idles fine and drives really smooth. I may switch back to using the injector scaling simply because it's easier for me to see numbers that go from 0+ than negative numbers that switch to positive throughout the map. Once i tune those out, I may take it to the dyno for getting the timing dialed in for more power.

The only thing to keep in mind is the IJ adjustments max at 100%, so it is possible to reach that and still have plenty of injector left. That's why I went with putting negative numbers in originally, but now that I have gotten further into it, I doubt that will happen.
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Old 08-31-2008, 04:03 PM   #44
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About the water temp issues:
It seems to vary by car, but no matter what I do, when the EMU is connected to my factory water temp, it throws of my temp reading by about 30 deg. C. Not good.

So I was planning to use auto tune to tweak a few areas of my fueling map, so my pan is to see what voltage my water temp wire puts out when the car is warmed up, then just hook a 12v power source clamped to that voltage up to the emu water temp wire.
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Old 09-01-2008, 01:47 PM   #45
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i wonder if a water temp gauge temp probe would put out appropriate voltages??? then you could piggyback the signal to the emu from an aftermarket water temp gauge
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Old 09-01-2008, 06:47 PM   #46
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I was thinking the same thing. I know the factory sensor only puts out between 1 and 1.4v when the engine is warmed up. If an aftermarket sensor did the same, it would work. If not, one of the other sensor types could be selected. If that still didn't do the trick, I have a voltage clamp I just made that can dial it back into the subaru 1.4v. It's fully adjustable and made with about $11 in parts from radio shack.

My temp solution: I will tap another 12v source and dial it down to 1.2v with my home made clamp and send the 1.2v to the emu. It won't show me anything useful as far as water temp goes, but it allows me to activate the auto-tune until I get a water temp gauge. And, if it does work with other gauges, it could actually allow any EMU functionality based on water temp to be functional (fans, water spray etc).

The device works (I tested it with a meter) but I haven't hooked it to the emu yet. I need to run a wire to a power source (prob the power wire to one of my other gauges) and a ground.
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Old 09-01-2008, 11:49 PM   #47
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It works! I have a potentiometer on it and I can dial in the amount of voltage I want. I can get it to about 85C which is about 10 below full operating temp.

Now, I can activate the auto tune and I basically have a voltage regulator I can use on anything. I will make a parts list and take a few pics of it in a few days.
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Old 11-03-2008, 12:03 PM   #48
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A little update since it's been so long:

Injector scaling:
I have had the best/easiest to tune results by using the Injector scaling. On my car, I have 280 as the before/stock setting, and 520 as the after/modified setting. Not sure why I need it set at 520, the yellow tops are 440 I thought. Maybe my fuel pressure is a little higher than normal. I actually still have some negative numbers in injector map in the higher rpms, while in vacuum still.

Fuel trims:
See above for a starting point. I tried just doing it all in the injector map, but was too difficult. After a while, I had these odd large negative numbers in random spots. Another thing I noticed was I have had better results getting them close to zero, then leaving them alone for a few days. then checking and adjusting after watching them as I drive around for a while. I would see STFT of +10, and a LTFT of -6. Even holding at that particular spot wouldn't always make it balance out. It took a few drive cycles for it to finally get to STFT of around +4 and the LTFT would be 0.

So basically, don't constantly adjust them after you have gotten them in numbers that are less than 10% unless they get progressively worse. Hard to explain, so please ask for clarification if this isn't clear.

Rev limit cut:
It does work, and my car can happily run up to 7000RPM. I will post how I did it in detail later. Make sure your car is capable of running higher than stock RPM's.

That's it for now, but I am working on more detailed write ups and will post them and images of my maps and settings.

Last edited by #522; 11-03-2008 at 12:16 PM.
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Old 11-03-2008, 08:22 PM   #49
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Masterc....

what wires did you use to wire the EMU....just want to double check with mine before I make the solder plunge!
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Old 11-03-2008, 10:18 PM   #50
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Quote:
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Rev limit cut:
It does work, and my car can happily run up to 7000RPM. I will post how I did it in detail later. Make sure your car is capable of running higher than stock RPM's.
i thought the emu was unable to do this on our cars?

do you know something no one else does?
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